IF Miami goes WR Rd. 1 | Page 3 | FinHeaven - Miami Dolphins Forums

IF Miami goes WR Rd. 1

You see instances of that long speed on those video cuts but I'd be more interested in his cone drill numbers...I don't think unless he gets up a head of steam he plays 4.39 explosive...has some gather speed to him
 
futurescout said:
Haha no worries. And I'm as big of a Brandin Cooks fan as there is. I just don't think he is a great fit for Miami. The sad part is he plays bigger than every receiver on Miami's roster.

I just love Latimer's ability to high point the football, the fluidness in and out of breaks (usually the biggest negative for big receivers) and the nastiness in the run game. He really gets after corners. Also has the size/speed to be a factor on deep balls as well.
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I still think we could take Lewan or Zack Martin if they are still on the board. If not, either take the BPA, possibly a wide receiver or trade down.
 
futurescout said:
You're overrated. Why don't you give us 20 more choices for GM, offensive coordinator, and offensive line combinations in free agency..
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Speaking of GM's....the Seahawks just hired Jeff Ireland as their draft consultant. :3w:
 
hooshoops said:
Well for me it's too rich...not in the top 20...not sure I get the marquise lee is mike Wallace stuff...I get that they run similar routes but one of lees biggest strengths is his precise route running...there's some lack of separation there though...I'm glad you have cooks now as what he will be primarily in the pros...work from the slot

If I saw latimer separate more out of his cuts and better quick acceleration out of them I could endorse top 20...but I dont
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Here's my WR Rankings and logic behind them

1. Sammy Watkins- arrest/suspension in 2012 huge red flag for me.. but without a doubt the best WR in the draft
2. Mike Evans- some tightness there will struggle to separate but I don't think that matters. When he's covered he's open.
3. Brandin Cooks- LOVE HIM but how much do you value a slot receiver? Outstanding route runner and is good at all 3 levels. Far superior receiver to Tavon Austin
4. Cody Latimer- mentioned the reasons above
5. Odell Beckham Jr- more of a deep threat than Cooks and plays bigger than him, will have concentrations drops but make highlight reel catches. Again, how much do you value a slot receiver? Adds return value
6. Marqise Lee- smoothest receiver in and out of breaks, drops way too many balls, fumbles. Won't win 50/50 balls. Durability concerns.
7. Allen Robinson- doesn't have great timed speed but comes down with a bunch of 50/50 throws, play only begins once the ball is in his hands
8. Donte Moncrief- smooth receiver with size/speed but doesn't play up to his size
9. Davante Adams- snatches the ball in the air on jump balls with his 39.5 inch vertical stats inflated from offense/level of completion.. not sudden in and out of breaks.
10. Kelvin Benjamin- just a big receiver. Wins 50/50 throws. That's it really..
 
I think the ideal fits are teams that get a lot of free releases off the Los with their wrs...the spread you out teams...a Miami under Sherman a Philly a New Orleans...not sure I see San Fran as ideal cause those wrs have to work to get free off the line a lot...

No doubt in my mind he would do the most damage in a spread heavy free release offense
 
hooshoops said:
I think the ideal fits are teams that get a lot of free releases off the Los with their wrs...the spread you out teams...a Miami under Sherman a Philly a New Orleans...not sure I see San Fran as ideal cause those wrs have to work to get free off the line a lot...

No doubt in my mind he would do the most damage in a spread heavy free release offense
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For Latimer? I don't think he will have any getting off press. But I do agree 100% about the 4.39.. not twitchy-explosive speed.. more buildup
 
