Nate Burleson on Daunte and the Wonderlic

[Donte Whitner]

If you saw "Heart of a Champion", you heard Jaworski confirm that Danny wasn't a typical "student of the game". Dan couln't give you all the x's and o's, couldn't break down analytically coverage schemes or teach it to someone, he just SAW it, he cut thorugh it with his uncanny vision and lightning reflex action. No, Dan wasn't an "intellectual" (the wonderlich scores hint at this; Ricky is somewhat of an "intellectual" or "cerebral" type), but it didn't matter. These minute analyses of the length of the hypotenuse etc were of no use to Dan.
I loved the story of Dan getting bored at an offensive meeting: "Who cares about running plays, just let me throw it!" Or some such comment.
:dolphins:

Thats why he only went to 1 championship! :wink:

 

[DolphinzD]

Thats why he only went to 1 championship! :wink:

Yeah, I'm sure it had nothing to do with the terrible defenses and non-existent running games the Dolphins had during his best years.

 

[Donte Whitner]

Yeah, I'm sure it had nothing to do with the terrible defenses and non-existent running games the Dolphins had during his best years.

Nope it's cause the Bills are in your division.

 

[phintastic]

Just because someone smokes funny cigarettes doesn't mean they are stupid or less intelligent. If you listen to the way Ricky speaks, many players (Vick, Moss, Chad Johnson, and the English language master Vince "straight from the ghetto" Young) would be looked at in different lights if they spoke as well as Ricky does.

Just because someone speaks ghetto doesn't mean they are stupid or less intelligent.

Ricky has a debt over $8 million because of stupid decisions. He has 4 illigitimate kids that all cost him big bucks. He failed 4 NFL drug tests. He used a rapper to help him with his first NFL contract. He publicly stated that weed helps more than Paxil with Social Anxiety disorder, which is about as stupid as it gets. He wore a wedding dress for ESPN magazine. He is in a yoga cult. He trusted Dan LeBatard.

Stupid is as stupid does.

 

[ckparrothead]

Having a high IQ or wonderlic doesn't necessarily mean you make the right choices. It could just mean you make the wrong choices, but faster than the average man

I'd have to hear exactly what Burleson was saying. I don't think Daunte scored particularly high on that test. And, I do agree that the wonderlic isn't a good measure to determine how good a QB will be. But, it is a good measure to determine how bad he will be. The test is rightly viewed as a standard minimum, kind of a first warning for you to go back and research the guy's history.

To say that a guy will be a better QB because he scored a 31 as opposed to a 21, is not correct...of course.

But to say that a guy will probably never be a good QB period because he scored a 7, is correct.

It's a piece of the puzzle. In Vince Young's case, the wonderlic fiasco should have been putting into perspective for teams exactly why Mack Brown was forced to convert his offense from the Bible to the Children's Bible with the one-read-then-run system. In Danny Marino's case, the lower wonderlic makes you check out the history and see if there were any signs that he had trouble understanding offenses or if he ever had to have anything dumbed down for him. He didn't, so you move on. Of course, he didn't score a damn 7 either.

 

[Phinja]

Nope it's cause the Bills are in your division.

Your right. You guys went to 4 SuperBowls... wow!


How many have the Jills EVER won? 0. And it dosnt look like thats gonna change any time soon.

 

[PaulWarfield#42]

Thats why he only went to 1 championship! :wink:

Ah, the life of a troll. And I think I'm squandering precious moments of the payroll being a phanatic of my team... :rolleyes2

I do, to dignify your Trollness with a reply, recall with pleasure the 20-odd games in a row my Phins slaughtered your silly Jills. Jack Kemp, indeed. :shakeno:

 

[finfan54]

Lienart's 35 is something to boast about. Maybe Culpepper thinks a 21 suggests he's an intelligent guy? I wouldn't say Pep is as intelligent as Ricky or Harrington, however, I do believe his athletic ability will overcome his lack of intelligence.

