Four possible Trade Partners

[sask rider]

They have just as many holes as us, if not more. Why are they gonna burn a pick when they could just sit where they are get a very solid player in Mike Williams whom some people feel is better than Braylon Edwards?

Crennel and Savage aren't stupid. I don't see them throwing away picks.

Maybe I'm wrong, I just don't see the logic there. They are more than one player away to be trading the future.

getting a superstar for the next ten years is worth giving up a pick.
maybe they think williams will be a bust and that edwards will be a great. if thats the case its definitly worth the 2nd rounder. butthe key is they have ot be very confident that they "know" one will be big and one will bust

 

[twohype]

I am not going to lie- i would be disappointed if we do not trade down.

We need more picks!

Yep me to :wink:

 

[FaninPatsyLand]

getting a superstar for the next ten years is worth giving up a pick.
maybe they think williams will be a bust and that edwards will be a great. if thats the case its definitly worth the 2nd rounder. butthe key is they have ot be very confident that they "know" one will be big and one will bust

I just don't see it. I mean look at the track records of these two guys. Phil Savage orchestrated some of the best drafts in history working for Baltimore. And Romeo Crennel being a Bill Belichick disciple much like Saban will not reach and throw away picks.

I could definitely be wrong, I have no idea what is going to go down tomorrow, but I'm just telling you what I think.

 

[Awsi Dooger]

I just don't see it. I mean look at the track records of these two guys. Phil Savage orchestrated some of the best drafts in history working for Baltimore. And Romeo Crennel being a Bill Belichick disciple much like Saban will not reach and throw away picks.

I could definitely be wrong, I have no idea what is going to go down tomorrow, but I'm just telling you what I think.

I agree with your analysis. Cleveland just did that last year in the previous regime, trading up one spot to get Kellen Winslow. It cost them a second round pick that was #37 if I remember correctly. Then Winslow misses all but the first game and they go 4-12. I can't see them giving up 2 #1s and 2 #2s for one WR and one TE.

 

[FaninPatsyLand]

I agree with your analysis. Cleveland just did that last year in the previous regime, trading up one spot to get Kellen Winslow. It cost them a second round pick that was #37 if I remember correctly. Then Winslow misses all but the first game and they go 4-12. I can't see them giving up 2 #1s and 2 #2s for one WR and one TE.

That's a great point, I didn't even think about Kellen Winslow.

Burning a VERY high 2nd rounder to move up one spot just doesn't make any sense for a team that is also trying to build for the future through the draft. You don't build for the future by starting to throw away picks right off the bat.

 

[Jimmy James]

That's a great point, I didn't even think about Kellen Winslow.

Burning a VERY high 2nd rounder to move up one spot just doesn't make any sense for a team that is also trying to build for the future through the draft. You don't build for the future by starting to throw away picks right off the bat.

Winslow and what happened in the past has nothing to do with this. It's easy to point to that because he got hurt, but you wouldn't be doing it if he had been the rookie of the year.

There are absolutely situations where I would expect Nick to move up if it made sense to him even though we generally need to keep our picks.

 

[FaninPatsyLand]

Winslow and what happened in the past has nothing to do with this.

You are absolutely right. It has nothing to do with it, cause there is a new regime over there running the show. And both those guys have a track record of being associated with teams that don't do that.

 

[Jimmy James]

You are absolutely right. It has nothing to do with it, cause there is a new regime over there running the show. And both those guys have a track record of being associated with teams that don't do that.

What do you think the Ravens did when they traded up for Boller? Romeo has nothing to do with this, either.

 

[FaninPatsyLand]

What do you think the Ravens did when they traded up for Boller? Romeo has nothing to do with this, either.

What did the Ravens give the Patriots in exchange for that pick?

I'm drawing a blank, I can't remember. And if I'm correct, I believe they moved up more than one spot.

I'm referring more towards getting nervous that your guy isn't going to be there and moving up one spot at a large price. Ala Vernon Carey and Miami trading a 4th rounder to Minnesota cause they got nervous. I just don't see these guys doing that.

