If we win out and miss the playoffs, should Wannstedt still go?

[Oboy]

I did vote that it is unforgivable to miss the playoffs two years, but I would reconsider depending on HOW we win the last three. If it is his typical hold on and pray the other team does not make plays to beat us... screw him. If he actually gains some 'guts' and goes for the kill in all three, then I will have some optimism and think maybe he can stay.

 

[iceblizzard69]

If we don't go to the AFC Championship game, Wannstedt should be fired. This is his fourth season, and he has just not gotten the job done. This team is way too talented to play like this. I think getting a new coach and offensive coordinator will make this team better.

Wannstedt ruined the Chicago Bears franchise. We can't let him ruin our franchise too. We have to get rid of him before it is too late.

 

[Disgustipate]

Wannstedt deserves to be fired flat out if we go anywhere less then the Championship game. This was the common, and IMO, realistic expectations before the season. Good teams overcome injuries, and things like that. Wannstedt is not a good coach, or even average coach.

When we win, we win because we can exploit inherant matchups. We rarely create our own. We never outcoach teams.

The Dolphins are often poorly prepared and motivated. It comes from the top down.

We know what we'll get with Wannstedt. Underachieving.

 

[Disgustipate]

I dont know that Wanny ruined the Bears. Under him, the team was what it was. A crappy team, and he didnt do much to improve it.

Wannstedt is not going to win you games. He will, however, lose you games. Your coach shouldnt be a weak point. At worst, it should have no big effect.

 

[ckparrothead]

11-5 would be pretty good and if we miss the playoffs this year with that record, what a weird scenario. I mean 11-5 last year would have been good for I believe 1st place with a bye week.

I think it would be tough figuring out where this team should go. We obviously need help at QB and OL. WR is still a problem unless its really Fiedler that is holding Chambers back. Overall Dave has had 4 years to get this franchise into top playoff caliber form and even if we go 11-5 and miss the playoffs, that means he still didn't do that.

The playoffs are all about winning the tough games against tough opponents. Even at 11-5, the only super tough team we've beaten would be Philly. We had the chance to take down New England and we lost twice. We went up against the Titans and Colts and came out losers both times. Whats more is in these four games, two of them were BAD losses.

You gotta look at the AFC as all relative. If these teams, like the Chiefs, Patriots, and Colts can take advantage of the weaknesses in the conference and over in the NFC to forge themselves really good records, it still reflects poorly on the Dolphins that WE could not do that as well. Christ we have virtually the same schedule as the Patriots and not only have they forged an 11-2 record where we are 8-5, but they beat us twice. For that, Dave has to take as much blame as if we are 9-7 and just missed the playoffs.

 

[Section126]

Can you imagine? What coach in their right mind would take a job that you get fired when going 11-5?

 

[canephin]

obviously you don't remeber the fact that Dave is the one responsible for sayin oh our offensive line is fine, we dont need any of that so Rick Speilman didnt seem to see the purpose in spending the money to get a offensive linemen who is gonna actually make it through the season. And Dave had about the lamest training camp i have seen in along time and i as a highschool football player could have competed in that camp and had the hype that Derrious Thompson had around him. Fact is Dave is to nice of a coach to get onto players. He looks like he is gonna cry everytime the ref makes a call against the dolphins, i am just sick of the way this dude acts on the side line and states the obvious when asked about how the team played and who is responsible. Basic Wanny qoute "well in general we missed blocks, and just didnt make the big plays that we needed. And you know Randy had that holding call on that big run." Shut up and play the game. Tell the media when a specidic player did something wrong and blew it for the game. Like Randy missing Harrison totally on the play that Fiedler got nailed on say it, he screwed up and that was a deciding factor in the game. THEY USE IT AS INFLUENCE YOU MORON!!! I basically think its time for the Wanny concept to go.

 

[Rick 1966]

Originally posted by DrAstroZoom
So let me get this straight, if the Dolphins finish by:

* beating the current #1 seed in the NFC as well as two of their hated division rivals;
* compiling a 4-2 divisional record for the season;
* posting a two-game improvement over 2002's record; and
* ending talk of a December swoon with a 3-1 record,

you STILL would want Wanny fired?

