Merged: Rick Spielman is a GENIUS....../Rick Spielman Thread

[PhinBeck]

I agree Cleveland wasn't parting with Suggs......but is he a genius or is he lucky Cleveland said NO? If Cleveland says yes, then we end up with Davis and Suggs.

When, we COULD OF HAD (and do have) Booker and Gordon which is a better deal than Suggs/Davis. The combo of Booker/Gordon is better than that of Suggs/Davis.

I dont know about all that, I like the Booker/Gordon combo alot, but Suggs and Davis, that would have been very nice, but wasnt happening.

 

[Dphins4me]

That does not seem to be the consensus.... I guess you missed the part where I said that he got the BEST deal he could make. Cleveland said NO...remember?.....

Consensus among the blind? Miami could trot out Blair Thomas and there would be some here that would be singing his praises.

Sorry, but getting the best deal available does not make one a genius. Even in football sense. A football genius would have gotten the best deal, not just the best available. You could have gotten the best available.

He was not thought of like that....he was thought of as Faulks replacement along with Jackson..He was also drafted in the third round...The premise of your question is flawed....

Flawed? How? He has been with the team for 2 years and this year they trade up to get Jackson. Once Jackson was drafted Gordon became No. 3. There is not a doubt there.

Also it tells me St. Louis did have some concerns about him whether it be ability or health.

Also what does him being drafted in the 3rd round have to do with anything?

He did.....If the Fins finish better than the Bears..we move up...remember that we traded OUR 3rd round pick...not the Bear's.....

IF? So you do not know for sure. Dang. I thought Miami won the Super Bowl since you said they got a higher pick now in the 3rd. You were just assuming Miami will finish better than the Bears. This is the NFL. You never know how teams will finish except in Miami.

A good DE that seems to be a dime a dozen in our system (Owens, Bromell, Armstrong, Ogun) for Two starters and one of them is a former Pro Bowler that gives us the first threat opposite Chambers since he has been here......

I don't recall Owens, Brunell or even Mixon making the PB. Armstrong was a former 1st round pick. He had talent.

Get Real? Are you kidding? Brunell is set to have a Pro Bowl season in Washington......

Bold Prediction. He won't. He will get hurt and be average before that.

That was a weak effort.....

Nope, just pratical.

 

[Section126]

Consensus among the blind? Miami could trot out Blair Thomas and there would be some here that would be singing his praises.

Sorry, but getting the best deal available does not make one a genius. Even in football sense. A football genius would have gotten the best deal, not just the best available. You could have gotten the best available.


Flawed? How? He has been with the team for 2 years and this year they trade up to get Jackson. Once Jackson was drafted Gordon became No. 3. There is not a doubt there.

Also it tells me St. Louis did have some concerns about him whether it be ability or health.

Also what does him being drafted in the 3rd round have to do with anything?



IF? So you do not know for sure. Dang. I thought Miami won the Super Bowl since you said they got a higher pick now in the 3rd. You were just assuming Miami will finish better than the Bears. This is the NFL. You never know how teams will finish except in Miami.


I don't recall Owens, Brunell or even Mixon making the PB. Armstrong was a former 1st round pick. He had talent.



Bold Prediction. He won't. He will get hurt and be average before that.



Nope, just pratical.

An even weaker effort.

 

[Dphins4me]

An even weaker effort.

In other words. You cannot refute it.

 

[Section126]

In other words. You cannot refute it.

I already refuted it....I am not going to re-type it...you just rehashed your points....

BTW...check it out...I think Owens did make the Pro-Bowl.......so did Armstrong.....the other two guys got MASSIVE contracts because of JT...Ogun is just another one in the line.....

 

[Dphins4me]

I already refuted it...

No, you haven't. You have yet to tell me how getting the best deal available makes someone a genius? You have yet to tell me how you know that Miami got the higher of the two picks, if St. Louis gets Miami's pick?
You have yet to tell me how two backs were both thought of as Faulks replacement.

Simply calling someones post weak does not make it so, it comes off a dodging.

BTW...check it out...I think Owens did make the Pro-Bowl.........

Not in '99 or '00. The two years he was with Miami.

.so did Armstrong.............

Yes, Armstrong made it. And he was not in my post in players that did not make the PB.

.the other two guys got MASSIVE contracts because of JT...Ogun is just another one in the line.....

I would not say they were massive.

Mixon signed a 5 year deal for 17 million and he will never see the last 2 years of the deal. He basically got a 3 year deal for 8.7 million. Not massive in terms of the NFL these days.

Mixons Deal: signed a five-year, $17 million contract that includes a signing bonus of $3.4 million and base salaries of $600,000 in 2002, $2 million in 2003, $2.6 million in 2004, $3.8 million in 2005 and $4.5 million in 2006.
As for Bromell has got even less.

