Marino's feelings tword the fins

[tay0365]

Shula was a great coach but he wasnt a good talent evaluator.He had to rely on other people and that was his biggest flaw.He was loyal to his underlings to a fault and IMO he did not make the appropiate changes when those people demonstrated they were not up to the job.Ditto with some of his assistant coaches.

His biggest flaw was not getting a real D-coordinator, instead of showing loyalty and keeping that knucklehead all those year. I believe if Miami had ever gotten even a half decent defense, with Marino scoring at will, Miami would have seen some more superbowls....even without a running game.

 

[PHINZONER]

I guarantee there is bitterness w/ how things were handled w/ Shula's departure, JJ's arival, Marino's last years w/ Miami and his own departure. He knew Wanny did not want him. Not assuring he would start, come on Wanny. That is why Dan listened to the Vikes and Pitt. There were others, but not as serious as those 2. If Marino were to play in Minny I would have hated that more than anyone else! I put my helmet through a wall when I heard Walker was traded to the Vikes. But imagine Marino throwing to Carter and Moss!!!!! That would have helped to solidify the Wanny days as the worst move in NFL history.

Bitterness is why he thought about it!!!! Legacy is why he did not do it!!!! Loyalty!!!

I wish he could buy the team!!!!!!

 

[GRT8]

Only One Team Wins Each Year...the Bills Went To Four In A Row.....jim Has Not One Ring....but He Was One Hell Of A Great Competitor. I Don't Think It Takes Away....all That Matters Is He Is In The Hall And We Appreciate Him......i Could Care Less What Anyone Else Who Doubts Him Would Say. Ask Bruce Smith Who He Feared The Most And He Will Tell You.....marino.

 

[grendel]

Dan should blame Shula for letting Ansparger leave and staying to loyal to the replacement defensive coordinator, Tom olivadotti. I you remember all those playoff losses to the bill, it was really the collapse of the defensive scheme, that killled Miami.

 

[chevysales]

please dont take this as a insult or anything like that. i really am curious.
but i have been wondering this for a while. (you have to ignore the bills flag)

we can all agree that marino was a great QB. and most people say that he never won a super bowl becuase he didnt have a team around him. no WRs, no RBs, no O-Line... ok.

but he was in the league for a LONG time. and through all those years he never really had a good supporting cast.

so do you think, looking back on his carrer with the fins, that he feels the fins organization, GM, owner...ect, are responsible for not giving him a team, and inturn keeping him from getting a SB ring? and keeping him from being the widly accepted "greatest ever"? (i know many think he is the greatest, but many sports writers disagree).
:couch:

i dont want to start a "he was the greatest because..." threads.

but, what do you think??

cris carter alluded to this today in an article.

 

[phinphan11]

You also can look at it this way.... If the team did have all of the accompanying factors, such as a good running game, he may not have accomplished the HOF passing numbers that it would have taken to get him there.

 

[yankeehillbilly]

This is a fair criticism We held on to Olivadatti far too long. We had decent defensive talent in the early 90's and his vanilla bend and then break defense didn't get it done. Imagine if we had Arnsparger one last time. Cox, Coleman, Vincent, Cross, Oliver, Williams, Bowens, and Singleton should have been enough to field a decent D.

The one criticism I have of Dan was he never fully mastered the play action pass. He would have been even greater if he did.

Shula mentioned that Dan never liked the play action pass because it forced him to take his eyes off the field. One of Dans greatest assets was his field vision....to take that away would probably have done more damage than good.

 

[ch19079]

Only One Team Wins Each Year...the Bills Went To Four In A Row.....jim Has Not One Ring....but He Was One Hell Of A Great Competitor. I Don't Think It Takes Away....all That Matters Is He Is In The Hall And We Appreciate Him......i Could Care Less What Anyone Else Who Doubts Him Would Say. Ask Bruce Smith Who He Feared The Most And He Will Tell You.....marino.

this topic has nothing to do with Kelly, and i dont want it to go that way.
this topic is not about "he doesnt have a ring, and that takes away from his legasy" eather.

simply,
"do you think he has some negative feelings tword the fins organization, former coaches, former GMs for not giving him a better team during his long NFL carrer?"

 

[BlueFin]

I don't know, I don't blame Shula as much. I think part of it has to go on Dan himself. Dan hated to hand the ball off. So much so that he admits to changing the plays to passes on every down in one game. Dan had some good o-line players around him as well, the just excelled at pass blocking. We had some ok running backs but again, the gameplan was solely on Dan's arm and when it shifted to something else, Dan just audibled back to himself.

The offense in my opinion was fine. The problem I think in a lot of those years was that they had a subpar defense. When Jimmy Johnson took over, he fixed that, but did it at the expense of the offense and Dan Marino's arm. He called for more play action's and more running, which really didn't help us much.

My bottom line is this. I think Dan Marino loves the fins. He probably has some regrets but I think he obviously feels a bond with the organization and fans. He had an opportunity to go elsewhere and start ( Minnesota, Pittsburgh ) but decided to retire instead. He liked that fact that he played for one team. I think that shows you where he is at with the team.

