BIG NEWS! Boston may be back in November! | Page 5 | FinHeaven - Miami Dolphins Forums

BIG NEWS! Boston may be back in November!

If we are .500 by the midway point I'd welcome Boston back with open arms. I hope the team puts him on the PUP list as opposed to IR.
 
chuckcole said:
Putting someone on the PUP allows them to rehabilitate and hopefully have them available before the end of the season. It also allows the team to not count someone on the PUP on the active 53-man roster. So, the way I see it, they could put Boston on the PUP, let him rehabilitate, and when he is eligible to come off of the PUP (which is like 10 weeks into the season, I believe -- could possibly be as early as 6 weeks, I can't remember exactly), the team has a chance to evaluate them to see if they are ready and able. If not, they can just put them on IR. I think we did the same thing with David Bowens last year.
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He's not eligible for PUP. That is only for players that are still is some stage of recovery from injury when training camp opens, which precludes them for getting clean bill of health in a physical exam. Once camp begins and a player gets hurt in practice or a preseason game, PUP is not an option. Look no further than your example of D Bowens. He got hurt in an accident at home before camp opened.
Wooden for example, has not practiced yet and is on a form of PUP used in camp called active PUP which is what Zach was on. They weren't ready to go when camp opened. As soon as they are ready to begin participation in training camp, they are removed from active PUP. If in the case of Wooden he is not able to practice all training camp, he could be placed on PUP at that time, or any time between now and then, and if healthy could come back mid season, or if the team did not activate him at that time, he would then have to go on IR.
 
MrClean said:
He's not eligible for PUP. That is only for players that are still is some stage of recovery from injury when training camp opens, which precludes them for getting clean bill of health in a physical exam. Once camp begins and a player gets hurt in practice or a preseason game, PUP is not an option. Look no further than your example of D Bowens. He got hurt in an accident at home before camp opened.
Wooden for example, has not practiced yet and is on a form of PUP used in camp called active PUP which is what Zach was on. They weren't ready to go when camp opened. As soon as they are ready to begin participation in training camp, they are removed from active PUP. If in the case of Wooden he is not able to practice all training camp, he could be placed on PUP at that time, or any time between now and then, and if healthy could come back mid season, or if the team did not activate him at that time, he would then have to go on IR.
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My bad. I thought was at any time during training camp. I guess we can still have hope, but it will cost us a roster spot if we don't put him on IR.
 
Atila said:
keep in mind that when people make "projected" returns its ALWAYS later than they think, those projections are like the earliest and most optimistic possible. if he does comeback, i wouldnt expect him before week12
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Not necessarily depends on injury. Also how complicated the surgury. If it is something routine like Zach had he could come back early like Zach.
 
Hey, If he is healthy, play him. Does anybody remember Rod Woodson in 95????
I'am not a doctor so who I'am I to say that if the doc says okay.
 
chuckcole said:
My bad. I thought was at any time during training camp. I guess we can still have hope, but it will cost us a roster spot if we don't put him on IR.
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if we kept him as the 5th WR, the 5th Wr seldom sees time with the offense anyway, so that may not be too much of an impact. A 5th WR may be a gunner on coverage teams, return man or something such as that. Often may not be active on game day at all depending on who it is. If we keep Wilkins as a return man, then we may even carry 6 WRs, if we carry Boston on the 53. I'm not sure Wilkins will even be kept in that role. We could keep Simmons as the 4th WR and punt returner and Russell could be the 3rd RB and KO returner. That is a possible scenario.
So we'd need one of our backup DBs or LBs to fill some of the same special teams coverage roles, which should not be too difficult to find.
 
There is a list that DB can be placed on when the team makes it's final cut to 53. If Boston can make that list and not be on IR, he'll be able to come back. I can't think of that list right now, but teams do this a lot at the 53 man cuts. The player can't come back any earlier than what the list says. I've got a brain fart on the name of this list, but it's there and the player has to wait a certain time frame before he can come back.
 
You are thinking of Physically Unable to Perform (PUP) and he is not eligible for PUP. Look at previous post on subject for more about it.
 
Here's some info I found on the PUP...

"NFL rules allow teams to designate players as "Physically Unable to Perform." Once they are designated as such, they are prohibited from practicing with the team. They can, however, rehabilitate and participate in team meetings. If a player begins training camp on the PUP list, they can be moved to the active roster at any time, even after one practice. A player is not allowed to be placed on the PUP list if they start training camp on the active roster."
-http://ww2.nfl.com/ce/multi/0%2C3783%2C5547626%2C00.html

Also, didn't Willis McGahee go to training camp last year before going on the PUP at the beginning of the season?
 
You can put a player on PUP any time you want as long as it is before the season starts as far as I remember.

Boston coming back that early would be fine, but he'd never have the same explosion or chemistry with the QB.

I'd say it could help, but it is a long shot he'd contribute much.
 
Remember when Fred Barnett got hurt? He was placed on a list after the 53 man roster cuts. He was eneligible to come back for xx number of weeks, but after that time frame, the team had (I think) three weeks to make a decison on that player. Either to activate or IR him. I think Barnett was hurt during camp. I could be wrong.
 
The D. Bowens case is not all that pertinent because there is a specific list designated for guys with non-football related injuries.

The PUP list is an option for D.Boston. He's not on ANY list right now, but he can be placed on the PUP list at the start of the season and he will be ineligible to play for the first 6 weeks of the season, and then the team will have approximately 4 weeks to either bring him onto the 53 man roster (and cut someone in the process) or at the end of the 4 weeks they have to release the player to free agency.