futurescout said:
Here's my WR Rankings and logic behind them

1. Sammy Watkins- arrest/suspension in 2012 huge red flag for me.. but without a doubt the best WR in the draft
2. Mike Evans- some tightness there will struggle to separate but I don't think that matters. When he's covered he's open.
3. Brandin Cooks- LOVE HIM but how much do you value a slot receiver? Outstanding route runner and is good at all 3 levels. Far superior receiver to Tavon Austin
4. Cody Latimer- mentioned the reasons above
5. Odell Beckham Jr- more of a deep threat than Cooks and plays bigger than him, will have concentrations drops but make highlight reel catches. Again, how much do you value a slot receiver? Adds return value
6. Marqise Lee- smoothest receiver in and out of breaks, drops way too many balls, fumbles. Won't win 50/50 balls. Durability concerns.
7. Allen Robinson- doesn't have great timed speed but comes down with a bunch of 50/50 throws, play only begins once the ball is in his hands
8. Donte Moncrief- smooth receiver with size/speed but doesn't play up to his size
9. Davante Adams- snatches the ball in the air on jump balls with his 39.5 inch vertical stats inflated from offense/level of completion.. not sudden in and out of breaks.
10. Kelvin Benjamin- just a big receiver. Wins 50/50 throws. That's it really..
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Hey that's pretty good...spot on on Adams he won't separate in the pros comes from an inflated o and shows no burst out of cuts...DBS will be in his hip pocket all over the place...

Benjamin is a big body that plays like he's 185 lbs...you want to talk about soft and finesse...no hand use to separate no physicality can win in the red zone if you let him cross your face and climb the ladder...but god does he need a lot if work otherwise that body is useless...plays small

Beckhams runs like 3 routes...explosive but mike Wallace is here already and I'm not bumping him up cause he can return kicks...

Evans doesn't separate but he wins with that body and physicality...all about how much they let him rip thru and push off at the next level...although he will be a red zone win option from the get go...he does get off the Los burst wise pretty well for a big body...but he loses interest in his cuts other than the sheer big body creating box out opportunities...

Watkins is a stud but in this class with all this other position elite talent ie OT and edge pass rusher there's no way I'm taking a 6 ft 200 lb guy who's torn an acl already in the top 5...if it was a Calvin Johnson level freak athlete sure but 6 ft 200...nah
 
futurescout said:
For Latimer? I don't think he will have any getting off press. But I do agree 100% about the 4.39.. not twitchy-explosive speed.. more buildup
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I don't think the strength will be an issue but it looks like a guy you want clean off the Los...not sure he knows how to lean on DBS all that much either yet...some parts are raw
 
Cooks is the only receiver at 19 that intrigues me…not with all the other needs on the line, LB and DB's.

This is a deep draft at receiver…utilize the depth later on.
 
I should have mentioned Evans has a very large catch radius...you can throw that ball head high or arms extended high and he will come down with it...you do him a favor though if you play him zone on underneath routes...you gotta run hip to hip with that and frustrate him which he will show if things aren't going well...he cries for calls at an nba level
 
hooshoops said:
Hey that's pretty good...spot on on Adams he won't separate in the pros comes from an inflated o and shows no burst out of cuts...DBS will be in his hip pocket all over the place...

Benjamin is a big body that plays like he's 185 lbs...you want to talk about soft and finesse...no hand use to separate no physicality can win in the red zone if you let him cross your face and climb the ladder...but god does he need a lot if work otherwise that body is useless...plays small

Beckhams runs like 3 routes...explosive but mike Wallace is here already and I'm not bumping him up cause he can return kicks...

Evans doesn't separate but he wins with that body and physicality...all about how much they let him rip thru and push off at the next level...although he will be a red zone win option from the get go...he does get off the Los burst wise pretty well for a big body...but he loses interest in his cuts other than the sheer big body creating box out opportunities...

Watkins is a stud but in this class with all this other position elite talent ie OT and edge pass rusher there's no way I'm taking a 6 ft 200 lb guy who's torn an acl already in the top 5...if it was a Calvin Johnson level freak athlete sure but 6 ft 200...nah
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Some real maturity/character concerns with Benjamin so not a real high ceiling guy as a result

Character carries a lot of weight for me, your tape is your floor, and your character is your ceiling.. so like Dmitroff and the Falcons, I x off any player with a suspension or arrest. So players like Watkins, Mack, Lewan would not be on the board for me.. past is the best predictor of the future.. and guys with questions don't become model citizens once you give them millions.. rather be safe than sorry, especially when it comes to the 1st round.

