Orande!!!

[MDFINFAN]

Originally posted by Muck
Sorry guys, but I'll beat my dead horse again. We're always gonna have Kendall Newsome's and Robert Baker's in camp every year. I'll take OG over those guys. Guys who likely will never be anywhere near as good a receiver. It's not like we don't have young, potential types on the roster. Chambers, Thompson, Tolver are enough for me.

And nowhere in stone does it say that OG's gauranteed a roster spot. The best players will make the team. But my money says he RIGHTFULLY makes the squad.

All this spitefulness just gets on my nerves sometimes.

Muck, you know we disagree on this one, OG is over his TIME..Baker has never had the chance OG has, not because Baker is good, he's had great PS's..but it's been a numbers game for him. I think he could have made as many plays as OG, if given the same opportunity..OG has not RIGHTFULLY earn a spot. Sometimes we have to move on..The receivers of the last couple of years just haven't gotten it done, like it or not, he's one who has great catches, but don't scare any team, hence all took a pass on him when they had more than amble opportunity. He's slow..I've beat this dead horse, but DT and Tolver gives us the same as OG. You haven't seen DT like I have and don't know..This is one of the reasons, I'm willing to take a chance on Baker or Newson and Tolver. If you'd seen DT last year more, you'd understand.

 

[xiidaen]

Actually, the option I like is Oronde being used much like McK was last season -- that is, not at all for the early part. That allows us to focus on the best of CC, McK and DT, with OG and Toliver in reserve. Then, hopefully the depth relief that OG brings allows him to use the circus catches later in the season when we need them.

I don't think Baker has it in the squad, but I'll happily be wrong. As I said before he's hired if there are people playing better than OG, that's fine, we then have better players. But Toliver hasn't played a down yet, and I don't have faith in the Baker, Newson, etc crowd at this point. Give me CC, McK, DT, OG and Toliver and I'm more than happy.

 

[MDFINFAN]

Originally posted by xiidaen
Actually, the option I like is Oronde being used much like McK was last season -- that is, not at all for the early part. That allows us to focus on the best of CC, McK and DT, with OG and Toliver in reserve. Then, hopefully the depth relief that OG brings allows him to use the circus catches later in the season when we need them.

I don't think Baker has it in the squad, but I'll happily be wrong. As I said before he's hired if there are people playing better than OG, that's fine, we then have better players. But Toliver hasn't played a down yet, and I don't have faith in the Baker, Newson, etc crowd at this point. Give me CC, McK, DT, OG and Toliver and I'm more than happy.

This is an old story for me and Muck and Prime Time will kill me for it, but OG is the same as DT and Tolver, Baker had a great PS last year, couldn't beat AJ for the kick return..Plus Baker injury history, imo, had Wanny nervous, Baker caught the one pass thrown to him last year vs NE..but for some reason, got no more tries. BTW, the catch he did make was pretty good, sidelines with the feet work, that plus his PS, and now his 2nd year off the ACL, the way he dominated NFLE, convince me this guy can play and make plays, like McK did last year, I think he's ready. We only have 2 speedsters on the team at WR, CC and McK, one gets hurt, then we have to have a slower receiver opposite CC or McK. This allows the D to play up on that side..Ricky ran crazy last year at the end when CC and McK was on the field, Teams had to respect their speed, left big lanes for Ricky..Look at Dallas SB years, both Haper and Irvin had speed. The ony reason DT is here instead of Washington is Coles is faster with the same height and good hands. Spriuer (sp) went for the faster guy, speed does kill in this league and allows big plays, ala, Mck. last year..Since we have DT and Tolver, same height and goods hands as OG, I prefer to have the speedster as a extra backup, in case of CC or Mck getting injured..Keeps teams D earness...Well that's it for this, I guess me and couple of other people on this board sees what I see, maybe if some go back and watch the Marks Brothers with Marino, or Moulds and Price from last year, then you'll see why I want the 2 speedster starting CC and McK..I just think it open up this O. I'll say this again, why do you guys think no other team took OG..no one has answered that yet, but you want him, why?

 

[MDFINFAN]

Put it this way:
OG 5 year starter, most yards 803 in 1999
Most TD's 7 1998
Last 4 years: Yards: 803, 786, 674, 228..5 year total: 3204, Price had 1272 last year as a number 2..and OG had Dan, so don't go to the Drew vs. Jay thing.
DT last year in first 6 games as a 3rd rec. 14 rec. 167yds 1 TD avg 11.9
OG first 6 games as a starter: 16 rec 228yds no TD's avg. 14.3
DT for the year: Rec 53 Yards 773 avg14.6 lg47 TD4 First year of real playing, who has more up side? His catches were the OG type.

