Why was he fired from NO

[Obidan]

Obidan, your take on things contradicts what I've heard from both media and "inside" type sources. I've never heard anyone say before now that Mueller paid for his little Masters side trip, or that the coaches knew about the cameras. I HAVE heard that during the last few months, the situation became rather nasty ... the power struggle between Mueller and Fielkow, as an example.

But the bottom line is, no single reason explains why Mueller was fired. You have to look at the picture as a whole.



The key contributors to that 2000 playoff team were, in no particular order, guys like La'Roi Glover, Sammy Knight, Joe Johnson, Willie Roaf, Kyle Turley, Ricky Williams, Jerry Fontenot, Norman Hand, Darren Howard, Jeff Blake, Aaron Brooks and Joe Horn. Of those 13 players, five were Mueller aquisitions. In other words, the core of the team was already here. Mueller merely had to build around it.

When he tore apart that core, our team suffered. We haven't been back to the playoffs since.

Is Mueller dismal? After 2000, with a few exceptions the answer is yes. The Saints front office is better off under Mickey Loomis.

Hopefully, Randy will take his little brother with him now. Rick Mueller has been another thorn in our side, the leading proponent of picks like Chase Lyman and Adrian McPherson.

Yep, he paid for the side trip to Augusta, which had minimal expenses as the course passes were comped. He did only pay up though only after being approached about the additional expenses.

Those player you mention may have been the core of the team, but remember the team went 3-13 they year before Mueller arrived. The 5 acquisitions were critical to the turnaround to a 10-6 record. We were fortunate that Ditka and company left enough cap money behind to acquire some talent. In 2001 we were very cap strapped and could not afford both Glover and Johnson. Regretfully we ended up losing both when Mueller didn't want to continue to compete with GB for Johnson. Also in 2001, Mueller and Haslett assumed the rebuild was farther along than it really was. The 2000 team definitely over-achieved, but both guys later admitted they over-rated the 2000 accomplishments.

Losing Roaf was just not Mueller's fault. There was no way Willie was going to play another down in NO. He settled for what he could get which was a 4th round pick that went up to a 3rd when Willie was in on 60% of KC's offensive plays.

Are you saying we should have kept Ricky (another core player) over Deuce and not traded him away. He couldn't keep both Deuce and Ricky and he knew how flakey Ricky could be. For once in the history of our team the Saints come out on the winning end of a deal, and you want to criticize the man that manufactured it?

I just don't think his time in NO was all that bad. He has a good eye for talent and that is what Saban will be looking to him for.

By the way, any new books coming out?

 

[MelbournePhin]

He was fired becasue he traded Ricky Willaims.

the saints came out winners in that deal

 

[JimRoss]

the saints came out winners in that deal

Yeah, I guess they did.The Saints used one of the those 1sts on DE Charles Grant (Top 5 in the NFL).And Ricky Willaims, don't get me started.

 

[Phinphanatic13]

He may have turned down GM positions in the past for bad teams. Just because this is the only job he has gotten in the NFL for the past 2 years doesnt mean it was the only one he was offered.

Right, he was interviewed by several teams over the past to years and it's all about finding the right fit with the right coach for GM's. Besides, 2 years is not long anyway.

 

[RaptorBpW]

Whatever the reasons for his being fired, his shoddy personnel moves after 2000 (which I will not debate---he did a very good job that year and deserved the awards he received) were reason enough to let him go, IMHO. I think the 2005 draft, which looks very solid right now, will, for example, show that even Mueller's crown jewel in 2002 wasn't quite what we make it out to be today.

I won't debate the merits of the Ricky deal. It was a good trade, even though we bungled the other pick in 2003. Sadly, our 2003 draft ranks with 2001 as the primary draft blunders which are still haunting the team.

Randy Mueller's problem really is his stubborness. He may take advice, but he's never going to be told he's wrong. It has to be shown. He signed Connell despite multiple warnings...ditto Dale Carter. Character was never an issue for him, either, nor was team chemistry. If Saban shows him who's boss...maybe. But in Mueller we're talking about a guy who engaged in a power struggle with Benson's right-hand man, on the other side of the operaton.

As for the books...thanks for asking, man. My second novel is sitting on editors' desks at three different publishers. Just awaiting an offer now.