I have Robinson #1 overall and I'm sticking to it. The guy is a straight mauler. Most dominating run blocker I've ever seen. He plays his ass off always looking to finish people. I think he is even freakier than Clowney, and technically needs a lot less fine tuning. Robinson has the feet to mirror speed rushers, anchors easy, and doesn't over set. His issue in pass pro is his hands are outside the framework will lead to some holding penalties. And in the run game he sometimes gets a little too out of control and overextends trying to finish blocks. But I can live with that cus he's trying to get after people..

Clowney needs a ton of work technically. And with his work ethic it leads me to think he won't get there.. He has one move, a pop warner swim move.. Notice I said swim move and not arm over.. You leave your breast plate and rib caged exposed like that and a tackle will get his hands all over you.. he doesn't turn his hips towards the QB making it harder to turn the corner, convert speed to power, and counter back inside. And in the run game.. this hasn't gotten any attention from anyone yet.. But he runs around so many front side blocks that he's a liability in the run game. It's a risk reward that pays off in college, but won't at the next level. For every yard you get up the field in the run game, you gotta work back.. it's not a matter of strength.. he can easily hold the point and separate and disengage.. but he won't get away with running around blocks like he does.. leaves a huge hole for a back to cut under.. that's probably the first thing an NFL DL Coach will work with him on.. punch separate and disengage.. don't run up the field or jump inside and get washed down..
 
Yeah that swim is tailor made for broken and cracked ribs...he's basically just asking for it...players see that on tape and it won't be long before he finds out...

Mack I don't know about the character stuff but what I do know is that guy has rediculous strength in his hands a real pop on contact and he's explosive as hell...I'd run the card up for what I do know...34 olb ideal fit...that's the kind of tools I want in a top 5 pick pass rusher...big lower half and butt no cricket lower legs built like a brick **** house
 
Hayden Fox said:
Cooks is the only receiver at 19 that intrigues me…not with all the other needs on the line, LB and DB's.

This is a deep draft at receiver…utilize the depth later on.
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With you 100% on that Hayden.. If I was hickey I would have signed another starter on the OL so I don't have to force an OL at #19. I love Martin he's my favorite player in the draft. He's an all-pro for a decade at guard. Xavier Su'a-Filo reminds me of Josh Sitton on the Packers and looks like a surefire pro bowler as well.. But Ryan Shazier.. if OL wasn't such a need I would say pull the trigger on Shazier. I think he's a better player than Lavante David coming out.. I don't usually get caught up on #s but 4.3 40 and 42 inch vertical is absolutely insane.. it shows up on film he can run and hit all day long.. I'm not advocating a receiver at all.. but if they were to take one at 19.. I prefer a big body like Latimer to small guys Miami has brought in like Lee Beckham Cooks..

So for me.. Zack Martin, Xavier Su'a-Filo and Ryan Shazier are the top 3 targets at #19 you have to get a pro-bowler with your first rounder and those 3 are all pro bowlers to me. and fill the biggest need(s)
 
I'm not with you on shazier...I don't see the instincts I see the athlete...elite level lbs have elite instincts as well as athleticism
 
hooshoops said:
Yeah that swim is tailor made for broken and cracked ribs...he's basically just asking for it...players see that on tape and it won't be long before he finds out...

Mack I don't know about the character stuff but what I do know is that guy has rediculous strength in his hands a real pop on contact and he's explosive as hell...I'd run the card up for what I do know...34 olb ideal fit
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He got into a fight with a teammate and was suspended for the 2012 season opener against Georgia.. What concerns me is that he was suspended for a fight with a teammate.. I've gotten in 100 fights in practice.. they happen all the time.. a few a month.. especially when you first put on the pads.. I've never heard of someone getting suspended for one so that is a big concern for me.. and I ding him a little bit for level of competition.. But yeah he definitely looks the part of a 3-4 OLB.. I just think he's more robin than batman.. Not a Von Miller caliber talent.. more of a secondary guy like a Kerrigan to Orakpo.. or Ahmad Brooks to Aldson Smith..but better than those 2.. If he was clean off the field I would have him in the back end of the top 10.
 
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