OG lack of speed and ability to get deep or inability keeps him from being a thread, he's only had 9 reception of more than 40 yards in 5 years. It's time we get new blood..I bet Baker would have had more than this if he was in OG's shoes. And they won't be in our camps forever.

Now I'm finished

 

[Danny]

as long as we give Tolver a real chance to show what he can do then Gasden being back is ok with me.

Ozzy rules!!

 

[Prime Time]

Originally posted by MDFINFAN


You got that right, we won't cut him no matter what...unfortunately...The Big punk costs us our younger more potential types at the end of his career, and we know how hard it is to find a receiver in Miami. You guys knew I had to give my 2 cents.:D I know you're coming after me Prime Time, I just had to get minds in first..

:yell: Let's not get into that again! And yes he will make this team no matter what. I predict him having 400+ yards and 3 TDs with a handful of one handed grabs. MD!!!!! I am getting riled up from re-reading your post! :fire:

 

[MDFINFAN]

Originally posted by Prime Time



:yell: Let's not get into that again! And yes he will make this team no matter what. I predict him having 400+ yards and 3 TDs with a handful of one handed grabs. MD!!!!! I am getting riled up from re-reading your post! :fire:

What took you sooooo long. I couldn't believe I was able to get so many jabs at him before you responded..:tongue: I wasn't going to say anything, but you took a jab in another post and I got riled up and then I came back to this post and started on him..DT will have a lot of one handers too. How ever it goes, I just want to get to the SB..while I don't think OG will help us that much, I just hope CC. Mck, and DT keeps him off the field and don't get hurt..If we only keep 4, I feel for Tolver, Baker and Newson and Jackson..I just think they're better play makers imho.
But I'm glad we have enough talent to even debate about..OG not included.

 

[Prime Time]

Originally posted by MDFINFAN


This is an old story for me and Muck and Prime Time will kill me for it, but OG is the same as DT and Tolver, Baker had a great PS last year, couldn't beat AJ for the kick return..Plus Baker injury history, imo, had Wanny nervous, Baker caught the one pass thrown to him last year vs NE..but for some reason, got no more tries. BTW, the catch he did make was pretty good, sidelines with the feet work, that plus his PS, and now his 2nd year off the ACL, the way he dominated NFLE, convince me this guy can play and make plays, like McK did last year, I think he's ready. We only have 2 speedsters on the team at WR, CC and McK, one gets hurt, then we have to have a slower receiver opposite CC or McK. This allows the D to play up on that side..Ricky ran crazy last year at the end when CC and McK was on the field, Teams had to respect their speed, left big lanes for Ricky..Look at Dallas SB years, both Haper and Irvin had speed. The ony reason DT is here instead of Washington is Coles is faster with the same height and good hands. Spriuer (sp) went for the faster guy, speed does kill in this league and allows big plays, ala, Mck. last year..Since we have DT and Tolver, same height and goods hands as OG, I prefer to have the speedster as a extra backup, in case of CC or Mck getting injured..Keeps teams D earness...Well that's it for this, I guess me and couple of other people on this board sees what I see, maybe if some go back and watch the Marks Brothers with Marino, or Moulds and Price from last year, then you'll see why I want the 2 speedster starting CC and McK..I just think it open up this O. I'll say this again, why do you guys think no other team took OG..no one has answered that yet, but you want him, why?

I tried to ignore it! I really did! But I cannot help myself.

DT is a newer OG yes you are right. He is faster and younger too. Let's say him and CC line up as Week 1 Starters. Then we have our speedy guy, and our possesion guy. Now we need a speedy guy for picking up 1st downs on 3rd downs and on 3 WR sets. McKnight is that guy! He has speed and has a mismatch against almost every Nickel Back in the NFL (besides Buckley ). Then let's say we have a 4th and long...3rd/4th and 16 or so. Now we need another possesion guy to be our 4th string. Guys who can make great grabs to pick up the first downss. Gadsden brings that. He can make great one handed grabs if the balls are thrown anywhere in his perimeter. Now, he will not burn anyone....but we are not asking him too, we are simply asking him to make the grab behind the first down marker to keep our drive alive and keep Royals off the field (big relief for some of you :tongue: ). Can you say that Newson or Baker can make that grab? No because every year we give them a chance and yet they don't do squat. Baker had 1 catch for 17 yards last year (in a game which he was 3rd string)...woohoo! OG knows this system better than any other WR because he has been here longer than anyone. If we want guys with potential, then we draft a guy in round 1 or round 2 of our future drafts. I'm done now :tongue: .

