What do the Bills, Pats, Jets think of Miami? *NO SMACK*

[Majpain]

In your opinion whats wrong with the Fins. I wanna see what you guys think.

 

[MR NFLFAN]

Too many turn overs kills any momentum the dolphins get going.
QB obviously you need a quality QB which neither Harrington or Culpepper appear to be.
Mularkey needs to be fired his play calls are terrible.

Really most of the problems seem to be basically with the offense. They can't seem to buy a TD and they commit too many turnovers. Your defense seems pretty good with the exception of the secondary.

 

[Majpain]

Too many turn overs kills any momentum the dolphins get going.
QB obviously you need a quality QB which neither Harrington or Culpepper appear to be.
Mularkey needs to be fired his play calls are terrible.

Really most of the problems seem to be basically with the offense. They can't seem to buy a TD and they commit too many turnovers. Your defense seems pretty good with the exception of the secondary.

If you wern't a pats fan I would hug you right now :wink:

 

[ThePats]

The defense is great besides the secondary and all the penalties they get flagged for. The offense reeks, Mularkey is the dumbest playcaller ever. Thats really all I can think of.

 

[Dirtywater]

Wow. HUGE topic, of which I am by no means qualified to answer, but I'll give it a basic shot.

Off the top, you are still transitioning from the previous regime, and the previous regimes personel. I think you underestimate this issue. Saban came here, with a lot of successful baggage, and the majority of your fanbase equated that with instant success. By instant, I mean within 2 or 3 years.

That's a lot to assume and saddle him with. This is not college. You simply can't recruit your personel. And the ones you can (free agency), you're still limited via the salary cap. I think the cap has been overlooked in your total success. If Saban had his way and was able to replace a lot of the old guard with the new guard he would, but alas the NFL in the post-salary cap era is much different than pre-cap. You have to build carefully.

You have also changed a lot of coaches (OC & DC.) I know that you have replaced them with quality individuals, but I would assume that takes time. It is hard in today's NFL to have consistancy, but the more a group plays together, the better they become as a team. It has hurt my Patriots more than some would care to acknowledge.

You guys (please don't flame me!) have also vastly overrated your players. Before this season, the majority (not all) said how good your team was, how they would take the AFC East from the Patriots for sure, and that many of your players (ie. Ronnie Brown, Zach, Taylor, etc.) were the best at their positions. I was even hearing how amazing Traylor was. Hey, they're your team and you are entitled to that opinion, but realistically they are not. Doesn't mean they are not immensly talented though. The point is that your pre-season '06 hype put false expectations on your season. And for the record, there are not many Pats players I would say are the best either.

As for your now infamous "O-Line", they are not nearly as bad as being blamed. Funny how much less pressure is on the QB position with Harrington back there. Culpepper sold a bag of goods that seemed false (as many opposing fans said before he played) about his injury status. It didn't help you fans that reports out of camp said he was "ready to go" and "looks great!".

Part of it is just bad play. Some of your position players need to step up and play better. It is a fine line between winning and losing in the NFL. I too thought you guys would be far better than you are currently playing, and part of me still believes you will start to turn it around this season.

I am not one for trash talking or running my mouth off with smack. I give the Jets a ton of credit for playing far better than I ever thought they would. I also think Buffalo is underacheiving too, I thought they would play better. As for my Pats, well, I think they are overperforming right now and thought they would have been a bit worse so far.

To sum it up, you guys have been so good for so long that I think the modern NFL is forcing you as a fanbase to rethink your team. You can't simply be Super Bowl bound or instantly turned around because you got a talented coach, RB and QB. It takes far more to create a champion, including at times, luck. There have been many talented team in the past who never won the Super Bowl either.

I would end with this. Even though you are not doing well, there are plenty of positives to build on, even if that means next season. You could have Herm Edwards or Mike Tice as your coach, more style than substance.

Now... flame on!

 

[perhaps2]

Dude, I feel for ya. The Pats went a long time in the same misery you folks are in right now. Have faith in Saban. Belichick didn't do it overnight, Saban's only had a season and half. That's a blink of an eye in a coaches career. I don't think Culpepper is that great, he reminds me of Bledslow. Harrington has his issues, too. I think Saban went the safest route in regards to the QB position, which hindsight being 20/20 was not the best decision. He should've taken Brees.

Correct me if I'm wrong, but didn't Mawae pratically beg to play for the Fins? That would've been an outstanding pick up. I would've signed him. I'd also start looking at 2007 OL pickups that can be had for the least amount of money. Damien Woody looks like he won't be back witht he Lions next year. If the price were right, I'd snap him up, and if the luck of the croatians falls on the Fins, maybe Brady Quinn in the draft. He learned under the maestro named Weis. Woody under center with Quinn as the QB, that would be awesome to see.

Well good luck, my friend. I hope the football Gods are smiling on Saban.

 

[Majpain]

Wow. HUGE topic, of which I am by no means qualified to answer, but I'll give it a basic shot.