 

[islandah]

It's about how you handle a situation, not the end results...I don't think Saban has handle this very well..he depends on the guy's scouting report to get through the draft, then treat him like dirt..at least be respectful and tell the guy I want to go another way, be a man and up front with it. I like Speilman and know he'll do a good job with someone else. But Saban is the question mark I have, not his coaching or abilities in that area, but his ego, and professionalism.

I think you're making assumptions without evidence. Do you know that Saban treated Spielman like dirt? How do you know they didn't agree on all this before the draft? Are you basing it on the few reports of local media who no longer know every word that is spoken in Dolphin land? Has Spielman complained? Saban seems to have been very straightforward in his words and deeds since he's been here.

I think I'll wait for someone other than the jilted media to complain about his actions and professionalism before I judge him on that.

 

[Obidan]

Randy Mueller's problem really is his stubborness. He may take advice, but he's never going to be told he's wrong. It has to be shown. He signed Connell despite multiple warnings...ditto Dale Carter. Character was never an issue for him, either, nor was team chemistry. If Saban shows him who's boss...maybe. But in Mueller we're talking about a guy who engaged in a power struggle with Benson's right-hand man, on the other side of the operaton.

I'll give you that, he was pretty stubborn, but he and Haslett did eventually admit (before Mueller got fired) that they overrated where the team actually was after the 2000 season.

It's becoming more and more clear now to most front offices that character counts and I'm sure Saban knows this as well.

As for the books...thanks for asking, man. My second novel is sitting on editors' desks at three different publishers. Just awaiting an offer now.

Good luck with the book. Another Sci-Fi?

 

[RaptorBpW]

It's real-world fantasy. Ever read Clive Barker? Sort of in that same genre.

I've got a site...

http://www.theoracleproject.blogspot.com/

Check it out. The excerpts on the site are of a short story, not of Oracle, the second novel, but I'll post some things from Oracle shortly.

 

[Baltimore Saint]

He may have turned down GM positions in the past for bad teams. Just because this is the only job he has gotten in the NFL for the past 2 years doesnt mean it was the only one he was offered.

Oh but it was the only job he was offered. We have been watching him every year since he was canned.

You guys we have swapped trash many many times in the past few years You got Sammy Knight and we get Derick Rogers I think it worked out in your favor, you can keep Tesucky Jones Ill pay his airfare, and Ricky Williams , well we'll just let that one lie, but this one im not sure is too bad of a move.

Best of luck

G-

P.S. You huys have a great board , lot of great Saints of the past news

Baltimore Saint

 

[Lungoystr]

I don't remember the specifics but the owner (Benson) got really mad at him for not informing him of some trade or personnell decision. The owner wanted to be kept informed of everything and he publicly criticized him before firing him. I read the Saint's owners quotes and once saw him in a television interviewed and my uninformed and very biased impression of him was that he was a total jerk. Yea, it's his money and team and he can run his team anyway he wants to but it seemed to me that he was meddling or slowing down personnell deicisions that he shouldn't have. He needs to let the pros do their job.

Tom Benson is a prick.....so this sounds about right.

 

[CrunchTime]

This is a great thread.It gets my vote for thread of the day.I feel I have been through Randy Mueller 101 class.Its good to have some knowlegable Saint fans here to fill us in what to expect from our new GM.

 

[Butterfrog 2.0]

If I remember correctly, we've gone after Mueller more than once to be our GM, but we were turned down, probably because of how Pathetic Wanny was. I think once Again, Saban makes us more attractive place to work. I personally love this move, if, Saban and Randy get along.

Yea, That's what I thought too......... Mueller turned down the job with the Phins, and he probably turned down other jobs with NFL teams too

 

[Agua]

Wrong. It was never offered to him. You guys are thinking of Ron Wolf.

 

[CrunchTime]

Wrong. It was never offered to him. You guys are thinking of Ron Wolf.

No matter how many times you repeat it people will still think it was Mueller who turned us down.:tongue:

 

[Dolphin North]

Again, I had the very same question!! Thanks for clearing that up KuchaMucha. nice name by the way. And as for the Saint's owner Benson, from what I've heard he isn't such a great Owner. I remember reading something like he said he won't fire Jim Haslett because it would cost him too much money out of his pocket. I'm just paraphrashing here. So I think it's more of an issue with Benson than it is with than Randy Mueller.

That's good to hear!