Rickys Salary Cap Hit?

[Philter25]

The reason why the Dolphins sued Ricky was for breach of contract. The arbitrator found Ricky in breach which pretty much means the Dolphins get to start over with a new contract with Ricky. I look for Ricky to sign a 1-2 year deal like Boston's with the judgement against him waived unless he breaches the new contract. There is no way he returns under the old contract. BTW, thanks Ricky for getting rid of Wany.

Im confused...... I thought his new contract would still be void.

This is an area that I am not very knowledgeable in......

I know Merman and Clump are the salary cap guys, but who is the "legal" guy who knows about this type of stuff?

 

[Merman]

Im confused...... I thought his new contract would still be void.

This is an area that I am not very knowledgeable in......

I know Merman and Clump are the salary cap guys, but who is the "legal" guy who knows about this type of stuff?

No I am not a legal guy but if the contract was void the Dolphins would have no contractual rights to Ricky Williams. The standard legal contract that must be used contains standard language that the contract is tolled if a player enters the armed forces, retires or does not report.

The CBA:

ARTICLE XIV

NFL PLAYER CONTRACT

Section 1. Form: The NFL Player Contract form attached hereto as Appendix C will be used for all player signings. This form cannot be amended without the approval of the Management Council and the NFLPA.

The CBA from:

Appendix C

16. EXTENSION. Unless this contract specifically provides otherwise, if Player becomes a member of the Armed Forces of the United States or any other country, or retires from professional football as an active player, or otherwise fails or refuses to perform his services under this contract, then this contract will be tolled between the date of Player's induction into the Armed Forces, or his retirement, or his failure or refusal to perform, and the later date of his return to professional football. During the period this contract is tolled, Player will not be entitled to any compensation or benefits. On Player's return to professional football, the term of this contract will be extended for a period of time equal to the number of seasons (to the nearest multiple of one) remaining at the time the contract was tolled. The right of renewal, if any, contained in this contract will remain in effect until the end of any such extended term.

 

[Philter25]

Thanks Merman. So to clarify if he does come back, he is still working under his current contract even though courts declared him in violation of the contract and needed to give back his money....

 

[DolphinsRising]

Thanks Merman. So to clarify if he does come back, he is still working under his current contract even though courts declared him in violation of the contract and needed to give back his money....

The judgment was based solely on the signing bonus money and his violation of the stipulations regarding that money. The other areas of the contract are still valid and binding.

"On Player's return to professional football, the term of this contract will be extended for a period of time equal to the number of seasons (to the nearest multiple of one) remaining at the time the contract was tolled."

So that would mean Ricky's contract would extend
to '08 upon his return?

I have no problem with his return from a football standpoint. He'll reduce the workload on Brown.
He likely won't reach any incentives so he'll be easy
to cut at any time in the near future with no dead cap resulting.

Assuming Ricky will play hard (unlike in '03) it's a win-win situation for the Phins short term.

 

[Merman]

Thanks Merman. So to clarify if he does come back, he is still working under his current contract even though courts declared him in violation of the contract and needed to give back his money....

That's the way I understand it. A breach not void or terminated. The judgment gives the Dolphins a legal right to go after the money but they haven't yet. So if Ricky honors his contract there is no more breach. If he doesn't honor the contract then there is already an established precedent and judgment.


I understand if this were a sales or building contract there would be damages but there is some question of how the Dolphins were financially harmed.

 

[ch19079]

That's the way I understand it. A breach not void or terminated. The judgment gives the Dolphins a legal right to go after the money but they haven't yet. So if Ricky honors his contract there is no more breach. If he doesn't honor the contract then there is already an established precedent and judgment.

so if he comes back and plays for the fins, he no longer owes them 8 mil. right.

but he will be asked to redo his contract to save cap space, right.

once he does that, and if he decides to retire again, will he owe the team 8 mil again, or the new "signing bonus" from redoing his contract?

 

[SECfootball]

Deduct the 8 million that he owes us and make his numbers look like this

$1.1 Million (2005)
$1.14 million(2006)
$900,000(2007)
:D Screw him like he did us!!

Hey if that kind of money for playing football for the Miami Dolphins is being screwed, somebody please screw me.

That sounded very wrong. :groucho:

 

[Merman]

so if he comes back and plays for the fins, he no longer owes them 8 mil. right.

If the Dolphins pursue the money or insist on repayment of the bonus money even if the there is an attempt to honor the contract would you come back to the Dolphins under those terms???

but he will be asked to redo his contract to save cap space, right.

once he does that, and if he decides to retire again, will he owe the team 8 mil again, or the new "signing bonus" from redoing his contract?

I think the Team Salary situation requires that Ricky restructure is 2005 base salary and would be to the team's advantage.