Off the top, you are still transitioning from the previous regime, and the previous regimes personel. I think you underestimate this issue. Saban came here, with a lot of successful baggage, and the majority of your fanbase equated that with instant success. By instant, I mean within 2 or 3 years.

That's a lot to assume and saddle him with. This is not college. You simply can't recruit your personel. And the ones you can (free agency), you're still limited via the salary cap. I think the cap has been overlooked in your total success. If Saban had his way and was able to replace a lot of the old guard with the new guard he would, but alas the NFL in the post-salary cap era is much different than pre-cap. You have to build carefully.

You have also changed a lot of coaches (OC & DC.) I know that you have replaced them with quality individuals, but I would assume that takes time. It is hard in today's NFL to have consistancy, but the more a group plays together, the better they become as a team. It has hurt my Patriots more than some would care to acknowledge.

You guys (please don't flame me!) have also vastly overrated your players. Before this season, the majority (not all) said how good your team was, how they would take the AFC East from the Patriots for sure, and that many of your players (ie. Ronnie Brown, Zach, Taylor, etc.) were the best at their positions. I was even hearing how amazing Traylor was. Hey, they're your team and you are entitled to that opinion, but realistically they are not. Doesn't mean they are not immensly talented though. The point is that your pre-season '06 hype put false expectations on your season. And for the record, there are not many Pats players I would say are the best either.

As for your now infamous "O-Line", they are not nearly as bad as being blamed. Funny how much less pressure is on the QB position with Harrington back there. Culpepper sold a bag of goods that seemed false (as many opposing fans said before he played) about his injury status. It didn't help you fans that reports out of camp said he was "ready to go" and "looks great!".

Part of it is just bad play. Some of your position players need to step up and play better. It is a fine line between winning and losing in the NFL. I too thought you guys would be far better than you are currently playing, and part of me still believes you will start to turn it around this season.

I am not one for trash talking or running my mouth off with smack. I give the Jets a ton of credit for playing far better than I ever thought they would. I also think Buffalo is underacheiving too, I thought they would play better. As for my Pats, well, I think they are overperforming right now and thought they would have been a bit worse so far.

To sum it up, you guys have been so good for so long that I think the modern NFL is forcing you as a fanbase to rethink your team. You can't simply be Super Bowl bound or instantly turned around because you got a talented coach, RB and QB. It takes far more to create a champion, including at times, luck. There have been many talented team in the past who never won the Super Bowl either.

I would end with this. Even though you are not doing well, there are plenty of positives to build on, even if that means next season. You could have Herm Edwards or Mike Tice as your coach, more style than substance.

Now... flame on!

Your post would have not made any sense when the season began but I agree 100% with you. The offense is overated. The O-line isnt as bad as I thought it was.

 

[BwanaZulia]

I think it really goes back to the 2005 draft.

They had no QB and Ricky returning, they should have picked up a QB not Ronnie. So in 2005, they ran well, won games with no QB and in 2006 got two QBs, one broken one who is very questionable.

Daunte looked hurt in pre-season. There is a reason he would only play for one down or one series throwing the ball once or twice. He was and is hurt. If they knew that, they should have made it a competition between Joey and Lemon.

That being said, the Dolphins are not being blown out, they are losing by small points and that to me shows they are not able to score (put up over 20 points a game) and they have not won the take away/give away battle. Yesterday was a good example, giving up the ball 3 times in any game is almost sure fire way to lose.

BZ

 

[BleedinGreenNY]

I think that your going through a tough time right now, and i as a Jet's fan am loving it, cause all of you that were here last year gave us Jet's fans grief for a long time!!

 

[BuffaloBills06]

Mularkey is the problem plain and simple.

 

[baalworship]

Bad O-Line, Quarterback play, and Mularkey.

 

[Phin-o-rama]

this is a good thread.....dirty water and some others making very good posts that i agree with, and appreciate the ability to give a non biased opinion of the team.

 

[Kinzua]

I see several problems.

1. First off, I think that giving 1 individual as much power/responsibility as Saban has is detrimental. The Fins have a GM but he's not really Saban's "partner" in the way that Pioli and Belichick work in NE; the player decisions are Saban's. The coach as GM model doesn't really work any more. I think Seattle is a prime example. Holmgren left GB because he wanted total control. When he had total control in Seattle, the franchise floundered. When he gave up some of that responsibility, the team started winning.

2. I think that Saban failed to assess talent and potential realistically, especially on offense. First off, I think using the #2 pick in the draft on a RB when Ricky Williams is on the roster was a waste of the draft pick. Miami could have looked to fill a more pressing need or tried to trade down to get more picks and taken Ronnie later. Saban also failed to accurately assess the quality of the OL for 2006 and address it. Both Davin Joseph (G) and Nick Mangold (C) were still available when the Fins took Jason Allen. With McKinney coming back from injury and not looking all that great, the Fins probably should have taken Mangold, or if they really thought Hadnot was their center, then maybe they should have taken Joseph at guard. Again, if Saban thought Mangold wasn't good enough for #16, maybe he should have looked for a trading partner. This may have been a function, though, of wearing too many hats.

