We could still land luck with the 4th or 5th pick

[dolphone]

wait a minute...you don't follow college football yet i'm supposed to give your take weight??? when you say the guys becoming overhyped yet you've never even seen him play??? this convo is over

talk about being in the dark...you my friend are in the vast minority in nfl circles of people who think andrew luck is not the best qb prospect to come out in the last decade...the vast minority...

i guess you can't justify trading 3 1st rounders and a player or whatever it takes for him when you've never even seen him play...broaden your football horizons

I don't need to watch college football to know he's not the first hyped player that has came out of the college ranks. And the record for such players isn't exactly pristine.

You don't like the recent drafts, how about 1999? Hailed as *the* class since 1983, what did it produce? How is Tim Couch doing?

 

[dolphone]

Horribly. But that's because they didn't know how to use Walker and because a running back has never been worth that much. Not then. Not before then. And certainly not now. The Vikings got caught thinking they were a running back away and decided to ante in for the most monstrous physical specimen around. Well, it turns out a running back is only worth so much to your team's bottom line and the rest of their team wasn't as good as they thought it was. But I'll give any team who's willing to risk looking stupid for a chance at greatness some credit. At least they had the balls to play a hand.

And hand Dallas three championships in the process, while they toiled in mediocrity. Walker never even broke 1000 yards. But he wasn't a QB, so it's moot, right?

Are you trying to argue that having an elite quarterback isn't that important? Because not only is such an argument folly but even the examples you bring up are poor.

Yes, New England went 11-5 in 2008. But do you remember their record in 2007? Because I do. They were 16 and ****in' 0.

The 1993 Miami Dolphins went 9-7, sure. But they were winning the game that would send them to 4-1 when Marino went down, which means they finished the season 5-6. The 1992 Miami Dolphins, by the way, went 11-5 and made it to the AFC Championship Game.

So don't play this "the quarterback doesn't matter as much as everyone says it does" game. Because that's not a game you're ever going to win. Especially in this day and age.

I'm *not* saying QBs aren't important. I'm saying there's not a single QB worth sacrificing your entire team for. Because if he goes down, and you don't have a strong OVERALL team around him, you sink. Watch what's happening to the Colts right now.

You're not likely to see an ironman like Favre again. QBs are people too, they break down, and if you don't built a strong team around them, they *will* fail. And sacrificing an entire draft is a good recipe to make that happen.

Well, start. Watch the guy play and get back to me. Sure, there were morons out there proclaiming that Brohm was going to be the next Manning. There are *******s saying that about guys every year. But speaking as someone who watched Brohm pretty closely when he was at Louisville, I can tell you the guy was nowhere near the prospect Manning was. I had the guy as like a fourth rounder, as did a lot of other people.

Exactly my point.

I'll pay attention to his play, but from what little highlights I've seen, he's not otherworldly. He's good. He's got great potential. He's still not worth giving up an entire class for.

What if what if what if. The only sure thing is that if you never try and get a franchise quarterback, you'll never get one, the one in a million chances like Tom Brady notwithstanding.

Agreed. I'm not advocating against drafting a prospect if available. I'm against sacrificing the future for a dream that can go "puff" in a second.

There's no such thing as a sure thing. Period. Take your shot and live with the consequences. The teams that had taken theirs and busted out weren't crippled forever like some seem to think they were. The Chargers fired and missed on Leaf but that didn't stop their next GM from taking Drew Brees high in the draft and then swinging the trade that landed them Philip Rivers.

Agreed. But the Chargers never did trade as much as some people are advocating.

 

[hoops]

take some time and watch andrew luck play...and if you still come away with all this tim couch or brian brohm nonsense then come back to us...right now this is just a waste of time...yeah there's been plenty overhyped qb prospects i get it...but this kid sure looks like the can;t miss exception...and i hope we do hear reports of what teams offered up to get in position for luck on draft day whether a trade is actually made or not...you're gonna be surprised...multiple 1st rounders is just the tip of the iceberg...wait and see

 

[Mogwai]

True. Now the Chargers are in the dumps with no hope at anything. I'm starting to agree with you guys. Let's draft another lineman.

Heh. Perfect. Yeah, we're so much better off than the Chargers. Good thing we've played it safe. They've only had 2 franchise QBs since Leaf and been a consistent contender. What devastation.

 

[johngarryvo]

you guys do realize Luck still has another year of college eligibility left, right?

 

[moonman]

He's coming out, bro.

 

[BigNastyDB13]

First of all let me start off by saying that I'm not on the suck for luck campaign, I'm a diehard and love this team and want to see them win every game if possible, but things are looking bleak this season and I don't see us winning more than 5 games and we do have to start looking at the future, hey look I'm rooting for henne and I do believe he has improved, better pocket presence, scrambling, a little better leadership, but let's face it guys he will never be a franchise QB, he is not special and he had his chance again sunday to win a game in the 4th quarter and he blew it, it was all set up for him, all he needed was 15yrds and he could not get the job done, serviceable NFL QB? yes, franchise QB? no, he never will be.