Wanny is ALSO the one responsible for neglecting our offensive line to the point where it is one of the worst in the NFL, making SEVERAL questionable coaching decisions that led directly to the loss of three of the five games we've lost so far and making questionable personell decisions wrt our offense. You are trying to excuse his horrible decisions by pointing out the good that has happened, but the fact is, we have a talented enough team that we shouldn't be talking about not making the playoffs OR about having to sweep our last three games to be 11-5.

 

[xiidaen]

I voted 'No' for a few reasons:

1. I don't see anyone out there that I believe is a clear and obvious upgrade to DW/NT. I think there are likely to be quite a few coaches out of a job (the first shot has already been fired) and competition for any of them will be fierce - so if someone believes there is a blue chip clear cut improvement...why are we so sure Miami can sign him and not (for example) Atlanta, where you have arguably the most exciting player in the game and a low draft pick to work with?

2. I think it's very difficult for any coach -- especially one who is from a completely different philosophy -- to come in and immediately improve this team. While there are individual examples of coaches coming in an winning (Notably Gruden @ TB) there are many more examples of coaches coming in and teams taking a step back or rebuilding.

3. Finally, (and slightly off topic) there seems to be a mentality out there that anyone is better, any QB is better, and losing seasons and high draft picks will lead us to the superbowl. How many times do you see fans comment something like "I'd trade a 4-12 season for a superbowl" or "We should have lost to Dallas and Washington instead of NE - that would have been better"? The problem is, there is no place you get to make these deals, life doesn't work that way. A rookie QB is highly unlikely to play at a championship calibur in his first couple years. A new coach will have a new system, bring new assistants, and bring more changes to the situation. These are not often recipes for success in the first year.

And with the way the fans go crazy at 5-4 and 8-5, I'd hate to hear people at 4-12.

 

[Crennelichick]

Originally posted by xiidaen
I voted 'No' for a few reasons:


2. I think any coach -- especially one who is from a completely different philosophy -- to come in and immediately improve this team. While there are individual examples of coaches coming in an winning (Notably Gruden @ TB) there are many more examples of coaches coming in and teams taking a step back or rebuilding.

This is probably the most poignant arguement of this thread. The Pats went 5-11 in BB's first season. Many people around the league disrespected him for this. He was taking over for Pete Caroll and coaching a totally different ball game. The personel take time to adjust to different systems and different philosophies. Wanny is alot like Caroll in that he is too nice to the players. If you guys could get Denny Green, (Hey Denny for Wanny?) any ways he is a similar personality to Dave W. and maybe would be easier to take for the players. If however you steal our D Coordinator, Crennel, the players will be in for a big dose of culture shock and the first season you'd be lucky to have a winning record. Bill Parcells in my opinion is the only turn around coach in the NFL who demands that people buy into his system right away. Even Gruden can't have this said about him, because the Bucs were not a bad team when he took over, look at them now! That is not to say Miami is a bad team, but it is always difficult to change gears and improve in one yr IMHO!

 

[PhinPhreak]

Ok there is two sides to this debate,

Depending on where the Fins finish this season(and the poll is about them missing the playoffs) they will have steadily gotten worse each year since Wanny had been here.

Season 1 11-5 AFC East Champs 2nd round playoff loss
Season 2 11-5 Wildcard 1st round playoff loss
Season 3 9-7 Missed Playoffs
Season 4 ?-? Missed Playoffs 2nd consecutive year

The key to this decline is the fact that the team in season 3 & 4 should have been better with he addition of Ricky, Chambers, McMichael yet the team overall did worse.

The other side of the argument is as has been said many times is that who is out there to replace him.

I think if there is not a suitable replacement for him to hire a new coach just because might be a mistake, add into the fact that it seams there is going to be alot of teams looking for coaches this year. It may be better to wait a year and see who is available next year.

I wasn't one of the fans that cried for Dave's head everytime the team did something wrong but after seeing the Cowboys and Patriots I have come to realize how important is is to have a good coach, I have always been on the side of that the coach can only do so much he doesn't actually play in the game, but Wanny has made some major errors in trying to upgrade this team in the last few years.