Bromells Deal: signed a five-year deal for $11 million, which includes a $2 million signing bonus. With incentives the contract could be worth as much as $15 million.

Again not huge. Plus he only seen 1 year of it.

 

[Kistner10]

Some people I dont get? Rick made some great moves and people are blasting him. You gotta give props when they are due. We got a PB WR and Gordon for OGun. You could also say we got Chidi and Robinson with the extra money, and we'll be able to hold on to other vetrans without OGun's big contract.
DPhins4me, do you think the Dolphins are going to suck this year?? Chicago doesn't have a lot of talent and they have a new scheme and coaching staff. Miami would have to be downright awful to be worse than the Bears. You might not like the Dolphins coaching staff and FO but there are bright sides to things. You should start looking at them.

 

[Dolphin1184]

Some people I dont get? Rick made some great moves and people are blasting him. You gotta give props when they are due. We got a PB WR and Gordon for OGun. You could also say we got Chidi and Robinson with the extra money, and we'll be able to hold on to other vetrans without OGun's big contract.
DPhins4me, do you think the Dolphins are going to suck this year?? Chicago doesn't have a lot of talent and they have a new scheme and coaching staff. Miami would have to be downright awful to be worse than the Bears. You might not like the Dolphins coaching staff and FO but there are bright sides to things. You should start looking at them.

Forget it. There exist people that will hate the FO no matter what they do. They can bring Jesus Christ to our team and there will always be 1 or 2 people to complain. Just go to the ESPN boards.

 

[Section126]

No, you haven't. You have yet to tell me how getting the best deal available makes someone a genius? BECAUSE THE WHOLE LEAGUE KNEW WHAT HE NEEDED AND WAS DETERMINED TO HOLD HIM UP, AND HE MANAGED TO GET A DEAL THAT WAS COMPARABLE TO THE TENDER HE SET OUT FOR OGUN (a 1st and a 3rd)

You have yet to tell me how you know that Miami got the higher of the two picks, if St. Louis gets Miami's pick? BECAUSE MIAMI WILL WIN MORE GAMES THAN CHICAGO.

You have yet to tell me how two backs were both thought of as Faulks replacement. BECAUSE MARTZ SAID SO, THEIR FANS THOUGHT SO AND THEIR MEDIA THOUGHT SO...AM I LEAVING ANYBODY OUT?

Simply calling someones post weak does not make it so, it comes off a dodging. OKAY...NOT WEAK....BUT SLOPPY.


Not in '99 or '00. The two years he was with Miami.

HE WAS PROBABLY NOT A PRO BOWLER, BUT HE MIGHT HAVE BEEN AN ALTERNATE...HE WAS A PRO BOWLER WITH WASHINGTON THOUGH IN 1996.

Yes, Armstrong made it. And he was not in my post in players that did not make the PB.

FAIR ENOUGH.

I would not say they were massive.

WHAT...ARE YOU RICH? LETS JUST SAY THAT THEY WERE PAID IN THE TOP 20% AT THEIR POSITION AT THE TIME. ALL BECAUSE OF JT.

.

There ya go..

 

[Dphins4me]

BECAUSE THE WHOLE LEAGUE KNEW WHAT HE NEEDED AND WAS DETERMINED TO HOLD HIM UP, AND HE MANAGED TO GET A DEAL THAT WAS COMPARABLE TO THE TENDER HE SET OUT FOR OGUN (a 1st and a 3rd)

See it a little different. No way if Booker was traded straight out Chicago would have gotten a 1st rounder for him.

Gordon while having a upside is still 2 years removed from being a 3rd round pick the fact remains he was demoted this past offseason to 3rd string.

BECAUSE MIAMI WILL WIN MORE GAMES THAN CHICAGO.

Did you also know last year that Miami would miss the playoffs? Did you know the Carolina would be in the SB? Its the NFL of today. Anything can happen. For all we know we will be watching the Bears/Dolphins in the SB.

Last year the two teams that played in the SB had combined record the year before of 16-16. (9-7/7-9)

You can only guess as to who will have the higher pick. Its a 50/50 guess.

. BECAUSE MARTZ SAID SO, THEIR FANS THOUGHT SO AND THEIR MEDIA THOUGHT SO...AM I LEAVING ANYBODY OUT?.

Well as long as they thought so. Fans are always known for having inside knowledge. Coaches are always known for telling the truth and the media is always known for being correct.

OKAY...NOT WEAK....BUT SLOPPY..

Only reason you say things like this is because you know I will and can back it up.