 

[Minnphin]

I like the idea of moving down one spot and picking up another 2nd (I'd hope for Jason Campbel there, hopefully the Skins were smokescreening? :shakeno: ), but I just don't know who I'd pick at number 3. I just don't see the value there for us. I guess I'd probably be looking at Mike Williams, maybe Antrelle Rolle, maybe Shawne Merriman. I just don't like the idea of taking an RB that early. Don't get me wrong, I really like both Ronnie and Caddy, but I just think that there are so many good RB's later in the draft (MBIII, especially). I think I'd do it, but I would have no idea who we'd draft there. Personally, I'd rather have 7 and 18, draft chart be damned.

 

[Awsi Dooger]

You are absolutely right. It has nothing to do with it, cause there is a new regime over there running the show. And both those guys have a track record of being associated with teams that don't do that.

That is the key point. Confident coaches and GMs stand pat or trade down. Panic attack wimps trade up. A generalization where you can always nitpick with an otherwise example here or there, but overall I stand by it.

I threw in the Winslow situation more or less as an interesting aside. Your point was much better, that Savage based on Baltimore's personnel record and Crennel coming from the New England philosophy seem extremely unlikely to give up so much to vault one spot. Cleveland may have more weak spots than we do.

A few years ago I was flabbergasted Ed Reed was dropping. I would have thought someone would surge into the top 10 to get him. Meanwhile, Baltimore just sat there and said thank you very much at #24. Likewise Vince Wilfork plummeting to New England last year. Savage and Crennel retain a few functioning memory cells, I assume.

 

[Jimmy James]

What did the Ravens give the Patriots in exchange for that pick?

I'm drawing a blank, I can't remember. And if I'm correct, I believe they moved up more than one spot.

I'm referring more towards getting nervous that your guy isn't going to be there and moving up one spot at a large price. Ala Vernon Carey and Miami trading a 4th rounder to Minnesota cause they got nervous. I just don't see these guys doing that.

Now we're getting somewhere. I had a feeling that's what you were getting at, but I wasn't sure.

The difference is that we know the Patriots weren't doing anything. The Vikings actually did snooker us. We very well could be deciding between the Redskins and the Browns for instance. It might not be a matter of them panicking -- it might be that they won't in fact get their man unless they act. I agree that Savage is a pro and that he'll do a good job of distinguishing between the two. Savage won't be afraid to take the action he needs to take to get his man if he feels it is important enough to get his man.

 

[FaninPatsyLand]

That is the key point. Confident coaches and GMs stand pat or trade down. Panic attack wimps trade up. A generalization where you can always nitpick with an otherwise example here or there, but overall I stand by it.

I threw in the Winslow situation more or less as an interesting aside. Your point was much better, that Savage based on Baltimore's personnel record and Crennel coming from the New England philosophy seem extremely unlikely to give up so much to vault one spot. Cleveland may have more weak spots than we do.

A few years ago I was flabbergasted Ed Reed was dropping. I would have thought someone would surge into the top 10 to get him. Meanwhile, Baltimore just sat there and said thank you very much at #24. Likewise Vince Wilfork plummeting to New England last year. Savage and Crennel retain a few functioning memory cells, I assume.

Exactly, excellent post.

These successful coaches and GMs, especially the one's which are rebuilding teams, value quantity much more so than quality.

 

[Jimmy James]

That is the key point. Confident coaches and GMs stand pat or trade down. Panic attack wimps trade up. A generalization where you can always nitpick with an otherwise example here or there, but overall I stand by it.

I think you're close to having the right definition, but you're not all the way there. Trading up often does happen in the situations you describe, but the truly confident GMs aren't afraid to move up *or* down when the situation demands it. See Andy Reid. It's not a matter of exceptions -- it's a matter of recognizing value and doing what works to realize that value.

 

[Oregonfinfan]

Dont trade with cleveland! They will turn around and take less then we would have and give either minny or tampa the spot! JUST SAY NO