Josh Rosen Vs. Ryan Fitzpatrick | Pff

Ferretsquig

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At first I agreed we have to play Rosen no matter what but now I'm rethinking. There are other positions we want to fairly evaluate too that poor QB play would hurt, namely WR and TE. If Rosen's play is far below Fitz, I'd rather go with Fitz. We didn't pay a high price for Rosen and he won't make much money. If Rosen can't win the job outright, you draft a QB in 2020 and then let them compete too.
It may be tougher for the fans to evaluate the skill positions but I don't think that's the case for the coaches. They know when the wide receiver makes the right read, is able to beat his man and get in position even if the ball is thrown 10 ft over his head. The biggest problem with having a lousy QB is an offense that can't stay on the field and has fewer plays to showcase those skills.

I find it very hard to believe that you could convince yourself that those 4-6 games where Fitzpatrick looks like a pro bowler is worth passing up on a free trial season of Rosen.
 

PhxSunFan34

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It may be tougher for the fans to evaluate the skill positions but I don't think that's the case for the coaches. They know when the wide receiver makes the right read, is able to beat his man and get in position even if the ball is thrown 10 ft over his head. The biggest problem with having a lousy QB is an offense that can't stay on the field and has fewer plays to showcase those skills.

I find it very hard to believe that you could convince yourself that those 4-6 games where Fitzpatrick looks like a pro bowler is worth passing up on a free trial season of Rosen.
In my opinion, the OL holds the majority of the blame for the offense not being able to stay on the field. The constant false starts, holding penalties and allowance of free rushers has constantly ended drives.
 

The Ghost

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At first I agreed we have to play Rosen no matter what but now I'm rethinking. There are other positions we want to fairly evaluate too that poor QB play would hurt, namely WR and TE. If Rosen's play is far below Fitz, I'd rather go with Fitz. We didn't pay a high price for Rosen and he won't make much money. If Rosen can't win the job outright, you draft a QB in 2020 and then let them compete too.
I agree more with this, than what anyone else has said.

I don't think there is an actual QB competition taking place. Ryan Fitzpatrick, barring injury, is going to start week 1. That will have no bearing on Rosen's long term viability for us despite the conclusions some fans and media will draw instantly for the "competition".

Dan Marino is a constant reminder of what this team needs....

More than just the best QB ever.

Draft picks and assets.

Lots and lots of draft high picks.

They tore it all down and started over. Josh Rosen isn't going to change that plan. He's just another player with a shot. Rosen will be on the team in 2020 regardless of how 2019 unfolds.

I say all this securely knowing I probably think a lot higher of Rosen than just about anyone else. I loved the kids talent a year ago and I like him just as much now.

Having Tua/Fromm/Herbert and Rosen on the team in 2020 isn't the conundrum some might think it is. It's a distinct possibility.
 
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fansinceGWilson

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I agree more with this, than what anyone else has said.

I don't think there is an actual QB competition taking place. Ryan Fitzpatrick, barring injury, is going to start week 1. That will have no bearing on Rosen's long term viability for us despite the conclusions some fans and media will draw instantly for the "competition".

Dan Marino is a constant reminder of what this team needs....

More than just the best QB ever.

Draft picks and assets.

Lots and lots of draft high picks.

They tore it all down and started over. Josh Rosen isn't going to change that plan. He's just another player with a shot. Rosen will be on the team in 2020 regardless of how 2019 unfolds.

I say all this securely knowing I probably think a lot higher of Rosen than just about anyone else. I loved the kids talent a year ago and I like him just as much now.

Having Tua/Fromm/Herbert and Rosen on the team in 2020 isn't the conundrum some might think it is. It's a distinct possibility.

I agree with this EXCEPT if Rosen turns it on and, by game 2 PS, is undeniably better than RF. There are some who make this either/or. Rosen starts game 1 or he SUCKS!! No room for any other interpretation. Since no one knows Flores' mind, it's all speculation.
 

The Ghost

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I agree with this EXCEPT if Rosen turns it on and, by game 2 PS, is undeniably better than RF. There are some who make this either/or. Rosen starts game 1 or he SUCKS!! No room for any other interpretation. Since no one knows Flores' mind, it's all speculation.
I hear ya. I am pretty sure the whole thing will be "controlled" in an attempt to make them both look good. They will spin it as the vet with the big salary get's first crack.

I want Rosen to take the job, obviously. I want him to be so good Fitzpatrick doesn't even get 1st team reps in the preseason. I don't for one second want Ryan Fitzpatrick QBing the Miami Dolphins. I can wait though. I know the key to the whole thing is draft assets.

