Did the light go on for Harris last night? | Page 11 | FinHeaven - Miami Dolphins Forums

Did the light go on for Harris last night?

Atila said:
I like your last question - measuring that defense by a more USEFUL measure... our scoring defense was 19th against... and considering how bad our talent/depth was, I would say it was our coaching (dare I say scheming?) that got us a result that most would agree is better than the talent (aka, we had 25-30th ranked defensive talent but managing 19th is a success).
Click to expand...

Ya I know that's the more meaningful way of measuring a D. I was just saying yardage wise. Dude, once again, I don't care if we run all 11 men on the line if it works. People that know more than me about schemes are talking about what a different scheme would do for our D. SOS seems to know a lot about our Defensive Scheme so why not listen? I know people will disagree about our talent level but I think barring injuries we have a solid roster. I wonder if we were in a different scheme, with the talent we have, if we'd have a better D all around. I think a D consisting of Suh, Wake, Timmons, Howard, Kiko, Reshad, Hayes, Branch, should be enough to be a top 15 D. It's just my opinion before anyone disagrees. I'm drained debating about our talent level on D lol I've seen worse D talent have better years ,so I have to ask myself, is it the scheme?
 
Harris needs to get stronger he gets swallowed up.
 
JakeemThe Dream said:
Ya I know that's the more meaningful way of measuring a D. I was just saying yardage wise. Dude, once again, I don't care if we run all 11 men on the line if it works. People that know more than me about schemes are talking about what a different scheme would do for our D. SOS seems to know a lot about our Defensive Scheme so why not listen? I know people will disagree about our talent level but I think barring injuries we have a solid roster. I wonder if we were in a different scheme, with the talent we have, if we'd have a better D all around. I think a D consisting of Suh, Wake, Timmons, Howard, Kiko, Reshad, Hayes, Branch, should be enough to be a top 15 D. It's just my opinion before anyone disagrees. I'm drained debating about our talent level on D lol I've seen worse D talent have better years ,so I have to ask myself, is it the scheme?
Click to expand...

I agree with everything you said - but how do we have an scheme issue when the team you're talking about was NOT the team we fielded last year? I don't know much about the intricacies of the scheme, where its strengths are, where it's flaws are... I do know there are going to be pros and cons with all of them, and the general sweeping statements made about any of them can be counteracted with personal tweaks... here is what I do know: we have one year of work under the scheme, and we overperformed defensively based on all considerations. I hope that wasn't all because of Vance Joseph, but my point is, what do you really have to bitch about from our defensive production last season based on the garbage players we fielded in the back 7? You really can't...
 
Bowzer said:
Name one defensive end not named Joey Bosa that was great in their first year. There is a learning curve. He looks fine to me.
Click to expand...

Aldon Smith, 37 tackles,14 sacks,2 forced fumbles, 4 pass defended,1 safety

Julius Peppers, defensive end, Carolina Panthers – 2002
35 total tackles,12 sacks,5 forced fumbles,1 interception,6 pass defended

Dwight Freeney, 41 tackles,13 sacks,9 forced fumbles...started 8 games

Simeon Rice, 12.5 sacks

Kamerion Wimbley, 11 sacks

Carlos Dunlap,9.5 sacks

Mark Anderson, 12 sacks,4 forced fumbles

Yannick Ngakoue, 8 sacks

Jevon Kearse, DE, Tennessee Titans, 1999
Regular-season stats: 14.5 sacks, eight forced fumbles, 16 games played (16 starts).

Reggie White, DE, Philadelphia Eagles, 1985
Regular-season stats: 13 sacks, 13 games played (12 starts).

Al "Bubba" Baker, DE, Detroit Lions, 1978
Regular-season stats: 23 sacks, 16 games played (16 starts).

Terrell Suggs- 12 sacks 6 FF 4 FR 1 INT 16 GP 0 starts, wasn't a LB till the next year, played only DE his rookie year and only on obvious passing downs.

And there are many more Defensive ends who had very good rookie seasons
 
Atila said:
I agree with everything you said - but how do we have an scheme issue when the team you're talking about was NOT the team we fielded last year? I don't know much about the intricacies of the scheme, where its strengths are, where it's flaws are... I do know there are going to be pros and cons with all of them, and the general sweeping statements made about any of them can be counteracted with personal tweaks... here is what I do know: we have one year of work under the scheme, and we overperformed defensively based on all considerations. I hope that wasn't all because of Vance Joseph, but my point is, what do you really have to ***** about from our defensive production last season based on the garbage players we fielded in the back 7? You really can't...
Click to expand...


Coaching, scheme, and strategy are everything in the NFL.