Who says he has a lack of intelligence? I think a lack of intelligence is all in what your refering to. There are said to be 8 different intelligences by some guy from Cornell University. There is way too much emphasis put on these wonderlic scores. It seems to me that it is a different kind of test.


When it comes to football or anything else for that matter, it is repetition that is what becomes knowledge. I believe DC's success in the past means he repetitively did very well. He learned something and quite frankly, learned it kind of fast dont ya think? You not only have to learn how to do something, but you need to become one of the best so that you know what it takes so that you dont forget what it is that got you there. I think the guys intelligence is great considering he became his own agent and controlled his own destiny and screwed the organization that tried to screw him.There is your intelligence.

 

[finfan54]

Having a high IQ or wonderlic doesn't necessarily mean you make the right choices. It could just mean you make the wrong choices, but faster than the average man

I'd have to hear exactly what Burleson was saying. I don't think Daunte scored particularly high on that test. And, I do agree that the wonderlic isn't a good measure to determine how good a QB will be. But, it is a good measure to determine how bad he will be. The test is rightly viewed as a standard minimum, kind of a first warning for you to go back and research the guy's history.

To say that a guy will be a better QB because he scored a 31 as opposed to a 21, is not correct...of course.

But to say that a guy will probably never be a good QB period because he scored a 7, is correct.

It's a piece of the puzzle. In Vince Young's case, the wonderlic fiasco should have been putting into perspective for teams exactly why Mack Brown was forced to convert his offense from the Bible to the Children's Bible with the one-read-then-run system. In Danny Marino's case, the lower wonderlic makes you check out the history and see if there were any signs that he had trouble understanding offenses or if he ever had to have anything dumbed down for him. He didn't, so you move on. Of course, he didn't score a damn 7 either.

I wonder what Matt Millens wonderlic score was.

 

[finfan54]

Just because someone speaks ghetto doesn't mean they are stupid or less intelligent.

Ricky has a debt over $8 million because of stupid decisions. He has 4 illigitimate kids that all cost him big bucks. He failed 4 NFL drug tests. He used a rapper to help him with his first NFL contract. He publicly stated that weed helps more than Paxil with Social Anxiety disorder, which is about as stupid as it gets. He wore a wedding dress for ESPN magazine. He is in a yoga cult. He trusted Dan LeBatard.

Stupid is as stupid does.

Is it stupid decisions as much as it is that money does not control him? Or Dave Wannstedt using you as a battering ram makes you stupid for the way you dealt with something that you no longer wanted to do? Stupidity is in the eye of the beholder. I think alot of people who think Ricky is stupid can be just as stupid or make crappy decisions as him, yet they are not in the public eye, so you dont look at yourself in the same light, you only see whats in front of you and dont see yourself but do not have the complete story as to how or why things develope.

I think alot of 17-23 year olds are stupid. some even older. That doesnt make them stupid forever.

 

[Tenacious D/O]

Just because someone speaks ghetto doesn't mean they are stupid or less intelligent.

Ricky has a debt over $8 million because of stupid decisions. He has 4 illigitimate kids that all cost him big bucks. He failed 4 NFL drug tests. He used a rapper to help him with his first NFL contract. He publicly stated that weed helps more than Paxil with Social Anxiety disorder, which is about as stupid as it gets. He wore a wedding dress for ESPN magazine. He is in a yoga cult. He trusted Dan LeBatard.

Stupid is as stupid does.

I'm sorry, but yes it does. Anyone who can barely complete a sentence or sound relatively intelligent is considered a moron in my opinion. Vince Young, Randy Moss, and Chad Johnson are morons. They simply are athletic machines that have one gift in life and that's their athletic ability. They speak ebonics that was taught to them in the ghettos of their respective areas and they decided to go along with it and never learn standardized english. Its thier choice and they have made enough money for it never to matter, however, it showed how very stupid they really are. If I had all that money I'd be going to Harvard in the offseason to improve myself. These guys have no desire to be intelligent, hence they are stupid.

