Dolphins Before Daunte! C-pep not a Winner!

[RenoFinFan]

I for one couldn't wait for the season to start. I had not been this optimistic since, well, since Marino. Miami was coming off a six game win streak. Saban adressed the team's weakest areas in the offseason. Saban added veteran depth. But most importantly Saban signed Daunte Culpepper. He was supposed to be the franchise QB we haven't had since "Dan the Man." Daunte came in as the 5th highest rated QB of all time. Higher career passer rating than Marino. And then there was his remarkable 2004 season. One of the greatest seasons ever by a QB. In fact, he had more total yards that season than any other QB in history breaking Dan's magical 1984 single season record. Daunte was reported to be well ahead of rehab and I kept reading reports about how good he looked in TC. I bought in to all the hype.

Everything was in place to challange NE for the division title and I actually had Super Bowl aspirations. Sure there were the occasional posts from disgruntled Viking fans that kept saying "Just wait. Daunte is not the QB you think he is. The stats lie. He makes poor decisions. He is not the 5th best QB of all-time like the ratings indicate. In fact, he is not even close to the top 5 QBs in the NFL right now. If it wasnt for #84 he would be a 2nd stringer at best right now." But you know what, I thought those posts were just from pissed-off Viking fans that were really loathing inside bc we "stole" Daunte for only a 2nd round pick.

Two games into the season I am saying WTF happened? This isn't the same QB who I used to see on ESPN throwing 60 yard bombs to #84 in Minnesota despite being double and sometimes triple covered. They looked like perfect passes. Uh oh...could those pissed-off, disgruntled, loathing Viking fans actually have been right. In fact, were they not really upset at all but snickering at us Dolphin fans?

So I decided to take a look at the numbers. No...not his personal stats. Those are impressive and have been posted many times on finheaven, but I wanted to see the stats that matter the most IMO...Wins and Losses. This is what I found for games Daunte has started:

2001 - 4 Wins 7 Losses
2002 - 6 Wins 10 Losses
2003 - 7 Wins 7 Losses (started the year 4-0)
2004 - 8 Wins 8 Losses (started the year 5-1) 1 Win 1 Loss (playoffs)
2005 - 2 Wins 5 Losses
2006 - 0 Wins 2 Losses

Total - 28 Wins 40 Losses

OUCH!!! Franchise QB??? Isn't a franchise QB supposed to be able to lead his team to the playoffs? Shouldn't a franchise QB have at least one season when he led his team to more wins than losses? I then took a look to see how he did against the NFC North (probably the worst division in football the 5 years Daunte was in Minnesota) and what I found was:

15 Wins 10 Losses against the NFC North (Chicago, GB, Detriot)
13 Wins 30 Losses against everyone else. What???

Crap!!! We don't play in the NFC North. So now, two games into having our supposedly new franchise QB start we are 0-2 including 0-2 in the AFC and 0-1 in our division. So in effect, we are more like 3 games out instead of 2 bc we won't be winning any tiebreakers at this point. Even worse is our supposedly new franchise QB has M & M (mechanical and mental) problems. Saban is asking for patience and saying Daunte is going to take time. Time for what? When healthy Daunte has not shown he can lead a team to a winning record.

So I am left with a few thoughts. I believe Miami has enough talent to make the playoffs, but I believe it will happen if Harrington leads us there and not Daunte. I believe we are still in need of finding a franchise QB. Unfortunately, I believe we didn't steal Daunte for a 2nd round pick. I believe the Vikings stole a 2nd round pick for Daunte.

I will wrap this up by saying I have been amazed at how many Daunte lovers there are out there. It appears to me a lot of people are choosing Daunte before the Dolphins. I enjoy being right, but sometimes I would rather be wrong and this is one of those times. I hope...no I pray that some of you Daunte lovers out there will be able to bring up this post and throw it in my face for how stupid and crazy I was to post this. As for me, my loyalty is with the team and until Daunte shows he is worthy of playing I say "Dolphins before Daunte." It is time to bench him to give the team a chance to make a playoff run.

 

[Dolfan984]

See the thing is, even with all of that, the Vikings were putting up a good amount of points per game. The defense is clearly better here in Miami, but he's just playing way below his career average. The only thing you have to ask is if he's ever going to get back to that point.

 

[BlaznRoarn]

WOW good stat. I really had no idea. I figured the one mvp type year they'd have more wins. Crazy.

But since he's our QB im behind him the same way i was behind Jay Fiedler (ewww).

 

[RenoFinFan]

See the thing is, even with all of that, the Vikings were putting up a good amount of points per game. The defense is clearly better here in Miami, but he's just playing way below his career average. The only thing you have to ask is if he's ever going to get back to that point.