HE WAS PROBABLY NOT A PRO BOWLER, BUT HE MIGHT HAVE BEEN AN ALTERNATE...HE WAS A PRO BOWLER WITH WASHINGTON THOUGH IN 1996...

You are hung up on alternates being Pro Bowlers. Owens never made a trip to Hawaii to play in the game. I'll leave it at that.

WHAT...ARE YOU RICH? LETS JUST SAY THAT THEY WERE PAID IN THE TOP 20% AT THEIR POSITION AT THE TIME. ALL BECAUSE OF JT....

Obviously you missed the part where I said "In NFL terms"

Of course they were in the top 20. Anyone that signs a deal slightly above the minimum covers that.

 

[igor79]

In retrospect, I think it's time to give Spielman a thread on his accomplishments during this off-season. Some may not notice because of all the negativity not only from the media, but our fans too :shakeno: , that Rick Spielman has been working extremely to keep this team going forward. Now I won't make a judgment on these people until they have played, but looking at the list, you cannot blame Rick for a lack of effort in his first year as our GM.

2004 Draft "Notables"
Vernon Carey
Will Poole
Tony Bua
Derrick Pope

Off-Season Acquisition "Notables"
Jeno James
John St. Clair
Damion McIntosh
AJ Feeley
David Boston
Marty Booker
Bryan Gilmore
Lamar Gordon
Chris Atkins
Antuan Edwards
Reggie Howard
Sammy Morris

Excuse me if I left anyone out worth mentioning because I'm typing this list from memory, but D@MN, that is a pretty impressive list. With all the negativity going on, I didn't realize all the young talent we've added on this team until I came up with this list. All these guys to go along w/Chambers, McMicheal, Kendall Newsome and Leonard Henry, gives us a very bright future and a lot to look forward to. All of these players will contribute to this team's success in the future. The success will not come over night, but the foundation has been laid and it's obvious. Just be patient and you will see it revealing right in front of you this season.

I've notice his strategy is "acquiring" good young talent with some NFL exposure to speed up the improvement on the offense, while keeping our veteran corp in tact on defense. But, he's been improving our defensive depth through the draft with good young talent, so when it's time to replace our aging vets; we won't miss a beat. In my opinon, it's an excellent strategy that will work. I don't expect a lot this year from our team (at least a .500 season), but from Rick Spielman's efforts, I look forward to watching this team gel together and progress forward.

We might have a sub par season to our standards, but this team will be a force in 2005. Don't get me wrong on this, I'll be cheering, yelling just like all the Fin faithful, but I will not be disappointed if we don't make the playoffs. Unlike a lot of us on this board, through all the negativity, I see a lot of positive in this off season. Thanks RS. :D Keep up the good work.

you forgot rex hadnot - hes going to be a beast

 

[Champion]

Well if he thought Davis/Suggs was better.......how is he a genius? That makes no sense.

Davis is on par with Derrius Thompson. And Suggs is always hurt and might even miss this weeks game. So, in return for O-Gun we could have got an injured RB and another Derrius Thompson. Yet, we got Chicago's #1 and a RB with big-time potential just needing an opportunity.

IM not knocking Rick, don't get me wrong here. Im just saying I would say he was more lucky than genius these past few weeks. You make your own luck and Rick will get all of the credit if these moves pan out, but if Cleveland said yes to Davis/Suggs........then we never see Booker (who is clearly better than Davis) and we don't get Gordon (who might be comperable to Suggs or maybe looked at as slightly less.

Mike O...Luck is when Opportunity meets Preparation. These trades happened because RS was prepared for them and the opportunity(other teams willing to deal) existed also.

Dphins4me...You suck. :splat: Just about all I ever see from you are posts bashing everything anyone says positive about the Miami Dolphins organization.:shakeno: It is embarrasing to me that you claim to be a Dolphins fan too.

 

[davster82]

Excellent post for such a new poster. Good call on Dphins.

 

[Dphins4me]

Dphins4me...You suck.

Think long and hard before coming up with something so clever? How did you ever come up with something so orginal? I wish I could be that creative.

By the way. Learn to read more.

I may not say the things you wish to read about the Phins, but everything I post can and has been backed up with knowledgable thought. Just because I'm not a Pollyanna and think GM's are geniuses for getting a deal that is the best available does not mean I suck (As you put it)

I will knock and I will defend the Phins. Not my fault you only pay attention to the knock post. For one, I have posted that the Gordon trade was a good trade, but I guess you missed that one. I just do not think it makes RS a genius for it.

Now, go think up something more original than "I suck" :roflmao: For some reason I feel like I'm in HS.

 

[Dphins4me]

Excellent post for such a new poster. Good call on Dphins.

I guess I'm public enemy No. 1 here.

Good.

Someone needs to open the pollyanna eyes around here.