While he did bring in Ricky(and I think truthfully they get too much credit for that, the Saints basically put him out there for taking), he has missed on upgrading the team in areas that needed to be upgraded for this team to take the next step. So now I am ready to see what somebody else can do for this team before it's too late.

 

[DrAstroZoom]

Wow. I simply can't believe it. I'm not saying a 3-0 run is going to happen (though I strongly believe it could), but if it did, and we fired Wannstedt, it would really be sad. I don't see how making a two-game improvement and reversing the trend toward December swoons would be irrelevant simply because this would be the only season in recent memory in which 11-5 didn't get a team in the playoffs.

I'm sorry I'm this passionate about a totally hypothetical scenario, but I'm mystified at how spoiled and bloodthirsty the majority of our fan base apparently is. Mark my words: if the scenario I've stated (11-5 finish, no playoffs) occurs and Wanny is fired, this team will not make the playoffs next year either.

My reasoning? Any coach brave enough to enter such a situation will come from such a different situation that we will need a year to rebuild and reconfigure. Sorry, that's just how I see it.

Hopefully, we'll make the playoffs, and this argument will be moot.

 

[scodoublet]

Pink Slip Time for NV and Wanny!
I actually think NV should go more then Wanny.
The only thing is, if we get a new coach, it might take him a year or so to get a handle on things.
By then our D won't be the same! :cry:
I think they messed up our team pretty bad!
Whoever we get for any new coaching position, could they please not come from dallas? I think we've had enough cowboys over here!

 

[PhinPhreak]

Originally posted by DrAstroZoom
Wow. I simply can't believe it. I'm not saying a 3-0 run is going to happen (though I strongly believe it could), but if it did, and we fired Wannstedt, it would really be sad. I don't see how making a two-game improvement and reversing the trend toward December swoons would be irrelevant simply because this would be the only season in recent memory in which 11-5 didn't get a team in the playoffs.

I'm sorry I'm this passionate about a totally hypothetical scenario, but I'm mystified at how spoiled and bloodthirsty the majority of our fan base apparently is. Mark my words: if the scenario I've stated (11-5 finish, no playoffs) occurs and Wanny is fired, this team will not make the playoffs next year either.

My reasoning? Any coach brave enough to enter such a situation will come from such a different situation that we will need a year to rebuild and reconfigure. Sorry, that's just how I see it.

Hopefully, we'll make the playoffs, and this argument will be moot.

I agree it shouldn't normally be a cause to be fired but while 11-5 is a good record, this team has underachieved the last few years and I am starting to see that even though the coach doesn't actually play he does make a difference. The question is if the Fins had a better coach the last two years would they have done better. I used to think no but again I can't argue with what Parcells and Buttacheck are doing with less talent.

Truthfully 4 of the 5 losses came down to 1 or 2 key plays, there is no doubt they should have beaten the Texans & Patriots(1st game) the Colts game while it looked like they could have won we have no idea for sure what would of happened if Griese doesn't fumble, maybe he throws a Int on the next play. The Pats game was in reach also, but mental mistakes once again cost the team.

While the players that made these mistakes are responsible the coach is utterly responsible for his players actions.

 

[NCFINFAN38]

Originally posted by Section126
Can you imagine? What coach in their right mind would take a job that you get fired when going 11-5?

How about any coach who believed in themselves. This would be a dream job. We have plenty of playmakers on this team and a coach like say, Cowher would love to come down here and see what he could do with these players.
As for Wanny, he is a nice guy and I hope he lands on his feet some where. But he does not have what it takes to take this or any other team deep into the playoffs. He is too nice and does not make players accept responsilbility for their mistakes.
The other argument is "well another coach will not take us to the playoffs next year". Well that may or may not be true, it remains to be seen. What we DO know is that with all the players in place that Dave wanted we could not make it to the big dance, and it will only get worse. You think next year is really gonna be BETTER with Dave?? What could you possibly base that on. For the most part we have been fairly healthy, compared to say the Pats for example, and yet STILL he couldn't pull it off with the guys he said would make the difference.
It keeps getting said they we are "haters" for feeling that Dave is not the answer. This is just not true. I would hate to have to be the one who fired Dave, but I do feel it has to be done.
Just my opinion.
PS it won't be an issue however, Philly will kill us.