MERGED:does anyone else feel riped off/upset on this surtain deal?!?!

[cnc66]

I'm with you on this one. Been saying it for a while now.

I agree with you and MikeO. Hey KB, no matter what you or I think about the relative value of Pat, he was only worth what we got for him. We "should've got this" and "we should've got that" is easy to say, but it doesn't make sense. Or what? not trade him, take the cap hit and get NOTHING for him next year. One day before the draft how many other offers were there? Do any of you "we didn't get enough" guys think that Saban told anyone "that's ok we only need your 2nd... you can keep the other ones" ? I think we did great, I was afraid Saban would cave, he did not, my faith increases.Times are changing, salary caps are now starting to TRULY limit the values of players.

 

[DoLpHiNz34]

I'm with you on this one. Been saying it for a while now.

Time to admit, while many of us loved the guys on D, they had their time and it didn't happen. We cannot afford to keep thinking "we're just one player away".... at some point you have to cut your losses and still trade while they have value.

7 years $50.8M ($14M gauranteed). This is NOT the direction we are moving. The economics is simply not there. We allowed the D to chew up our cap for years. They had their chance, they made good money too... time to move on. People should have seen the writing on the wall when Madison jumped at the opportunity to restructure after we drafted Poole. The clock began ticking for Surtain at that moment.

There's another clock ticking.... JT. All of the threads about JT's not a linebacker and he's not a good fit for the 3-4...... missing the bigger point. JT's not in the future plans.

Now matter how much you support his accomplishments, his clock is ticking. I don't know what his exact cap numbers are for 2006 or 2007, but he will not see his contract to fruition. Once his cap hit is manageable and there's still tread on the tires, he'll be on the trading block.

It's NFL economics. The days of your favorite player playing his entire career on one team are over.

Excellent post.

 

[FinzManiac]

Saban got what he wanted...a 2nd round pick...and we don't have to worry about the cap hit or losing him to FA next season with no compensation.

So no..I'm pretty thrilled about it actually...

 

[PhinstiGator]

Surtain held his value pretty well. We drafted him at #44 and got a #46 (minus 5th round droppage) about 6 years later.

Ultimately, this trade should be judged by who we end up selecting at #46...don't you think? Duh...

 

[infiltrateib]

I think people are being a little unreasonable here. I'm usually with KB21 on most issues, but I have to dissent on this one, for the following reasons:

1. Quoted by NathanHunt: "7 years $50.8M ($14M gauranteed). This is NOT the direction we are moving. The economics is simply not there. We allowed the D to chew up our cap for years. They had their chance, they made good money too... time to move on. People should have seen the writing on the wall when Madison jumped at the opportunity to restructure after we drafted Poole. The clock began ticking for Surtain at that moment."

2. It's a market. We had Surtain out there for a #1 for a long time and no one bit. He's a top 5 CB, no doubt, but teams weren't jumping for him. The market showed that.

3. A lot of you focus on talent alone and are myopic about it. Surtain is getting older. We'd have to pay him a lot, as shown above. Let me put it this way: You're on a strapped budget. For $10k, would you rather buy a 2000 BMW with 90k miles and a $60k lien on it, or a 2005 Corolla? Sure, the BMW is a better car, but it's older, more mileage, way more money, will break down sooner. The name of the car alone isn't the only consideration.

4. Will Poole will be underutilized talent. He's a good player right now with the potential to be great. Sam played better than Pat last year and the dropoff at #2 CB in a year or two won't be HUGE. The money, however, was.

 

[greenflash01]

Does anyone know why the Dolphins have them most winning record since 1970, it's because of great players like Surtain, JT, Zach, Seau. ADMIN EDIT: That's enough, you will stop insulting the other members, you will stop with the profanity. Take your frustration out somewhere else.

 

[BigDogsHunt]

Quote:
Originally Posted by FiN.in.RI
So when is Ricky comming back?



Ricky left?

Coach Shula is gonna be pissed. He doesn't like it when people quit the team he coaches.

-------------------------------------

Yeah, but don't worry, Csonka and Kiick (and Morris) said they got the backfield needs covered.

I am so looking forward to draft day.......

