Some persepctive on Dion Jordan

[Zounds]

Here is an interesting blog entry on the use of Dion Jordan written by an Eagles fan. While I do not know the credibility of the author, it is an interesting write up and I do believe he's got it right when he dispels the notion that Jordan is not a fit for our defense. In fact, I think he can be a great fit if Coyle continues to develop packages for him.

And there has been a lot of talk about how "we are a 4-3 defense and Jordan is not a 4-3 DE....", well that's a bunch of crap too. This author uses a lot of screenshots of All 22 footage, which makes it easier to show we are not just trying to force Jordan into the stereotypical 4-3 DE role.

http://chipwagon.typepad.com/eagles...ns-2013-season-part-2-outside-linebacker.html

 

[utahphinsfan]

Its the play where Dion is lined up in a 3 pt stance v the stealers that impresses me.

I did not realize the phins use a 3-3-5 that much.

I do like DJ's versatility and hope Coyle continues to use it.

 

[hoops]

where's part 1 the 43 de work part...we already know that he can cover and has athletic versatility but you dont trade up into the top 5 correction you don't draft a guy in the top 5 that you don't view as an every down player in your defense...

he's a 34 olb all day long where his athleticism and cod and 2 point stance ability can offset his lack of rush arsenal and he can operate in space...his poa play vs the run wouldn't show as as much of an issue in a 34 as it does in a 43...and as such we havent gotten every down play from him

i fail to see where this video changes anything...it's great that he can do so many things but you go up there for a edge pass rusher in the top 5 he better sack the damn qb

 

[Geforce]

Thanks Zounds.

To summarize, I think I've shown over the last 2 posts that Dion Jordan's rookie campaign was more impactful than the stats suggest. In limited snaps he had at least half a dozen game-changing plays, and while some of his plays aren't showing up on the stat sheet his presence is being felt on the football field. Everyone knew Jordan was a raw prospect and that the torn labrum and surgery was going to hold him back in his rookie season. More importantly, looking ahead, I think Jordan illustrated significant potential.

If you haven't, you should read part one where the author talks about Dion as a DE.
http://chipwagon.typepad.com/eagles/2014/03/dissecting-dion-jordans-2013-season.html

One of the things I want to really touch on in this post, is what I have realized are perhaps some "misconceptions" about Dion Jordan and his rookie season. I've read some comments about how Jordan doesn't fit the Dolphins defense. He is not an ideal 4-3 Defensive End, and he's not a SAM LB in a 4-3. Furthermore, he's at best a situational pass rusher in their scheme. After reviewing all of his defensive snaps in 2013. I don't really agree with that.

First, while a signicant amount of Jordan's snaps were from the RDE position, and the Dolphins do indeed run a base 4-3, they like to use a lot of hybrid looks and Dion Jordan was a big part of that in 2014. For example here's Jordan in his familiar position at RDE:

 

[hoops]

Thanks Zounds.


If you haven't, you should read part one where the author talks about Dion as a DE.
http://chipwagon.typepad.com/eagles/2014/03/dissecting-dion-jordans-2013-season.html

and this is what you should take away from it...he says it plain as day..."Ultimately for Dion to be an asset for the Dolphins, I think he needs to be a productive pass rusher from this spot" RIGHT DEFENSIVE END

what you should also take away is that the bucs were basically able to not only neutralize but win against him one on one in the run game with a freaking tight end by himself...and not a great blocking one either

i like the kid as gifted as they come but the edge pass rush must develop...an inside counter is a must and yeah this guys right he's slow off the ball that must improve also...

this guys works good though...it's very well done

and oh look some more clips of philip wheeler being out of position...ha ha...you can set your watch to that

 

[Zounds]

i fail to see where this video changes anything...it's great that he can do so many things but you go up there for a edge pass rusher in the top 5 he better sack the damn qb

That's the point, he int just an edge rusher and we have asked him to do a lot more then be an edge rusher. The whole premise of the write up was that you cant measure his production by sacks.

---------- Post added at 11:49 AM ---------- Previous post was at 11:47 AM ----------

Thanks Zounds.


