X and O knowledge requests

Discussion in 'General NFL Forum' started by Sarnics13, Sep 1, 2017.

  1. Sons Of Shula

    Sons Of Shula not a dull boy Hammered Finheaven VIP Donator

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    Suh is a our 3 tech and as our main defensive lineman in our Over front he also sets the strength.

    Here's a base look at a 4-3 Over front with alignment and keys:

    [​IMG]
     
    Last edited: Sep 2, 2017
  2. Sons Of Shula

    Sons Of Shula not a dull boy Hammered Finheaven VIP Donator

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    More than happy though I've got to run soon, but I promise to answer all questions in detail when time permits.

    Here's a look at a base 4-3 Under scheme:

    [​IMG]

    Just because I'm throwing up graphics I also understand they might not be helpful if one is unsure of what they are looking at. Again feel free to ask more questions if needed.
     
    Last edited: Sep 1, 2017
  3. Sons Of Shula

    Sons Of Shula not a dull boy Hammered Finheaven VIP Donator

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    You will find 4 tech DL in a traditional 3-4 defense as the NT and the two DE's line head up over the Center and two Guards respectively.

    [​IMG]

    By a traditional 3-4 defense I mean that the DL will be 2 gap defenders. Think of the old Parcells/Belichick Giants defense from the 80's. These men are the behemoths of the game. Big, strong DL's. Vince Wilfork is a perfect example.

    To differentiate one and two gap principles for DL - One gap DL will play a single gap. Two gap will play the lineman and defend the gaps to either side of him which is indicates above by double arrows.
     
  4. Sarnics13

    Sarnics13 FinHeaven VIP Finheaven VIP

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    Over....under??
     
  5. Sarnics13

    Sarnics13 FinHeaven VIP Finheaven VIP

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    So a 34 D needs wilfork type truck guys bc they have to manage dual gaps to plug up lanes?
     
  6. Sons Of Shula

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    For a 4-3,

    An Over front will feature the 3 tech (DT) on the strong side of the offensive formation where the TE lines up and the 1 tech (NT) will be shaded on the opposite side from him over the Center with 3 off the ball LBs

    An Under will feature the 3 tech (DT) on the weakside of the offensive formation opposite the TE and again the 1 tech (NT) will be shaded on the opposite side from him with two off the ball LBs and and the SAM (strongside linebacker) on the LOS (line of scrimmage) over the TE.
     
    Last edited: Sep 1, 2017
  7. Sons Of Shula

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    Not all. There a 3 different types of 3-4 defenses.

    The traditional 3-4 which was posted above must have 3 two gap defensive lineman. Dick LeBeau also ran this with the Steelers.

    A one gap 3-4 which Wade Phillips is known for which mixes the principles of the 4-3, in that it's a 3-4 front but one gap responsibilities for everyone along in the front 7.

    And hybrid 3-4 which Belichick is known for and I can give greater detail on that later. There's a **** ton that goes into his defenses.
     
  8. Sarnics13

    Sarnics13 FinHeaven VIP Finheaven VIP

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    I realize you are probably scratching your head at how someone could not know all this but how the hell do you get all this straight unless you're actively involved in the game at a high level??


    The 3 in "3-4" means three Dlineman on the line?
     
  9. Sons Of Shula

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    Along with having been involved in the sport as a player and even coaching to some extent, I've studied football extensively over the years. At least 4-5 days out of the week I read articles, clinic reports, and research reports; I watch coaching clinics and the televised games with no sound and then watch more closely throughout the week via coaches film (All-22 and goaline cams); I also study systems, schemes, strategy, player assignments/evaluations, etc. from other resources and materials. It's become a very enjoyable hobby.

    Yes, the first number tells of the down lineman, the second indicates the number of LBs, and the DBs are given by the amount left over.
     
  10. Sarnics13

    Sarnics13 FinHeaven VIP Finheaven VIP

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    What's the advantage of one D over the other? 3-4 and 4-3?
     
  11. Sons Of Shula

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    That depends heavily on the coach's philosophy as there are many variations of each. Let's just make it simple and focus on a few examples and strictly on the traditional principles and front alignments of the two.

    4-3

    Advantages:
    - Simple player assignments. The 4 DL pass rush first and react to the run. The 3 LBs read run first and react to the pass.
    - Good against the run b/c the 4 down lineman allows the LBs, especially the MLB, to flow behind them.

    Disadvantages:
    - Requires top MLB play.
    - poor against spread, modern pass offenses, and play-action.
    - less options for blitzing

    3-4

    Advantages:
    - Gives you mutiple blitz looks
    - Lends to an athletic and versatile LB unit

    Disadvantages:
    - Requires 3 two gap DL.
    - LBs must be the playmakers.
     
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  12. Sarnics13

    Sarnics13 FinHeaven VIP Finheaven VIP

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    So 3-4 is a concept sought by coaches that are heavy blitz type coaches i would assume. With more athletic, quick LB's as opposed to thumpers since they're in coverage often....?

    Based on that i don't really understand what we are. I typically see only 3 LB but from your explanation kiko would seem like a 3-4 LB in a 4-3 system. That would explain why you are not a fan of his?
     
  13. Sons Of Shula

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    Not necessarily. Even though Dick LeBeau was known for the Zone Blitz, it was more often than not about safe pressure. Though the term might sound aggressive it's actually a conservative approach of blitzing 5 and dropping 6 into coverage. The catch was simply that the offense didn't know which 5 from the 11 were going to rush the QB and which 6 were dropping. It causes not only confusion for the QB in post snap reads but also upfront for the o-line in not knowing who they will have to be blocking.

    But you are correct on the 2nd part of that in that they feature more athletic LB who can cover and blitz.

    Bingo on Alonso. He had his ROTY accolades in essentially a 3-4 defense. I also think his 3 knee surgeries and hip surgery has slowed him and zapped him of strength at the POA (point of attack).
     
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  14. Sarnics13

    Sarnics13 FinHeaven VIP Finheaven VIP

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    Nickel package?
     
  15. Sons Of Shula

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    Nickel - It's a defensive passing package. So think of the number of DBs and the number value that represents a nickel. This package contains 5 DBs (3 CBs, 2 S). A listed like the base defenses we discussed of the 4-3 and 3-4, so a nickel defense can also be listed as a 4-2 (4 DL, 2 LB), or 3-3 (3 DL, 3 LB) even 2-4 (2 DL, 4 LB)

    Big Nickel - the 3rd CB or slot CB is replaced by a safety; usually a SS/LB hybrid.

    Dime - 6 DBs
     

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