If the Ricky Williams clause is not negotiated out of the contract with a new deal, which I don't expect then yes. I would expect the Dolphins to go after any unamortized signing bonus and all incentive bonus earned and paid by the Dolphins. Remember he still has incentives built into the contract.

 

[Philter25]

Wait wait wait, so if Ricky comes back, then therefore there is no breach of contract.... what about last year? Is that just a mulligan?

If his contract was breached and technically we have the right to go after his 8 million signing bonus, then therefore do we have leverage in getting ricky to restructure his contract?

IE: Restructure your contract and we will let you keep the 8 million that technically we are able to go after....

 

[Eshlemon]

cut david bowens and we free up 2.2 million. Any questions????

...and St Claire for 1.1 million. Not needed if McDougle's RT of present & Alabi's RT of future.

 

[ch19079]

Wait wait wait, so if Ricky comes back, then therefore there is no breach of contract.... what about last year? Is that just a mulligan?

If his contract was breached and technically we have the right to go after his 8 million signing bonus, then therefore do we have leverage in getting ricky to restructure his contract?

IE: Restructure your contract and we will let you keep the 8 million that technically we are able to go after....

but once you restructure, and let him keep the 8 mil. what happens if he decides to retire again? will the fins be able to say, "you owe us 8 mil", or will they only be able to say "you owe us the restructured amount he recieved"

and to take it one step more.

if he comes back and plays, when COULD he reitire without owing the team a crapload of money? 2008?? basicaly making him do a job he doesnt want to do anymore for 3 more years... :confused: that jsut doesnt sound right.

 

[Merman]

Wait wait wait, so if Ricky comes back, then therefore there is no breach of contract.... what about last year? Is that just a mulligan?

If his contract was breached and technically we have the right to go after his 8 million signing bonus, then therefore do we have leverage in getting ricky to restructure his contract?

IE: Restructure your contract and we will let you keep the 8 million that technically we are able to go after....

Ricky didn't get paid last year, the Dolphins had no cap charge for him last year and there is still 3 years of service due on the contract. That's the rules.

I never said the team has no leverage, they always have most of the leverage. What I have been trying to explain is if the team pushes its leverage to the maximum there is no incentive for Ricky to come back to the Dolphins. It would be to his advanage to go the bankruptcy route.

If the NFL reinstates Williams he has the obligation to come back to his old contract. If the Dolphins don't release him for not taking a pay cut are they then going to say well you have to honor the contract and take a pay cut or repay the bonus money??? Would you accept that or tell the Dolphins where they can put their contract???

Leigh Steinberg is not Master P though he did allow the Ricky Williams clause into Ricky's contract.

 

[Philter25]

but once you restructure, and let him keep the 8 mil. what happens if he decides to retire again? will the fins be able to say, "you owe us 8 mil", or will they only be able to say "you owe us the restructured amount he recieved"

and to take it one step more.

if he comes back and plays, when COULD he reitire without owing the team a crapload of money? 2008?? basicaly making him do a job he doesnt want to do anymore for 3 more years... :confused: that jsut doesnt sound right.

I would want Ricky back for 2 years... Ronnie could learn and they both could share carries. That would be an incredible backfield.

If you restructure, im SURE there is going to be language in his contract if he retires again. Come on, fool me once, shame on you, fool me again.....

If YOU or I can think of it, im sure Saban already has.... when Ricky restructures, im sure there will be VERY tight language in his contract about retirement/drug suspensions/bonus money.

Check this out:
http://www.finheaven.com/news/2150/

"I've still got 4,000 yards left in me," Williams wrote, meaning two years at 2,000 per. "Who is gonna turn that down?"

thats IDEALLY what we want from him.

Of course, he needs to add 40 lbs to get back to his playing weight.... I dont think at 190lbs he will get a 2000 yard season, not behind this Oline.

 

[Philter25]

Ricky didn't get paid last year, the Dolphins had no cap charge for him last year and there is still 3 years of service due on the contract. That's the rules.

I never said the team has no leverage, they always have most of the leverage. What I have been trying to explain is if the team pushes its leverage to the maximum there is no incentive for Ricky to come back to the Dolphins. It would be to his advanage to go the bankruptcy route.

If the NFL reinstates Williams he has the obligation to come back to his old contract. If the Dolphins don't release him for not taking a pay cut are they then going to say well you have to honor the contract and take a pay cut or repay the bonus money??? Would you accept that or tell the Dolphins where they can put their contract???

Leigh Steinberg is not Master P though he did allow the Ricky Williams clause into Ricky's contract.

Comprende. :up:

 

[Ohio Fanatic]

I far as I know, his previous contract would still be valid.

$3.735 million (2005)
$3.74 million (2006)
$3.5 million (2007)

Plus incentives.

I'm sure, Miami would re-work his deal in some manner though[/QUOTE]

I think that's the key wording. We'll have to rework his contract, fill it with incentives.