There is no question the Dolphin organization failed Marino from the standpoint of personnel evaluation, I love Don Shula but he should have had a top GM to manage and draft talent. Anyone who goes back and evaluates the drafts from 1984-on could come to no other conclusion.

I also think Shula was too loyal to assistants that weren't getting the job done.

I am sure even Don feels this way inside upon reflection.

Our runningbacks were not OK, with the exception of David Overstreet who died right as Danny's carreer was starting, we did not have an impact runner.

To answer the thread starters question, I'm sure Dan has his thoughts about what happened but he is far too classy a man to point fingers.

Everything doesn't always go as you planned, putting together a championship team is just not that easy.

I think its fair to say in retrospect Shula's best years as a head man were from the early sixties when he took over Baltimore to around 1985.

Perhaps he just didn't adapt to the changes in the league and the way organizations were scouting talent over the last decade or so of his career.

 

[Finland]

They did get some team development espeially in Shula's last year, not that leaving things to the last year is a recipe for success. Also, I think the team was pretty hot in 1993 when they last a lead in the AFC Championship game. they were also good the year Marino got the achillies, they started started 6-0 then went to 9-2 and finished 9-7 I think.

He had teams in there for sure. It just did not happen.

 

[Zeke0123]

this topic has nothing to do with Kelly, and i dont want it to go that way.
this topic is not about "he doesnt have a ring, and that takes away from his legasy" eather.

simply,
"do you think he has some negative feelings tword the fins organization, former coaches, former GMs for not giving him a better team during his long NFL carrer?"

Maybe some hindsight Dissapointment but I doubt he has any bitterness.. He knows everyone in the organization gave their best and he is very good friends with Shula/Eddie Jones the two people most responsible for putting the staffs/teams together. He knows Shulas only fault (imo) was his (staunch) loyalty to players/coaches/scouts the most obvious being Olivadotti that might have cost them a shot or two in the middle of Dans career but I doubt their is any bitterness.

 

[byroan]

simply,
"do you think he has some negative feelings tword the fins organization, former coaches, former GMs for not giving him a better team during his long NFL carrer?"

In short, yes I do. I think after yesterday though he feels a lot better. The fan support was awesome.

 

[Mile High Fin]

please dont take this as a insult or anything like that. i really am curious.
but i have been wondering this for a while. (you have to ignore the bills flag)

we can all agree that marino was a great QB. and most people say that he never won a super bowl becuase he didnt have a team around him. no WRs, no RBs, no O-Line... ok.

but he was in the league for a LONG time. and through all those years he never really had a good supporting cast.

so do you think, looking back on his carrer with the fins, that he feels the fins organization, GM, owner...ect, are responsible for not giving him a team, and inturn keeping him from getting a SB ring? and keeping him from being the widly accepted "greatest ever"? (i know many think he is the greatest, but many sports writers disagree).
:couch:

i dont want to start a "he was the greatest because..." threads.

but, what do you think??

I think Marino knows the organization did their best to draft/sign the best team possible.....just not all the moves paid off.
God knows we went through numerous RBs trying to find one...

IMO, the Fins were an average/good team minus Marino during his career, and Marino's ability/skills enabled them to be a consistent good/great team. Just never enough to get all the way to the top...

In sum, the Fins minus Marino were maybe an average team most years.
With Marino, they were a top 10 consistently, and top 5 sometimes....just not #1...
Having said that, if you put Marino on the San Fran team in the 80s, or Dallas in the 90s, and he'd probably have 5-6 rings....

 

[Zeke0123]

I think Marino knows the organization did their best to draft/sign the best team possible.....just not all the moves paid off.
God knows we went through numerous RBs trying to find one...

IMO, the Fins were an average/good team minus Marino during his career, and Marino's ability/skills enabled them to be a consistent good/great team. Just never enough to get all the way to the top...

In sum, the Fins minus Marino were maybe an average team most years.
With Marino, they were a top 10 consistently, and top 5 sometimes....just not #1...
Having said that, if you put Marino on the San Fran team in the 80s, or Dallas in the 90s, and he'd probably have 5-6 rings....

:yeahthat: and put Montana or Aikman in those fins teams and they dont win ****.

 

[Wildbill3]

please dont take this as a insult or anything like that. i really am curious.
but i have been wondering this for a while. (you have to ignore the bills flag)

we can all agree that marino was a great QB. and most people say that he never won a super bowl becuase he didnt have a team around him. no WRs, no RBs, no O-Line... ok.

but he was in the league for a LONG time. and through all those years he never really had a good supporting cast.

so do you think, looking back on his carrer with the fins, that he feels the fins organization, GM, owner...ect, are responsible for not giving him a team, and inturn keeping him from getting a SB ring? and keeping him from being the widly accepted "greatest ever"? (i know many think he is the greatest, but many sports writers disagree).
:couch:

i dont want to start a "he was the greatest because..." threads.

but, what do you think??

Yeah, Joe Robbie, Shula, and even JJ admitted that they never built a team to take marino all the way to a win.