 

[GreenMonster]

I think people are being a little unreasonable here. I'm usually with KB21 on most issues, but I have to dissent on this one, for the following reasons:

1. Quoted by NathanHunt: "7 years $50.8M ($14M gauranteed). This is NOT the direction we are moving. The economics is simply not there. We allowed the D to chew up our cap for years. They had their chance, they made good money too... time to move on. People should have seen the writing on the wall when Madison jumped at the opportunity to restructure after we drafted Poole. The clock began ticking for Surtain at that moment."

2. It's a market. We had Surtain out there for a #1 for a long time and no one bit. He's a top 5 CB, no doubt, but teams weren't jumping for him. The market showed that.

3. A lot of you focus on talent alone and are myopic about it. Surtain is getting older. We'd have to pay him a lot, as shown above. Let me put it this way: You're on a strapped budget. For $10k, would you rather buy a 2000 BMW with 90k miles and a $60k lien on it, or a 2005 Corolla? Sure, the BMW is a better car, but it's older, more mileage, way more money, will break down sooner. The name of the car alone isn't the only consideration.

4. Will Poole will be underutilized talent. He's a good player right now with the potential to be great. Sam played better than Pat last year and the dropoff at #2 CB in a year or two won't be HUGE. The money, however, was.

Couldn't have said it any better myself... GreenMonster

 

[Doktor Ivel]

i like the deal

 

[GreenMonster]

Tell me, in what world is a wide receiver, much less a wide receiver that is a malcontent, worth more than a great cornerback?

There are four positions that carry the highest value in the NFL, and wide receiver isn't one of them. Those positions are quarterback, offensive tackle, defensive end, and cornerback. Those are the value positions. Not wide receiver. Not running back. Not tight end. Not linebacker.

In the last year, we have now traded two players out of that group of the most valuable positions for virtually nothing.

Thank God the Vikings didn't offer us Moss for Surtain we would have told them to shove it, and asked for Culpepper... GreenMonster

 

[NYPhinFan]

I think people are being a little unreasonable here. I'm usually with KB21 on most issues, but I have to dissent on this one, for the following reasons:

1. Quoted by NathanHunt: "7 years $50.8M ($14M gauranteed). This is NOT the direction we are moving. The economics is simply not there. We allowed the D to chew up our cap for years. They had their chance, they made good money too... time to move on. People should have seen the writing on the wall when Madison jumped at the opportunity to restructure after we drafted Poole. The clock began ticking for Surtain at that moment."

2. It's a market. We had Surtain out there for a #1 for a long time and no one bit. He's a top 5 CB, no doubt, but teams weren't jumping for him. The market showed that.

3. A lot of you focus on talent alone and are myopic about it. Surtain is getting older. We'd have to pay him a lot, as shown above. Let me put it this way: You're on a strapped budget. For $10k, would you rather buy a 2000 BMW with 90k miles and a $60k lien on it, or a 2005 Corolla? Sure, the BMW is a better car, but it's older, more mileage, way more money, will break down sooner. The name of the car alone isn't the only consideration.

4. Will Poole will be underutilized talent. He's a good player right now with the potential to be great. Sam played better than Pat last year and the dropoff at #2 CB in a year or two won't be HUGE. The money, however, was.

AMEN! :up: Will miss Pat...but some hard decisions have to be made...and we needed a #2...great post

 

[DOLFANMIKE]

I hate losing the guy I think is our best player. However, Saban is about the future and Surtains cap number wont work for us. I hope we land a quality DB somewhere.

 

[Pocoloco]

This was a wanny mistake, if he would have traded Madison and not signed him to that deal, we could have gottin rid of him and used money for surtain. Madison is untradable because of the cap hit. Wanny should have reversed this when he had the chance. Freaking butthead

agree. no need to blame Saban on this one, he did the best he possibly could with a very difficult situation

 

[JCfinfan]

It seems everyone is happy about losing Surtian, there was a reason he costed so much. Its because he's freakin good. A second round and swapping fifths sounds like a bad deal to me. Sabin couldn't even get one of the Chiefs players for him. Our secondry has gone from the best in the league to just another secondary. I'm wiggin out here, anyone else sad about losing him at all. Cap eater or not!:roflmao:

No! this was a very smart move by the organization.

 

[KTownsDolphins]

If Bill Bellichek can win a superbowl without there star Ty Law at corner, then we can one day without Pat. Lets see what we do with our 2nd round pick

He's an excellent player yah, but guess what We now have the money to sign a #2 pick overall even if we don't trade it.

I'll mist Pat he's played hard for Miami however this is the best we could have gotten for a guy with such a high $$$$ figure.