Wallace or Moore? | Page 4 | FinHeaven - Miami Dolphins Forums

Wallace or Moore?

ebozzz said:
Never said that we should take Moore over Wallace. I was simply responding to the train of thought that he would be available for us to bring back if needed. Also for the point of clarifying what I meant, I was really reffering more to Moore's current status in comparison to Armstrong. Speed? IMO they are about same IMO. That's all....
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Nah I know what you were saying . . . what I mean is, Armstrong was returning kicks during that final preseason he was with us, and had he made the team, he would have been active because of it. Moore hasn't been doing returns, and with 4 guys clearly ahead of him, if he doesn't offer anything as a returner, he really has no value for this team outside of being a "replacement" guy. Livas, if kept, would be your primary returner and Wallace, if kept, is your gunner on special teams and your talented project WR with upside. I don't know if Moore fits that description.

Armstrong is quite a bit faster than Moore, I think Moore's speed is a bit overhyped due to the catch and run from the Raider's game and the fact that we were so "slow" on offense last year, he just stood out more. He is a better route runner than Clyde Gates, but I have just seen him drop too many passes and fight the ball on too many catches for me to keep him over Wallace. It wouldn't shock me if he got picked up by another team and got some burn . . . and it wouldn't surprise me if that catch in the Raiders game ends up being his legacy. Clyde Gates is the better "go" route guy . . . and that is the dimension we need added to this offense more than anything.

Plus when you have guys like Clay and Bush . . . your need for WR's get decreased . . . because 5 wide will usually 2 Rb's/TE.
 
Dolph N.Fan said:
Livas shows some flash one time and everyone is going nuts over him. He'll get cut.
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There was another guy not to long ago that everyone had their tongues on the floor cause he had a few good kick/punt returns, forget his name, but he was cut.

I guess no one around here has heard of luck? If Livas starts making big returns consistently then maybe he'll be something to look at it.
 
Wallace obviously. Insane speed:size ratio with limited experience which means he has a lot of room for refining and a lot more potential.
 
kud said:
There was another guy not to long ago that everyone had their tongues on the floor cause he had a few good kick/punt returns, forget his name, but he was cut.

I guess no one around here has heard of luck? If Livas starts making big returns consistently then maybe he'll be something to look at it.
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I think it was Chris Williams? something like that. That dude was faster too, but he kept dropping the kicks and punts, then he suffered an "Injury" that put him on the IR.. Never heard of him since..

Personally I'd take Marlon Moore. I don't think 1 dropped pass should kick him off the team, I haven't even seen Roberto Wallace in the games at all..
 
Jamaicankid21 said:
I think it was Chris Williams? something like that. That dude was faster too, but he kept dropping the kicks and punts, then he suffered an "Injury" that put him on the IR.. Never heard of him since..

Personally I'd take Marlon Moore. I don't think 1 dropped pass should kick him off the team, I haven't even seen Roberto Wallace in the games at all..
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Wait no, I lied, Id take Wallace..
 
kud said:
There was another guy not to long ago that everyone had their tongues on the floor cause he had a few good kick/punt returns, forget his name, but he was cut.

I guess no one around here has heard of luck? If Livas starts making big returns consistently then maybe he'll be something to look at it.
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yeah Chris Williams I believe showed some flash and then started sucking. Livas will have to return at least one more punt to the house to make the team imo.
 
kud said:
There was another guy not to long ago that everyone had their tongues on the floor cause he had a few good kick/punt returns, forget his name, but he was cut.

I guess no one around here has heard of luck? If Livas starts making big returns consistently then maybe he'll be something to look at it.
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Livas tied the NCAA record for return TDs.

I don't think his preseason TD return was just "luck".
 
normaldude said:
Livas tied the NCAA record for return TDs.

I don't think his preseason TD return was just "luck".
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Even so, I'd rather have a returner that consistently gets me good field position than one that occasionally returns one to the house. Livas at least has to get a few returns pass the 35 to even consider keeping him on the 53 imo.

If people thought he would be a great returner in the NFL i think that would warrant at least a late round pick from somebody.
 
dolphone said:
And your reasoning is...?

I'm also for Wallace, but I do hope they keep Livas on the 53 man roster. He's way too talented to be given up.
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My reasoning is Livas might be on the field for a handful of plays. He does not help any other areas. I would use Gates on KO's and see if he can handle punts. I also have Bess and Bush if needed to help with punts. I think Livas' TD return has sparked WAY TOO MUCH interest in this guy.

Moore and Wallace should be given a chance to get better for they could be real finds at WR.

I am not worried about KO's right now because of the new rule allowing kickers to boom the thing into the end zone.
 
I think that Livas will surprise a lot of you this year--and I'm not just talking about kick returns. If we are smart I think that he will definitely contribute at WR. He is explosive and a playmaker once he has the ball.

The year we had Wes Welker, he was our only playmaker, and that was on special teams (barely used at WR). Then New England got him, and they used him the right way, and look at him now. I'm not saying that he is the next Wes Welker, but he may be the next UDFA gem for us. Watch and see...
 
phintim said:
Livas already tweaked a hamstring plus is small
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I don't think Livas will make the team. And I think they'll keep Moore over Wallace.

Special teams play aside, Moore looks better as a receiver - that drop notwithstanding. They need another useful receiver in the event of injuries and I haven't seen Wallace do much of anything in that regard.

Livas looked like a bug about to get whacked by a fly-swatter against Carolina. I'd seriously worry about his durability and he doesn't seem that strong on his feet.
 
BG12DM13CP10 said:
I think that Livas will surprise a lot of you this year--and I'm not just talking about kick returns. If we are smart I think that he will definitely contribute at WR. He is explosive and a playmaker once he has the ball.

The year we had Wes Welker, he was our only playmaker, and that was on special teams (barely used at WR). Then New England got him, and they used him the right way, and look at him now. I'm not saying that he is the next Wes Welker, but he may be the next UDFA gem for us. Watch and see...
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I'll be the first to admit if I'm wrong but...Welker is a warrior going into the middle of the field and breaking tackles while absorbing contact. If Livas goes into the middle of the field as a slot guy, I think he'll get knocked into next week. I just don't see the ability to absorb punishment needed for that role. I hope I'm wrong and he does well.
 
normaldude said:
It's ridiculous to expect anyone to return kicks for TDs every other game.

Even Devin Hester - the greatest returner ever - only returns a kick/punt for a TD once every 5.4 games.

Gale Sayers - a hall of famer - only returned a kick/punt for a TD once every 8.5 games.

Other great returners include Brian Mitchell (kick/punt for a TD once every 17.15 games), and Billy "White Shoes" Johsnon (kick/punt for a TD once every 17.9 games).

In my opinion, all Phillip Livas needs to do in the next 2 preseason games to make the roster, is have an above return average, and not fumble the ball.
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Which outside of his one big run he has done nothing against 2nd/3rd stringers. What was his average against a lousy Panthers team? He's a long shot
 
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