 

[MDFINFAN]

Know you're not, OG don't know this system because he's been here longer, this is just year 2 of this O..and OG missed most of year 1. To get 3rd and 15, we don't have all year for OG to get down field. Baker made the most of what he got last year. You have to start somewhere, and when he got his chance, he delivered. You really want to 2 speed guys to start and you possession reciever to come in on 3rd downs. The speed guys keep the safeties deep and Ricky can run to day light and pick up 8 yards before the safties meet him like last year when CC and McK was starting..So if CC and McK start, keeps safties deep and DT come in a get 15 yards when you need them, then you've got something..As you said DT is faster than OG..gets down field, uses his body good, has great hands, and can all of what OG does and more. PT this is a good subject, but we will continue to disagree, it just that in all my years the Irvins and Harpers, and Moulds and Prices, Holt and the other speedster , the Marks brothers for Miami, has shown me this is the better combo to open offenses and keep D's earnest. These combo moved the ball and score TD's. I just think Baker is ready that's all, I think will be too, pretty soon. Zach was a 5th rounder, Randy a 4th..Drafting status don't say how well a player will perform in the NFL..year after year should have taught you that..but I'm glad you responded now I'm done too. LOL

 

[Prime Time]

This is going to be a 10 page post with us two arguing . OG is better than Baker IMO. I mean he can make one handed grabs, have you ever seen Baker make a one handed grab Vs a NFL CB? No....he has one catch on his whole career. If Baker plays "as good as you say" OG will be gone and Baker will be here. No doubt we are keeping 5 WRs, they will be....CC,DT,McK,OG,Tolver.

 

[Dol-Fan Dupree]

Has Baker ever quit on his team when they needed him the most?

 

[MDFINFAN]

Originally posted by Prime Time
This is going to be a 10 page post with us two arguing . OG is better than Baker IMO. I mean he can make one handed grabs, have you ever seen Baker make a one handed grab Vs a NFL CB? No....he has one catch on his whole career. If Baker plays "as good as you say" OG will be gone and Baker will be here. No doubt we are keeping 5 WRs, they will be....CC,DT,McK,OG,Tolver.

I didn't think you were posting on this subject anymore So I didn't look back at it..Yes Baker made a one handed grab on a NFL cb last PS, it was a thing of beauty, Lucas threw it, and Baker grab it over his head, one handed. Hopefully you're right, Baker has the better camp and OG's gone, but you and I know that won't happen. I'm not sure about the 5 WR's, unless you count Rogers as one..They may only keep 4 and include Rogers as a rb\wr..there's still speculation on that one. So Tolver, Baker, Newson, and Jackson maybe a numbers game again. If we keep OG, that's 2 speed guys and 1 and a 1/2 possession type guys, DT is faster, so I weighted the speed on his side. I wish our team veiwed OG the way the other 31 teams did.:D

 

[GazPhin]

One thing that seems to have been overlooked...

in this analysis of OG's abilities vs the rest of the potential guys is that OG is well like and respected by the players he'll be around. He would have to have a real bad camp to not be on the roster (even if there are some "upstarts" who make some spectacular plays). I'm not saying for a moment that it's right, but it may well be the case.

In an off-season that has been about getting veteran depth, he has to be an odds-on favourite to make the cut.

 

[Scrap]

Originally posted by MDFINFAN


I didn't think you were posting on this subject anymore So I didn't look back at it..Yes Baker made a one handed grab on a NFL cb last PS, it was a thing of beauty, Lucas threw it, and Baker grab it over his head, one handed. Hopefully you're right, Baker has the better camp and OG's gone, but you and I know that won't happen. I'm not sure about the 5 WR's, unless you count Rogers as one..They may only keep 4 and include Rogers as a rb\wr..there's still speculation on that one. So Tolver, Baker, Newson, and Jackson maybe a numbers game again. If we keep OG, that's 2 speed guys and 1 and a 1/2 possession type guys, DT is faster, so I weighted the speed on his side. I wish our team veiwed OG the way the other 31 teams did.:D

If he can catch something Lucas threw, wouldn't he be a better cornerback?

 

[Chubby]

I HAVE TO AGREE WITH MD WE need to line up speedy receivers at the corners to have a chance to win this year. We can now do that with a combination of CC,JM,JT(If he deserves the spot) or one of the training camp lifers. And then bring in DT in the slot position for that Third threat on third downs which should belong to our TE or FB. OG does not belong in the starting lineup. if we must keep him than bring him in short yardage situations opposite DT, with our te and fb and rb. That way the defense will have no clue as whether we will run or pass.