(Part I) Post Defending Ireland / (Part II) Post Criticizing Ireland (Objective Take)

[ProStyle]

Good post. He did some good things but did much more bad. He needs to go. Six year record of personnel movement speaks for itself. He is inept and a problem of r the team moving forward.

 

[JTC111]

Heres a list of our second round picks since Ireland was hired as general manager:

Phillip Merling
Chad Henne
Pat White
Sean Smith
Koa Misi
Daniel Thomas
Jamar Taylor

That's depressing.

 

[PhinSoldia]

That's depressing.

I dont understand why, outside of Merling and White the last four are contributing,

Misi did well with out move from 3-4 to 4-3
Sean Smith came into his own last year in a Dolphin Uniform, still with some mistakes
Danial Thomas is injury prone and STILL runs hard
Jamar Taylor...really?

 

[JTC111]

I dont understand why, outside of Merling and White the last four are contributing,

Misi did well with out move from 3-4 to 4-3
Sean Smith came into his own last year in a Dolphin Uniform, still with some mistakes
Danial Thomas is injury prone and STILL runs hard
Jamar Taylor...really?

Like I said somewhere else on here today, I can't get as excited about mediocrity as some of you. "Contributing" isn't the word I want to hear being used to describe half of our last 7 second round picks.

 

[phishxhead]

I dont understand why, outside of Merling and White the last four are contributing,

Misi did well with out move from 3-4 to 4-3
Sean Smith came into his own last year in a Dolphin Uniform, still with some mistakes
Danial Thomas is injury prone and STILL runs hard
Jamar Taylor...really?

Depressing because out of all those picks the only thing we have to show for it is ONE very average non-playmaking LB.

 

[Kencoboy]

Great post. This was supposed to be his make-or-break year. The free-agent signings I can argue for one side or the other. The draft....we now have the 3rd pick in the 2013 draft playing mostly on special teams. We have 2 CB's who are impersonating Waldo (we can't find them either). We have a 3rd round OT/OG who can't crack the starting lineup of possible the worst OL in the league. Need I go on. In the year we had to have rookie help there is none, and at some point the cycle has to end. Ireland must go. This year.

 

[LacesOutTanne34]

Like I said somewhere else on here today, I can't get as excited about mediocrity as some of you.

No one is getting excited about mediocrity, but in the NFL today you rise above mediocrity with ONE position the QB. And we may now have one. Ireland could have drafted the greatest teams, but he inherited Chad Henne...and Now a 2nd year qb. When was the last team to win a sb with a not great qb? The bucs with Brad Johnson? Since then Brady, Brees, Rodgers, Mannings. I guess you can argue Flacco, but during playoffs last year he played like an elite qb

 

[phishxhead]

No one is getting excited about mediocrity, but in the NFL today you rise above mediocrity with ONE position the QB. And we may now have one. Ireland could have drafted the greatest teams, but he inherited Chad Henne...and Now a 2nd year qb. When was the last team to win a sb with a not great qb? The bucs with Brad Johnson? Since then Brady, Brees, Rodgers, Mannings. I guess you can argue Flacco, but during playoffs last year he played like an elite qb

I agree you need a QB, but all those teams had other elite players at other positions, what elite talent and what depth has Ireland drafted to build the rest of the team with? Quit making excuses for his GMing.

 

[JTC111]

...in the NFL today you rise above mediocrity with ONE position the QB.

That's one piece to the puzzle, not the entire puzzle.

 

[LacesOutTanne34]

I agree you need a QB, but all those teams had other elite players at other positions, what elite talent and what depth has Ireland drafted to build the rest of the team with? Quit making excuses for his GMing.

I'm not making excuses I'm just being rational in terms of what is actually HIS fault. And clearly my post brings up many things I think are his fault. I am in now way saying he has been great, but I am also saying I don't think he has been as bad as people think

 

[JTC111]

I'm not making excuses I'm just being rational in terms of what is actually HIS fault. And clearly my post brings up many things I think are his fault. I am in now way saying he has been great, but I am also saying I don't think he has been as bad as people think

Ummm... it has taken him 5 years to turn a 7-9 team into a 7-9 team.
Jeff Ireland should have been the next Doctor Who because, for this team, he's made time stand still.

 

[Spesh]

I dont understand why, outside of Merling and White the last four are contributing,

Misi did well with out move from 3-4 to 4-3
Sean Smith came into his own last year in a Dolphin Uniform, still with some mistakes
Danial Thomas is injury prone and STILL runs hard
Jamar Taylor...really?

Value matters.

We are paying premium dollar for mediocre production. We can get all of that "contribution" for a hell of a lot less cost. If those were 4th and 5th round picks it wouldnt be an issue.

I swear this front office has hoodwinked people into accepting mediocrity. People need to stop settling for and justifying "average". You dont get Superbowl rings with "average", you get .500 seasons. "Contributing" shouldnt be something to strive for, it should be the bare minimum requirement for keeping their jobs.

 

[roy_miami]

I'm not making excuses I'm just being rational in terms of what is actually HIS fault. And clearly my post brings up many things I think are his fault. I am in now way saying he has been great, but I am also saying I don't think he has been as bad as people think

In my opinion he's way worse than the average fan thinks he is. Our offense is the worst its been in the history of the franchise so how can you explain this chart if its not the talent Ireland has brought in? Is Philbin/Sherman the worst coaches we've ever had? Is Tannehill the worst QB we've ever had? My vote is that Ireland is the worst GM we've ever had and probably one of the worst GMs in league history.

