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Why Guard May Not Be As Big A Problem As We Think

Every single offseason we do the same thing. Ignore the offensive line and think somehow it will magically get better with retreads and mid round picks who have already failed for 3 years. Wake up. It doesn't matter who the coach is. If you can't block you can't win in the NFL.
 
I recently went back and watched a few Bears games and keyed in on Vlad Ducasse at guard, where he started 11 games last season. He's not considered to be anything special, but in a few games that I looked at he looked more than serviceable for Miami's needs. He's currently a free agent and I wonder if the Dolphins will give him a look?

I want to know if anybody else had a chance to watch him much last year and If the Bears offense could make a marginal guard look decent, could Gase do the same thing here with low grade guard talent?

Ducasse is #62 and played right guard in this game: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=TK6R4pG_8yA
 
Definitely need more physical players at guard to match up in AFC East. Better coaching will help, but still need talent.
 
utahphinsfan said:
In the 80's more often than not, Shula would take on OL in round 1.

That said, IMO what most are overlooking in terms of coaching & scheme is; it takes time to transition from a Parcells-esque cornfed to a 21st century ZBS scheme.

I said last yr Turner & Douglas should have been the starting guards from Day 1 and let them under go a baptism of fire last yr. This yr, I have no problem w/ Turner & Douglas battling for 1 of the Guard spots... BUT... Signing Vasquez or Beadles and then drafting one of the kids from Arkansas also needs to be done.
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Vasquez is exactly what the team needs. He is really good at pass protection but not a good "move" guy. meaning hes not a good pulling guard. But if you have a center like we do who needs a pulling guard?
 
fisi said:
This might be a good time to discuss why the Dolphins have struggled at the offensive guard position the past couple of years.


1-Right off the bat, you almost have to look at coaching. Nearly two months after the final game of the 2015 season, the Super Bowl, Miami's offensive line coach from a year ago, John Benton, has yet to be hired by another NFL team. Let that sink in for a moment -- with all the vacancies on the various teams that fire their coaching staffs, barely a month before the draft, Mr. Benton is, as far as we know, still unemployed.

2-Something else to consider is that if we look at the composition of other teams' offensive lines, most of them are obtaining their starters from a variety of sources, not just high profile free agency signings or high draft picks. The New England Patriots, for example, started three relatively low draft picks in the middle of their line a season ago: guards Ryan Wendell and Tre' Jackson and center Bryan Stork, the latter two of whom were both fourth-round picks, although New England did have the foresight to jump ahead of Miami in last year's draft, to select Jackson.

3-Finally, we need to consider scheme; when you're going up against three of the toughest, scariest defensive fronts in all of football, in the Bills, Jets and Patriots, it's probably not a real good idea to employ a finesse based blocking scheme, but rather, a more physical, 'line up and blow them off the line of scrimmage' based approach.

from Phinsider.com


http://www.thephinsider.com/2016/3/17/11257198/why-guard-my-not-be-as-big-a-problem-as-we-think
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Just to add on to that argument about Benton still being w/o a job, as bad as that is at the OLC level, how much worse is it at the Football Czar level that until savvy Steve Ross salvaged him from the NFL dumpster, in the collective utilitarian judgment of the league, the only taker for Tannenbum over 2 years was Woody Johnson for him to be a demoted capologist. So woe is us, ya think?
 
J. David Wannyheimer said:
Listen, I agree that coaching has been a HUGE problem for our football team under Joe Philbin.

But when you watch Dallas Thomas and Jason Fox on the field for the Dolphins last season, what part of you believes that coaching can fix that? I mean,I don't think there is any coaching that can make up for a guy simply being too slow to get a hand on a rusher, or being bulldozed back repeatedly into the quarterback.

Sure, I think better coaching can help with missed assignments -- which were a problem -- but it's going to do nothing to change the fact that Dallas Thomas was often simply blown back into the quarterback's lap right off the snap.
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And the slowest instincts and movement of any OG that I've seen play in Miami.

The synapse time in his mind between sight, recognition and reaction is like a drugged up psyche patient who is also mentally challenged. And then, his physical quickness is like a three year old wearing twenty pound ankle weights. And then, his functional strength (that is his balance and timing plus natural core explosion) is like a ballerina trying to stop a moving truck.

How anyone can watch him over a period of years and think, "Wow. There's real potential here. And worth risking the best QB in Miami since Dan, rolling the dice on him." -- just crazy man.

Every time Thomas faces explosive players, he fails badly -- we're talking blood in pee bad. Every time there is a delayed blitz in the middle or DL stunt, Thomas acts like he's never seen it before. Like every time.