It's our scheme. It's definitely our shitty defensive scheme that is holding us back.
 
miamiron said:
Aldon Smith, 37 tackles,14 sacks,2 forced fumbles, 4 pass defended,1 safety

Julius Peppers, defensive end, Carolina Panthers – 2002
35 total tackles,12 sacks,5 forced fumbles,1 interception,6 pass defended

Dwight Freeney, 41 tackles,13 sacks,9 forced fumbles...started 8 games

Simeon Rice, 12.5 sacks

Kamerion Wimbley, 11 sacks

Carlos Dunlap,9.5 sacks

Mark Anderson, 12 sacks,4 forced fumbles

Yannick Ngakoue, 8 sacks

Jevon Kearse, DE, Tennessee Titans, 1999
Regular-season stats: 14.5 sacks, eight forced fumbles, 16 games played (16 starts).

Reggie White, DE, Philadelphia Eagles, 1985
Regular-season stats: 13 sacks, 13 games played (12 starts).

Al "Bubba" Baker, DE, Detroit Lions, 1978
Regular-season stats: 23 sacks, 16 games played (16 starts).

Terrell Suggs- 12 sacks 6 FF 4 FR 1 INT 16 GP 0 starts, wasn't a LB till the next year, played only DE his rookie year and only on obvious passing downs.

And there are many more Defensive ends who had very good rookie seasons
Click to expand...
I loved Al Bubba Baker - sacks were still unofficial then. Coy Bacon has 26 in 14 games in the '70s. 23 or 26 is just insane.
 
Sons Of Shula said:
Coaching, scheme, and strategy are everything in the NFL.



It's our scheme. It's definitely our ****ty defensive scheme that is holding us back.
Click to expand...


Yeah... but your post really did nothing here. My whole point was our defense overachieved last year all things considered. We have only one year with that unit and scheme to judge and last year would be a poor example to use as to why our scheme was holding us back.
 
Atila said:
Yeah... but your post really did nothing here. My whole point was our defense overachieved last year all things considered. We have only one year with that unit and scheme to judge and last year would be a poor example to use as to why our scheme was holding us back.
Click to expand...


This scheme has a strong 15 year history for evaluation and it's never done squat in the postseason.

Also, overachieving and allowing a franchise record for yardage while being at the bottom of the league for pts allowed doesn't mix.
 
Last edited:
Always Next Year said:
Don't get me wrong, Fred Taylor was a stud, I think he deserves to be in the HOF. Even with that being said, in that playoff game our defense made him look supernatural, broke so many tackles, ran by so many of our guys, it was really incredible to watch. Sad to watch actually, even sadder in retrospect knowing that was Danny boy's last game, was not his best effort.
Click to expand...

Fred was one of the Best RBs I've ever seen in my entire life, injury hindered him a lot and he still had a great career.
 
Sons Of Shula said:
This scheme has a strong 15 year history for evaluation and it's never done squat in the postseason.

Also, overachieving and allowing a franchise record for yardage while being at the bottom of the league for pts allowed doesn't mix.
Click to expand...

Again, as I said in my previous posts, every scheme will have flaws and general sweeping statements will make you look a bit foolish in usage. At the highest levels, you should operate under the assumption that EVERY scheme employed by EVERY coach is tweaked. They don't scheme out of a textbook. It's a philosophy more than exact cookie cut science - I'm sure you are aware and can appreciate that.

With that said, we can ONLY use the one year we employed it with OUR personnel and OUR coaches - we got great success, yardage be damned.

With the improved depth and personnel we have on defense this season, if we end up ranked 10-15th overall in points allowed but bottom 5 in yardage I will be happy and consider it a success just like I consider last season a success considering our personnel.

Sorry bud, I know you're very informed on this stuff, but I'm not interested to talk about the history of football... if you want to talk about this topic intelligently, then intelligence would suggest we use our own team, own personnel, own scheme, own results as our example. If we do that, we have just the one year sample size and it gave us a pleasant result.
 
Atila said:
Again, as I said in my previous posts, every scheme will have flaws and general sweeping statements will make you look a bit foolish in usage. At the highest levels, you should operate under the assumption that EVERY scheme employed by EVERY coach is tweaked. They don't scheme out of a textbook. It's a philosophy more than exact cookie cut science - I'm sure you are aware and can appreciate that.

With that said, we can ONLY use the one year we employed it with OUR personnel and OUR coaches - we got great success, yardage be damned.

With the improved depth and personnel we have on defense this season, if we end up ranked 10-15th overall in points allowed but bottom 5 in yardage I will be happy and consider it a success just like I consider last season a success considering our personnel.

Sorry bud, I know you're very informed on this stuff, but I'm not interested to talk about the history of football... if you want to talk about this topic intelligently, then intelligence would suggest we use our own team, own personnel, own scheme, own results as our example. If we do that, we have just the one year sample size and it gave us a pleasant result.
Click to expand...

horse-blinders1.jpg



There are other schemes that offer flexibility and versatility for game planning vs different types of offenses. Ours scheme is static.
 
Last edited:
Checking in again to see if the light came on yet for our #1 pick.
 
You must log in or register to reply here.
Back
Top Bottom