If you haven't, you should read part one where the author talks about Dion as a DE.
http://chipwagon.typepad.com/eagles/2014/03/dissecting-dion-jordans-2013-season.html

I read that as well, which focuses on his role as the traditional 4-3 DE. I posted the second write up because that focuses on the hybrid packages we use, which many people completely overlook when talking about Jordan's performance.

 

[hoops]

here's the straight up truth of it as i see it right now going off his work in 2013 if miami wants this kid to be an every down player they need to make him a solb in a 43 (misis slot) on first and second downs and in obvious pass sets then let him roam and line up in wide 9 and different gap blitz sets etc and rush off the edge or drop with vernon kicked inside...

that's how you get an every down player...if his poa play vs the run doesnt improve drastically you will never survive with that as a every down 43 de...teams will destroy you in the run game going after him...

if they hadn't signed misi to an extension i could see every down possibilities this year but with misi back he's gonna have to find snaps elsewhere on early downs...likely in the de rotation

 

[datruth55]

I agree with hoops. Situational player used is certain packages that we traded up for...makes no sense. The #3 overall pick should be a stud you can't keep off the field, an every down player.

1. Eric Fisher - starter
2. Luke Joeckel - starter
3. Dion Jordan - situational player
4. Lane Johnson - starter
5. Ezekiel Ansah - starter (was in talks for rookie of the year)
6. Barkevious Mingo - 3 starts (recovered from injury to start)
7. Jonathan Cooper - was starting in preseason then injured...IR for the season
8. Tavon Austin - 3 starts
9. Dee Milliner - starter
10. Chance Warmack - starter

Now out of all those players in the top 10 who didn't have a single start?

 

[dnespins]

we traded into the top 5 for a situational project...i wish we did that this year instead of last year. sure it would cost more this year than last, but it's because you're getting an every down player, not a situational project.

 

[Zounds]

I agree with hoops. Situational player used is certain packages that we traded up for...makes no sense. The #3 overall pick should be a stud you can't keep off the field, an every down player.

Its not his fault we drafted him 3rd overall, which by the way looks to be the weakest draft in the past decade. I have no problem criticizing the draft pick. I agree situation players should not be drafted 3rd overall, however the OP was talking about how the player is being used, and not his draft value. I do believe he is properly being used and developed.

 

[hoops]

i don't have a problem with a situational player in the top 5 early...provided that guy gets to the qb with regularity...and jordan has to develop a inside counter and get quicker off the ball for that to happen...

he's always though at that length and height gonna have issues with leverage in the run game and guys getting under his pad level as a 43 de anyways...you'd have yourself an every down player right now in a 34...no doubt...and a more impactful one

 

[hoops]

Its not his fault we drafted him 3rd overall, which by the way looks to be the weakest draft in the past decade. I have no problem criticizing the draft pick. I agree situation players should not be drafted 3rd overall, however the OP was talking about how the player is being used, and not his draft value. I do believe he is properly being used and developed.

that's probably the case as far as the usage in year 1...i think we could have used him more as a stunt to the inside or gap blitzer but at the end of the day anything that takes away from his development as a win pass rusher ie the counter the polish etc is not gonna matter as much...if he doesnt get to the qb we will never justify that pick in our d...not sure i agree with the development side of it but i get that you want to get whatever bang for your buck from the player you can...this entire offseason for jordan though should be about developing that pass rush and polish...if he had an inside counter and got off the ball better he'd be filthy...til he does we are always gonna be left wanting more...i am at least

again if we were a 34 he'd fit like a glove right now...

 

[ANUFan]

Is it me or does he compare favorable from NE OLB Collins? They seem very similar IMO

 

[hoops]

Is it me or does he compare favorable from NE OLB Collins? They seem very similar IMO

yea i see a lot of that...that kid collins is a nice player too...gonna be a thorn in our sides for quite a while...new england has figured out how to use him and there's still meat on the bone...

 

[marinotoclayton]

Well the fact that he was hurt last year and has been a project. And that coaches still dont know how they want to use him make his selection last year a bad pick. Which is probably why Ireland got canned! But I am glad Ireland made that mistake as I haven' t liked him for last 3 yrs. As for Jordan he may still be a project this year also.