Finally, taking picks in the supplemental draft is always risky. These players may have potential, but they generally have problems as well. Manny Wright is a major case in point.

3. I also think that maybe Saban's and the Fins' "winning traditions" have led the team to try to "rebuild" while still fielding a winning team. I'd call it a "win now" attitude, although not as extreme as Washington's. I think this was why Saban signed pricey defensive vets like Traylor, Spragan, and Holladay in 2005 and then added the two QBs in 2006. Saban also seems to have put the emphasis on D for both 2005 and 2006 except for QBs. He pursued LB LeVar Arrington, a first rate LB, but the FA acquisitions for the OL were definitely second rate, and he took a CB/S in the first round of the 2006 draft.

This process was a mistake, I think, for 2 reasons. First, Miami now has too many 30+ guys on the D and is saddled with a QB of questionable quality with a big contract who isn't starting (and who is also 29 or 30). This has put Miami into cap purgatory -- lacking money to fill serious wholes with FAs in 2007, although they probably can get by without having to cut starters. Secondly, the 2006 2nd rounder and the 2007 5th or 6th rounder for the QBs might have been better used on young talent that could develop. Gus Ferrotte wasn't such a bad QB given the other holes the Fins needed to shore up, and given the quality of the QBs that Miami acquired. I think Rick Spielman cashed in on Saban's desire to win with the Culpepper trade.

4. Mike Mularkey is an OC who prefers pass to run, but with two good RBs, a more run-oriented OC would have been in order. Many running backs also need numerous carries to get "in rhythm", and MM seldom gives them enough carries.

 

[PhinFan0202]

Too many turn overs kills any momentum the dolphins get going.
QB obviously you need a quality QB which neither Harrington or Culpepper appear to be.
Mularkey needs to be fired his play calls are terrible.

Really most of the problems seem to be basically with the offense. They can't seem to buy a TD and they commit too many turnovers. Your defense seems pretty good with the exception of the secondary.

Dude you hit the nail right on the head. I just wrote a long paragraph that i thought might shed some light on the situation at least with Dante. This is just my opinion though..


Culpepper is like Kordell Stuart. When he only has to do minimal things (Throw the deep ball and run for the first down) he looks good. When you ask him to make reads and do other things out of the relm of simplicity he sucks. Think about it this way...

Kordell(2001)- Has a pro bowl year makes it to the AFC Championship and throws the int to give the win to the Pats.(2002) The Steelers are sucking at the beginning of the season and he gets benched in favor of Tommy Maddox who leads the team to a close loss in the AFC Divisional against the Titans(29-28 I think). Where is Kordell now who knows?

Dante-(2004) Has his best season as a pro throwing for 39 TD passes and 11 ints. Even though Moss is not in most of the plays defenses still have to respect him.(2005) Moss gets traded and the team is now Dantes. He has to do more for the offense without Randy Moss and he throws a surprising 6-12 ratio of Ints-TDs. Culpepper gets hurt and Brad Johson comes in to lead the same exact team to 9-7. The Vikins are now 3-2 WITHOUT Culpepper.

Who knows if Dante is going to turn it around for us at this point? There is no gurentee that he's going to do so and with a risk like that why would you not draft a QB? Worked out for San Diego didn't it? As much as i hope he does turn it around i just don't know if he can. We don't have to pick a QB in the firs but i would strongly consider it.

Would you agree o disagree with that assesment?

 

[Vertical Limit]

2. I think that Saban failed to assess talent and potential realistically, especially on offense. First off, I think using the #2 pick in the draft on a RB when Ricky Williams is on the roster was a waste of the draft pick. Miami could have looked to fill a more pressing need or tried to trade down to get more picks and taken Ronnie later. Saban also failed to accurately assess the quality of the OL for 2006 and address it. Both Davin Joseph (G) and Nick Mangold (C) were still available when the Fins took Jason Allen. With McKinney coming back from injury and not looking all that great, the Fins probably should have taken Mangold, or if they really thought Hadnot was their center, then maybe they should have taken Joseph at guard. Again, if Saban thought Mangold wasn't good enough for #16, maybe he should have looked for a trading partner. This may have been a function, though, of wearing too many hats.

Ricky Williams was suspended for 4 weeks, and was another suspension away from being suspended for the year. Look where he is now.

Ronnie Brown was the obvious choice. Ricky Williams hadn't even made a decision about coming back untill a month or so after the draft. Once Ricky Williams comes back, what happens if he fails another drug test? Another year without a running back?

THANK GOD WE PICKED RONNIE BROWN.

Ronnie Brown is the type of running back every team in the league would love to have. I think atleast 28 of 32 GM's said so, as they voted him as the best player in the 2005 draft. He has some of the best hands in the league in terms of catching, great size and vision, one of the best at I've seen picking up the blitz and blocking, and is a bruising running back. Get him an offensive line and he will breakthrough just as good as anyone.

I personally think we have to build around him. Once we do that, he will be just as valuable as Ladainian is to the Chargers, and Clinton is to the Redskins.

He's the future of Miami.