When Marino was playing and the Dolphins defense was pretty bad and no running game I might add, Miami still won a lot more games than they lost.

 

[Dolfan984]

When Marino was playing and the Dolphins defense was pretty bad and no running game I might add, Miami still won a lot more games than they lost.

Dude Dan Marino was the best Quarterback period. To compare Daunte Culpepper to Dan freaking Marino is ridiculous. The point is, if he was putting up his career average points per game, the Dolphins would be looking a lot better right now. He's just playing very poorly, but you have to stick with him and see if he can get back to the level he once played at.

 

[RenoFinFan]

Dude Dan Marino was the best Quarterback period. To compare Daunte Culpepper to Dan freaking Marino is ridiculous. The point is, if he was putting up his career average points per game, the Dolphins would be looking a lot better right now. He's just playing very poorly, but you have to stick with him and see if he can get back to the level he once played at.

Honestly, I am not interested in him getting back to where he was before...good stats and team loses. I am interested in him winning games for Miami. I don't care if he puts up terrible stats. The point being good QBs have the ability to lead their team to "wins" and Daunte has not shown he can do that.

 

[Dolfan984]

Honestly, I am not interested in him getting back to where he was before...good stats and team loses. I am interested in him winning games for Miami. I don't care if he puts up terrible stats. The point being good QBs have the ability to lead their team to "wins" and Daunte has not shown he can do that.

See this is where you and I differ. I believe that he has a way better team here in Miami than he did in Minny. I believe if he plays at the level he did while playing for the Vikings, he'd win some games here that he might lose down there. The real point is, if he had those good stats, the Dolphins would probably be 2-0 and not 0-2. He's playing well below his career average, but there is a good chance that he could get back to playing like he used to. That's why you stick with him IMO.

 

[RenoFinFan]

See this is where you and I differ. I believe that he has a way better team here in Miami than he did in Minny. I believe if he plays at the level he did while playing for the Vikings, he'd win some games here that he might lose down there. The real point is, if he had those good stats, the Dolphins would probably be 2-0 and not 0-2. He's playing well below his career average, but there is a good chance that he could get back to playing like he used to. That's why you stick with him IMO.

I hope you are right if Saban sticks with him. However, his stats indicate he has some monster games when his team wins, but often he has a poor TD to turnover ratio in the games his team is on the losing end. Then there is that 2-5 record with him as a starter last year and then 7-2 when he wasn't. The points scored in the loses 13, 8, 13, 10, 3, 13. In fairness Daunte only played for a short time in the Carolina loss.

 

[Furious Yellow]

I believe Miami has enough talent to make the playoffs, but I believe it will happen if Harrington leads us there and not Daunte.

Ok.. since you seem to think that it's only about the QB, let's take a look at Detroit while Joey was there:

2002: 3-10
2003: 5-11
2004: 6-10
2005: 4-7

Combined: 18-38

Oh yeah.. much better :shakeno:

 

[Dolfan984]

I hope you are right if Saban sticks with him. However, his stats indicate he has some monster games when his team wins, but often he has a poor TD to turnover ratio in the games his team is on the losing end. Then there is that 2-5 record with him as a starter last year and then 7-2 when he wasn't. The points scored in the loses 13, 8, 13, 10, 3, 13. In fairness Daunte only played for a short time in the Carolina loss.

Well about the 2005 Vikings I believe once they put Brad Johnson in they became more of a balanced team, allowing their defense to get more rest and play better.Daunte has won/played well without Moss(2004), but he wasn't in his normal offense in 2005. My main point is that the Dolphins from top to bottom are better than the Vikings teams he played with in the past, especially the defense. The thing is, his career TD:INT ratio is very good, that's what the Dolphins need and that's not what they're getting.

 

[ROCaMOB]

The thing is, his career TD:INT ratio is very good, that's what the Dolphins need and that's not what they're getting.

What's his fumble to snap ratio?

 

[slyfox13]

I for one couldn't wait for the season to start. I had not been this optimistic since, well, since Marino. Miami was coming off a six game win streak. Saban adressed the team's weakest areas in the offseason. Saban added veteran depth. But most importantly Saban signed Daunte Culpepper. He was supposed to be the franchise QB we haven't had since "Dan the Man." Daunte came in as the 5th highest rated QB of all time. Higher career passer rating than Marino. And then there was his remarkable 2004 season. One of the greatest seasons ever by a QB. In fact, he had more total yards that season than any other QB in history breaking Dan's magical 1984 single season record. Daunte was reported to be well ahead of rehab and I kept reading reports about how good he looked in TC. I bought in to all the hype.