I've never been so furious at a coach for making excuses for a player. Keeping him on the roster and continually defending him with inane comments. Only Philbin and Ireland and Hickey and Tannenbaum would keep Thomas and pretend that he is a credible player. At a position that's becoming one of the most important in the game.

LD

---------- Post added at 01:22 PM ---------- Previous post was at 01:20 PM ----------
fisi said:
This might be a good time to discuss why the Dolphins have struggled at the offensive guard position the past couple of years.


1-Right off the bat, you almost have to look at coaching. Nearly two months after the final game of the 2015 season, the Super Bowl, Miami's offensive line coach from a year ago, John Benton, has yet to be hired by another NFL team. Let that sink in for a moment -- with all the vacancies on the various teams that fire their coaching staffs, barely a month before the draft, Mr. Benton is, as far as we know, still unemployed.

2-Something else to consider is that if we look at the composition of other teams' offensive lines, most of them are obtaining their starters from a variety of sources, not just high profile free agency signings or high draft picks. The New England Patriots, for example, started three relatively low draft picks in the middle of their line a season ago: guards Ryan Wendell and Tre' Jackson and center Bryan Stork, the latter two of whom were both fourth-round picks, although New England did have the foresight to jump ahead of Miami in last year's draft, to select Jackson.

3-Finally, we need to consider scheme; when you're going up against three of the toughest, scariest defensive fronts in all of football, in the Bills, Jets and Patriots, it's probably not a real good idea to employ a finesse based blocking scheme, but rather, a more physical, 'line up and blow them off the line of scrimmage' based approach.

from Phinsider.com


http://www.thephinsider.com/2016/3/17/11257198/why-guard-my-not-be-as-big-a-problem-as-we-think
Click to expand...

Bottom line: If Dallas Thomas is on the team, even as a backup, then guard is a bigger problem than anyone thinks.

LD
 
As bad as Dallas Thomas was last season make no mistake
Douglas,Turner,and Fox were very very bad

Thomas played 1058 snaps allowing 10 QB sacks,10 QB hits,and 36 QB hurries

Douglas played 529 snaps allowing 2 QB sacks, 7 QB hits,and 25 QB hurries with 1/2 the snaps as Thomas had
double his snaps to match Thomas and you have a possibility of 4 sacks,14 qb hits and an astronomical 50 qb hurries

As for Turner he played 787 snaps or 271 less than Thomas but allowed 8 sacks versus 10 for Thomas

As for Fox he was as terrible as the rest

Just saying that everyone is picking on Thomas which he deserves
but Turner and Douglas were also terrible
 
Ya we don't have a single competent guard on the roster. It is absolutely a problem and borderline insanity that we haven't even picked up a single free agent. Unless you count an injury prone tackle.
 
Lets convince ourselves that guard was not an issue at all, we just need to stock up on more de and DT and it will mask everything else lol
 
If Guard is such a problem, then no one should have a problem with trading down in round 1 and taking Whitehair. But then instantly everyone would say, "oh no! you cant take a G in round one!!!" roll eyes.

We are drafting a G and RB in this draft. This much we know. Dallas Thomas will end up getting cut this year.

I take into consideration a couple of things:

1. Joe Philbin was a complete sandbagger, henceforth, so was everyone else. Regime change should help in that regard. If the leader is sandbagging, so will everyone else. Gase will tear into these guys and make changes once he has laid into them a couple times.

2. I do agree with the poster that its not as big a problem as it seems, but we need to address it either way. I say one G early and one late in one of the 7ths. One a true G, and one who can play Center as well. Jamil Douglas at Center was an issue IMO as well. Not sure about that whole ordeal. I thought he was a guy who could play Tackle as well as G. But he was a rookie playing for sandbagger.
 
Garnett in rd 2 and Glasgow in rd 4 would go a long way to fixing the problem imo. Maybe LeRaven Clark in rd 5 for a developmental OT. Been saying it for 2 years, but Turner should be moved to swing OT and the OG position completely revamped. I'll take Jermon Bushrod over Dallas Thomas at Guard any day. The previous regime's belief in Thomas reeks of incompetence, Gase has been saying from day 1 that Guard is a major priority, listed it as #1 iirc, and I'll bet that we go heavy at OG in the draft- we have to. Glasgow is a college Center, so there's your backup Center, same if we drafted MSU's Jack Allen.
 
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We need to go all dt and de in draft filling holes thats for suckers lol
 
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