So that leads me to Luck, i see a lot of members on here saying we wont have a shot at Luck because he will go #1, well not necessarily, minnesota, carolina, st. louis, seattle, colts, chiefs, bengals, and us will probably be picking in the top 8, so lets cross off the vikings, panthers, rams, and bengals as potential landing spots for luck because they all have their potential franchise QB's, vikings-ponder, bengals-dalton, rams-bradford, panthers-newton. So that would leave the colts, chiefs, seahawks, and us, the colts obvi have manning but with his neck issues and him getting older and if they do get the #1 pick this could be a perfect opportunity to get their QB of the future, but financially it would not make sense, I don't think they would want to pay Mannings salary and put a #1 pick on their books as well, so that leaves the chiefs, seahwaks, and the phins, I believe the chiefs are not comfortable with cassell and if they're sitting at #1 they will take him, the seahawks also need a QB and they would take him as well, so essentially we would be battling with the seahawks and cheifs to land luck, for sake of argument lets say the first 6 picks looked like this:

#1-Colts-Manning-salary tied up
#2-Rams-Bradford
#3-Vikings-Ponder
#4-Dolphins-draft luck
#5-Chiefs
#6-Seahwaks

So landing luck without the #1 overall pick is a lot more realistic than people think!

Luck is going 1 regardless who finished last. That team will either draft him n keep him, trade the #1 pick or trade their other QB like Ponder or Dalton. No team in their right mind is going to pass on Luck or the kings ransom of trading him for picks just because they have a guy like Ponder or Dalton.

 

[hoops]

yeah...fully aware but i believe luck is absolutely coming out this draft...

 

[Mr. Magoo]

He *was* the consensus #1 overall pick for the 2007 draft, coming out at the same time you want Luck to come out. He was hyped as the next big thing, just as Luck has been.

People liked him until they really started to look at the tape on him. It's similar to what happened to Brady Quinn. That won't happen with Luck.

 

[Mr. Magoo]

And hand Dallas three championships in the process, while they toiled in mediocrity. Walker never even broke 1000 yards. But he wasn't a QB, so it's moot, right?

They didn't hand anybody anything. Dallas took advantage of the opportunity and made great selections with those picks. But getting two first rounders for Jon Gruden didn't make Oakland a powerhouse because they screwed up those picks. Getting two first rounders for Ricky Williams didn't make New Orleans a dynasty either.

Dallas made the deal, then they made the deal worth it by getting guys like Emmitt Smith, Russell Maryland, Darren Woodson and Alvin Harper with those draft picks.

There's only one position that's worth leveraging your franchise for, because there's only one position that is the franchise. And that's a quarterback. The Falcons are figuring that out right now having given up so much for Julio Jones. They'll live to regret it.

I'm *not* saying QBs aren't important. I'm saying there's not a single QB worth sacrificing your entire team for. Because if he goes down, and you don't have a strong OVERALL team around him, you sink. Watch what's happening to the Colts right now.

The Colts have won a Super Bowl with their formula and have been getting better than 10 wins a season for a decade. Are you trying to tell them their plan is flawed? 'Cause it seems like it's worked pretty well to me. They knew that if they lost Manning they were ****ed. And so what? No modern team can sustain that unless the backup (Tom Brady, Kurt Warner) is also an elite player waiting in the wings. So they might as well ride or die with him.

You're not likely to see an ironman like Favre again. QBs are people too, they break down, and if you don't built a strong team around them, they *will* fail. And sacrificing an entire draft is a good recipe to make that happen.

"Strong" is relative. With the same basic surrounding talent they're floundering with now, the Colts went to the Super Bowl two years ago. When the difference between your team being a bottom five team and Super Bowl winner is having a superstar elite quarterback, that proves beyond a shadow of a doubt that giving up whatever it takes to get that player is absolutely indisputably worth it.

Agreed. I'm not advocating against drafting a prospect if available. I'm against sacrificing the future for a dream that can go "puff" in a second.

Without an elite quarterback, there are no dreams to go puff or anything else.

 

[jfleag61]

If we can get Luck without giving up the farm, fine. If we have to go with another "top tier" prospect, fine again. Just remember, thought it doesn't happen very often, Brady was a 6th round pick.
My only worry is that if we get Luck, and he does for us what Rivers and Brees did for the Chargers, 5 years from now people will be on her btchn that EVERY YEAR, we win 11-14 games and get knocked out of the playoffs, and just can't get to the super bowl...fire the f**kn coach and clean out the FO!!!!

 

[beanh8er]

I don't know if this has been mentioned yet, but Peyton has a clause in his contract that voids the final 3 years if he can't play. Manning is the ultimate team player.

 

[retarmyfinfan]

IF the Colts have the #1 pick, consider Luck gone. Even if Manning stays around another 3 years. That would be the ideal scenario. Have Manning mentor a guy that will probably be just as good as him. And like someone else posted, someone will trade up. If we want Luck it will cost, and I think we should pay that cost.

 

[HarryBagpipe]

Luck is going one. Only a handful of teams like Green Bay, San Diego or Pitt would pass on him and they arent drafting at one. Even though other QBs have been drafted number 1 and flopped doesnt mean they all grade equally. Carr, Couch and even Cam Newton are not close to grading as what Luck is. The only QBs i can think of that have the same "cant miss" potential as Luck are Manning and before that Elway.

 

[KL24]

I wonder what it would cost to get him even if you have a top 5 pick. Whatever it will be, I'm sure it will dwarf the Ricky Williams trade. My guess is 2 drafts + an impact player would be the start.