Everything was in place to challange NE for the division title and I actually had Super Bowl aspirations. Sure there were the occasional posts from disgruntled Viking fans that kept saying "Just wait. Daunte is not the QB you think he is. The stats lie. He makes poor decisions. He is not the 5th best QB of all-time like the ratings indicate. In fact, he is not even close to the top 5 QBs in the NFL right now. If it wasnt for #84 he would be a 2nd stringer at best right now." But you know what, I thought those posts were just from pissed-off Viking fans that were really loathing inside bc we "stole" Daunte for only a 2nd round pick.

Two games into the season I am saying WTF happened? This isn't the same QB who I used to see on ESPN throwing 60 yard bombs to #84 in Minnesota despite being double and sometimes triple covered. They looked like perfect passes. Uh oh...could those pissed-off, disgruntled, loathing Viking fans actually have been right. In fact, were they not really upset at all but snickering at us Dolphin fans?

So I decided to take a look at the numbers. No...not his personal stats. Those are impressive and have been posted many times on finheaven, but I wanted to see the stats that matter the most IMO...Wins and Losses. This is what I found for games Daunte has started:

2001 - 4 Wins 7 Losses
2002 - 6 Wins 10 Losses
2003 - 7 Wins 7 Losses (started the year 4-0)
2004 - 8 Wins 8 Losses (started the year 5-1) 1 Win 1 Loss (playoffs)
2005 - 2 Wins 5 Losses
2006 - 0 Wins 2 Losses

Total - 28 Wins 40 Losses

OUCH!!! Franchise QB??? Isn't a franchise QB supposed to be able to lead his team to the playoffs? Shouldn't a franchise QB have at least one season when he led his team to more wins than losses? I then took a look to see how he did against the NFC North (probably the worst division in football the 5 years Daunte was in Minnesota) and what I found was:

15 Wins 10 Losses against the NFC North (Chicago, GB, Detriot)
13 Wins 30 Losses against everyone else. What???

Crap!!! We don't play in the NFC North. So now, two games into having our supposedly new franchise QB start we are 0-2 including 0-2 in the AFC and 0-1 in our division. So in effect, we are more like 3 games out instead of 2 bc we won't be winning any tiebreakers at this point. Even worse is our supposedly new franchise QB has M & M (mechanical and mental) problems. Saban is asking for patience and saying Daunte is going to take time. Time for what? When healthy Daunte has not shown he can lead a team to a winning record.

So I am left with a few thoughts. I believe Miami has enough talent to make the playoffs, but I believe it will happen if Harrington leads us there and not Daunte. I believe we are still in need of finding a franchise QB. Unfortunately, I believe we didn't steal Daunte for a 2nd round pick. I believe the Vikings stole a 2nd round pick for Daunte.

I will wrap this up by saying I have been amazed at how many Daunte lovers there are out there. It appears to me a lot of people are choosing Daunte before the Dolphins. I enjoy being right, but sometimes I would rather be wrong and this is one of those times. I hope...no I pray that some of you Daunte lovers out there will be able to bring up this post and throw it in my face for how stupid and crazy I was to post this. As for me, my loyalty is with the team and until Daunte shows he is worthy of playing I say "Dolphins before Daunte." It is time to bench him to give the team a chance to make a playoff run.

Oh dont worry ill toss it right in your kisser for ya:shakeno: Take a good look at joeys stats in that same division,why dont ya the nfc north is the black & blue division for a good reason Lmao i dont know joeys stats but im assuming hes like 18 & 60. and probably something like 9 & 30 in the division Lmao C-pep on one leg is a better qb right now than joey.Thats not to say that joey isnt a good Back up and joey will come along fine but you need to leave c-pep go. Hell get it together once mularkey gets down from the boothe like nick made linehan do last yr. and as soon as he pulls his head out of his A$$ and goes back to the run.......... you need the run to set up the pass not the other way around.Knock off all the deep ball stuff and run the thing let brown do something for us.:fire:

 

[slyfox13]

When Marino was playing and the Dolphins defense was pretty bad and no running game I might add, Miami still won a lot more games than they lost.

and just think if dan hadnt retired and had decided to play another year he would have been daunte's mentor in minn.:shakeno:

 

[WEEZEL]

Isnt it funny how we can use statistics to tell ANY story we want them to.......Is it your opinion that C-Pep was the only player on the field during those losses? How about the fact Miny's backfield over that time was more like a Betty Ford clinic.........I bet you theres a way to spin your data to the positive.

 

[SarahAnn]

Ok.. since you seem to think that it's only about the QB, let's take a look at Detroit while Joey was there:

2002: 3-10
2003: 5-11
2004: 6-10
2005: 4-7

Combined: 18-38

Oh yeah.. much better :shakeno:

Are you serious? Detriot woulda never won a game without Joey there.