This is what they will be doing with Damion McIntosh. I have no doubt that David Boston chose his time frame, 10 weeks, by adding the 6 weeks plus the 4 weeks. His plan is to rehab and heal as well as he can in order to get the coaches to put him on the PUP list instead of IR (which would make him ineligible for the entire season). On the one hand it sounds like something a player would want to do, come back during the season...and the PUP list rules gives him an easy-access time table that probably has more to do with the PUP list than it does a medical assessment of how quickly he could come back.

On the other hand though, this is David Boston. He's a physical freak. He is a nutrition freak. He is a workout freak. If there is ANYONE that would rehab so dilligently, use an advantageous nutritional diet, and outright heal that fast it would probably be him. Plus, this is looking like the same thing he dealt with in 2001 with the Cardinals with the other knee, so he has experience with this injury and knows how to rehab it and how long it could take etc. So when I read this I was very encouraged. At this point I will take what I can get from Boston. This injury may have concluded the whole Boston-Miami experiment despite his dilligence in his workouts etc.

Remember that we've seen that kind of newlywed dilligence before. Ricky Williams was a MODEL citizen, workout warrior, and showed all the signs that he was ready to step up and be a reliable player. Boston made that kind of turnaround after having a horrible personality in San Diego and Arizona. But now he's got an injury strike against him. We can't count on him personality-wise, or injury-wise now, so when the Dolphins make longterm plans for the WR dept they have to keep that in mind.

So to me, all this talk about him being real careful and not playing at all this year as a precaution etc...is not something that I think. He's his own man, and if he wants to chance an early comeback he has the responsibility for deciding. NOBODY would think down on him if he just went on IR because thats what everyone expects. But if he did come back, and he helped us move the chains some, and he helped us get to the playoffs...that would show something to this coaching staff, and it would help this team tremendously.
 
YAY this is good... i feel we could be in a good spot by week 10... anyways its about time for some good news tired of hearing s*hit...
 
ckparrothead said:
The D. Bowens case is not all that pertinent because there is a specific list designated for guys with non-football related injuries.

The PUP list is an option for D.Boston. He's not on ANY list right now, but he can be placed on the PUP list at the start of the season and he will be ineligible to play for the first 6 weeks of the season, and then the team will have approximately 4 weeks to either bring him onto the 53 man roster (and cut someone in the process) or at the end of the 4 weeks they have to release the player to free agency.

This is what they will be doing with Damion McIntosh. I have no doubt that David Boston chose his time frame, 10 weeks, by adding the 6 weeks plus the 4 weeks. His plan is to rehab and heal as well as he can in order to get the coaches to put him on the PUP list instead of IR (which would make him ineligible for the entire season). On the one hand it sounds like something a player would want to do, come back during the season...and the PUP list rules gives him an easy-access time table that probably has more to do with the PUP list than it does a medical assessment of how quickly he could come back.
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I think you are mistaken about Boston being eligible for PUP. Injuries suffered during training camp are different than when a player is still recovering from an off season or prior season injury, surgery etc. I can recall many times when a team was torn at the final cutdown as to whether carry a player on the 53 man roster in hopes he'd come back late in the season or just to put him on IR and lose him for the season
If you have a link to a site that gives the parameters for PUP eligibilty, I'd like to see it.
McIntosh is currently on the same thing Zach WAS on on. Active PUP. He was not ready to go at the start of camp, so was placed there and during preseason he can be activated from it at any time like Zach was. If he is still not ready to be activated by week 1 of the regular season then he can be placed on PUP.

I just found the following definitions for PUP, IR, and Non Football Injury lists:

PHYSICALLY UNABLE TO PERFORM (PUP). A player who fails his club's pre-season physical at the start of training camp may be placed on the club's Physically Unable to Perform (PUP) list. A player on PUP is eligible to receive his salary, but is ineligible for games and practices; he is, however, allowed to attend team meetings. For a three (3) week period beginning with the day after the club's 6th regular season game and ending on the day after the 9th regular season game, a player on PUP may practice with his club and/or be restored to the club's 53 man roster (provided it is done before the day after the 9th regular season game).

RESERVE/INJURED. A player who suffers an injury in practice or game after passing his club's pre-season physical may be placed on the club's Reserve/Injured list if the injury renders him physically unable to play football. A player will continue to receive his salary (usually the lower of the split salary stated in the contract - $130,000 for 1st year players in 2003) while on the Reserve/Injured list, but he is prohibited from practicing with the club for the remainder of the season (attending team meetings, however, is allowed).

NON-FOOTBALL INJURY OR ILLNESS (NFI). A player who fails the pre-season physical of his club because on an injury unrelated to football (i.e., plays basketball and gets hurt) may be placed on the Non-Football Injury or Illness (NFI) list if the injury renders him unable to play football. A player will not be entitled to receive his salary on NFI (but the club can elect to pay him) and will be prohibited from practicing with the club until the three (3) week period beginning the day after the club's 6th regular season game (similar to the format previously discussed for PUP). If the non-football related injury occurs after the player passes the club's preseason physical (i.e., cuts his leg while mowing his lawn), the player may also be placed on NFI but is not able to return to practice or play with the club at any time during the season.

The link where I found this:
http://www.profootballtalk.com/agentarc.htm

Here is another blurb from an nfl.com article:
NFL rules allow teams to designate players as "Physically Unable to Perform." Once they are designated as such, they are prohibited from practicing with the team. They can, however, rehabilitate and participate in team meetings. If a player begins training camp on the PUP list, they can be moved to the active roster at any time, even after one practice. A player is not allowed to be placed on the PUP list if they start training camp on the active roster.
The link: http://www.nfl.com/ce/multi/0,3783,5547626,00.html
 
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