 

[Kinzua]

Here's a site that lists QBs' Wonderlic scores going back to Terry Bradshaw in 1970 http://www.unc.edu/~mirabile/Wonderlic.htm. I've never seen the Wonderlic test, but if it's a very short test and timed, so an individual's scores can vary widely depending on how he feels in that approximately 10-15 minutes that he takes the test. I've never seen one, but I think it's purpose is to identify how well a player should be able to grasp the football "playbook". In that aspect, it probably favors the bright, well-read, well-coached (usually big time programs) youngsters over those from lesser schools who aren't academically inclined. It probably also favors young men who have a learning style more attuned to academia than to young men who prefer "hands-on" training.

Some examples:

2004 Eli Manning 39 -- Ben Roethlisberger 25
2003 Carson Palmer 26 -- Byron Leftwich 25 -- Chris Simms 22
2002 Joey Harrington 32 -- Patrick Ramsey -- 32 -- Craig Nall 31
2001 Drew Brees 28 -- Michael Vick -- 20
2000 Tom Brady 33 -- Chad Pennington -- 25
1999 Daunte Culpepper 18 -- Donovan McNabb 14
1998 Matt Hasselback 29 -- Peyton Manning 28
1997 Kerry Collins 30 -- Rob Johnson 26 -- Steve McNair 15
1993 Drew Bledsoe 36 -- Brunelle 22
1991 Brett Favre 22
1990 Jeff George 10
1989 Troy Aikman 29 -- Rodney Peete 26
1984 Steve Young 33
1983 John Elway 29 -- Jim Kelly 15 -- Dan Marino 15
1977 Vince Edwards 8
1970 Terry Bradshaw 15

 

[popularwar]

Just because someone speaks ghetto doesn't mean they are stupid or less intelligent.

Ricky has a debt over $8 million because of stupid decisions. He has 4 illigitimate kids that all cost him big bucks. He failed 4 NFL drug tests. He used a rapper to help him with his first NFL contract. He publicly stated that weed helps more than Paxil with Social Anxiety disorder, which is about as stupid as it gets. He wore a wedding dress for ESPN magazine. He is in a yoga cult. He trusted Dan LeBatard.

Stupid is as stupid does.

Stupid decisions don't make someone stupid. Albert Einstein failed math all through school, probably because he didn't apply himself. You think he's stupid?
Also, I think most of your points are pretty weak.
A rapper helped him get a contract? So what? I don't know which rapper you're talking about but there are many rappers who have proven to be business moguls, Master P comes to mind (record labels, clothing lines, real estate companies, promotion agencies, etc.)
He said weed helps more than Paxil. I think he would know, he's the one dealing with Social Anxiety Disorder. While I don't condone drug use in any way, I assume marijuana did help him deal with his problems more bcause he chose it over prescription drugs. Again, I'm not saying smoking marijuana is a good thing but I think his point is valid and no one could tell him otherwise because he's the only one who really feels the effects.
He wore a wedding dress... How is that stupid? It was a joke. It was funny. I thought it was hilarious and I didn't think it meant he was crazy or stupid, I took as Ricky Williams having a sense of humor.
He is not in a yoga cult, he practices yoga.

Dan LeBatard is a dick, I won't argue anything there.

 

[tcdrover]

Millen went to Penn State, but he was a linebacker so his wunderlick didn't really matter anyway....


Ricky Williams is a very bright guy, you don't have to know what his wunderlick score was to be able to distinguish this. Just look at or read his interviews.

When he started playing he kept an online journal & when he came to Miami he had a website for a while. He writes very well, and spoke very intelligently about life in general not just football. Obviously he has his issues, the Paxil move was one of them IMHO.

Another thing to keep in mind is that someone's intelligence and how well they actually do in life don't always (or even usually) go hand in hand.

I'll be honest, I find it hard to think of someone as intelligent when I hear them speaking in (BAD) 4th grade English. I remember when Ricky came out he seemed SOOOO much brighter than Edgerin James, but the Edge has made great career moves every step of the way & Ricky obviously has struggled...

:dolphins:

 

[popularwar]

These guys have no desire to be intelligent, hence they are stupid.

I would say ignorant.