 

[spiketex]

Part I: Why Ireland did a good enough job this year.
1. What would our record be with Dustin Keller? Charles Clay has been decent, but Keller is the TE we needed who could make big plays in the MIDDLE of the field. We desperately need(ed) a TE to split the field which would also spread the D out to help our WR's. He could have been huge for Tannehill.

2. What would our record be with Brandon Gibson healthy? The Tampa game and especially last game we needed to convert third downs in the third and it didn't happen. Gibson was an excellent wr for Tanne on 3rd down and he and Gibson were really in a groove when he got injured.

3. He made a great signing in Brent Grimes: He has been the best corner we have had in a long time.

4. I know many of you dislike him but I still like the Wallace signing: He wasn't brought here for just this year, he is still young and he and Tanne will play together for awhile and as chemistry/experience build we will see many more games like last week. Yes. he's expensive but the cheaper alternative was greg jennings who is older and less talented.

ARGUMENT: We have had the lead or been tied in the 4th quarter in 4 of our games and it is entirely possible that with Keller, Gibson and mistakes ON THE FIELD (ie fumbles, drops etc) this team could be 7-4 or at very least 6-5. Ok so those players get hurt, it can still be argued that this whole scandal could have cost us a win or two. With a 2nd year Qb/coach that record would show excellent progress and one could still argue we have shown good progress. Our losses have been so demoralizing that it is easy to miss the big picture, and that is that this team progressed this year and could be pretty damn could next year if the right holes are mended. With a 2nd year qb did you truly expect us to be an elite team and is it really his fault that we aren't over .500?

Part II: Why Ireland should be on hot seat.
1. What is a big thing this current team is missing? Oh that's right ANY PRODUCTION from last year's draft class! With our offseason acquisitions we could easily have a better record if our draft class was strong....I still like the Dion Jordan pick because I believe he can at LEAST be an above average pass rusher next year, BUT where is Davis? Taylor? and if Gillislee is truly not better than Daniel Thomas then he should just quit football now.

2. He seriously undervalued Reggie Bush because he overvalued lamar miller. I still think Miller could be a productive back behind a good o-line, but there is little question that Reggie would have made this team much better. He might not have put up the number he is in Det, but he would have made the run game better, while also making the passing game better just by the threat of him running.

3. Poor job of building o-line: This is self-explanatory. I can see logic in why he didn't resign Long, but I would have gladly contributed Phillip Wheeler's money to ensure at least a solid LT rather than gambling with Martin and Clabo. One could question the pass of an OT at the 3rd pick. But aside from the pick there was much better OL on f.a than Tyson Clabo.

4. Sturgis: 20/26 Carpenter: 22/24. Look I think Sturgis is good, but was saving 2m dollars worth a 5th round pick with no guarantee he would be better. (not huge point, but a point)

ARGUMENT: The biggest argument against him that he chose to gamble on Lamar Miller/Thomas and our O-line. And both have been AWFUL. He went on the assumption that we would at least be ok at each position or even slightly below average, in reality these decisions have clearly cost us wins. Just like the above argument, it can easily be argued that this team could be 7-4 or at very least 6-5 if these positions were even decent. We new last off season would be huge because of the money we had but also our excess of draft picks. And those draft picks have been AWFUL. I don't mind Jordan, because his skill set is rare, special and important for a defense, but he has struck out in getting CB's so I don't have to puke watching Nolan Carroll play or even a high potential lineman. It was a huge mistake to give Wheeler and to a lesser extent Ellerbe thinking their impact would be significant enough to gamble on the o-line while letting Reggie walk. And these decisions have cost us dearly.

What do you think?

Excellent objective assessment Lacesout. A few general comments:
- Jamar Taylor has been a disappointment to date but this has more to do with his physical health. He can still be very good, but let's see him next year with a full training camp, etc. In contrast, Will Davis was terrific in training camp with so many interceptions, but I get the impression that he is not yet physically strong enough for the NFL. His skill in making interceptions is real, but I am 100% supportive of the decision to be patient and see if he can put on more muscle.
- I don't agree with you, re Reggie Bush. If Reggie was here he would have the same sort of trouble that Lamar Miller has had and we'd be spending $6M/ year. I can't help but think that a decent part of the problem is the O-line. I would also advocate that we should get a big physical RB as an each way bet in case Lamar is not the solution. Big physical RBs like Marshawn Lynch, Jamal Charles, Adrian Peterson, Alfred Morris and Matt Forte have all had top seasons. Don't be surprised if big physical backs comes back into mode. So don't be surprised if Ireland tries to find one next year.
- I agree with you re Wheeler. CK correctly assessed his coverage weaknesses from the moment he was signed. He has flashed occasionally, but to date has been a huge disappointment to date and definitely not worth the big bucks. It is interesting that 2nd round draft pick Kiko Alonso at Buffalo and Paul Posluszny at Jacksonville have been veritable tackling machines. I don't fully understand what they are trying to do with the LBs but I know that good tacklers with strong work ethics are available and Koa Misi is not the problem.

 

[finfan54]

I personally dont care if Ireland is gone.

But I dont think its quite fair to dish off Philbin this year. So what has bugged me these days is if we go with a new GM who the owner says Philbin stays, then firing Ireland maybe isnt the right thing to do.

let them both die together, but not this year. It wouldnt be fair to all the players who were brought in to play in this system, coaching, QB, ect. only to have to start over with new everything.

If we give them both one more year to prove it, and then end up the same, then there is no arguments and the new GM can start over with his people top to bottom.

And I emphesiize this looking at it from a players standpoint with FA, players we have now that are good who we want back, rookies who will be playing to start or major PT next year, and keeping the familiarity of the system in place.

The other way is the easy way out, but you are starting completely over again and mistakes will be just as, if not more frequent.