For me a perfect scenario is JR taking over a 1-9 team and going 4-2 in 6 starts.

Call me greedy but I want Rosen to play well AND have a top 3 pick (that I can trade).
 

djphinfan

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Travis does a great job with the podcast...but I don’t agree with some of his opinions or assessments...nobody is always right and I’m sure he acknowledges that.

For example... he was a big believer in Tannehill.

The fact is Josh Rosen has had poor O-lines and overall surrounding talent in both College and at Arizona (in fact the NFL’s worst last year).

A seasoned vet will struggle with the NFL’s worst O-line (all 5 Arizona starters were on IR early in Rosen’s rookie year).

The fact is most NFL rookie QB’s have an adjustment period of adapting to the NFL and the speed of the game (some call it the lightbulb going on, or the game slowing down)....it’s kind of compounded with an historically bad O-line.

In 2018 Josh Rosen had less than 2.5 seconds to get rid of the ball at a percentage ranking in the top ten worst in NFL history... mix in his OC getting fired early in his rookie season and replaced by a rookie OC and you get a ridiculously hard season to evaluate a rookie QB.

So... in fairness....You have to largely throw out the 2018 season and give Rosen a stable situation to develop in and then assess what you have.

Not judge him pre-training camp on non hitting OTA’s where he just got the playbook...versus a popular 14 vet QB who is notorious for looking good in spurts and failing over the long run.

To act like his poor situation in 2018 had no effect on his rookie season Is poor evaluation in my mind.

Yes... he has to prove it and win the job... but not in OTA’s per say, and he certainly doesn’t deserve the rush to judgement by some based on the above....take a breath and let’s let it play out.

It reminds me of the rush to judgement people made on the early part of Drew Brees San Diego career.... so rush to judgement they were that they drafted Phillip Rivers to replace him.

Drew Brees is now a Super Bowl winning and Lock hall of famer and all time great....Phillip Rivers is non of the above, very good but has never really crossed the above threshold.

The point is... take a breath and let it play out...not make sweeping proclamations on the abortion of a team Arizona was in 2018.... or after non hitting OTA’s.
Really good post..with all the things that were bad on that team last year, with the talent level he does have, it’s really a hard evaluation to have any conviction on..really is.
 

CoryMatthews

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If you are taking any analysis from wingding you are doing it wrong.

And Fitzpatrick is going to play all year.
 

BlueFin

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Omar wasn't the only beat writer saying there was no competition between Rosen and Fitzpatrick all the sports writers were saying it, even if it was only OTA's and it seems quite possible/probable that we our faced with the same exact scenario when the season is ready to start.

There is still another season of college football to be played and the college QB landscape in 2020 and 2021 may look different. Suck for Tua is premature.

We may have to give up picks to get the QB we want, may still need to build draft capitol and trading our 1st round pick in 2020 for a 1st in 2021 and 2nd in 2020 may be the easiest way to get it.

If I'm giving up multiple 1st round picks - right now I want Lawrence in 2021

Back to the point at hand why would we start Rosen if he is not ready to start, thinking that he needs to play to get better, sounds a bit like what we did with Tannehill. When Rosen starts again your hoping for a better result or his narrative would start to look like it's written in stone. We have him 3 more years before we need to make a decision, worst thing we could do to him is start him if he not ready. Quarterback decision in 2020 or 2021 doesn't have to have a absolute answer to the Rosen question, best case scenario is you end up having 2 really good QB's you can trade 1 and get a really good price if you do it the right way.
The point is it’s too early to say he’s not ready...
 

Ferretsquig

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They tore it all down and started over. Josh Rosen isn't going to change that plan. He's just another player with a shot. Rosen will be on the team in 2020 regardless of how 2019 unfolds.

I say all this securely knowing I probably think a lot higher of Rosen than just about anyone else. I loved the kids talent a year ago and I like him just as much now.

Having Tua/Fromm/Herbert and Rosen on the team in 2020 isn't the conundrum some might think it is. It's a distinct possibility.
The fault in that logic is that the inevitable top 5 pick is worth so much more than all the picks Grier has been hoarding. Screw it up and the repercussions are felt for the next decade. And drafting one QB when you already have the answer on the roster is screwing it up.

They can't go into next year's draft not knowing what Rosen is. Misjudging him like the Chargers did with Brees will carry far more cost than any other course of action.
 
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