Cap Situation - If Dolphins trade for LT Branden Albert | Page 3 | FinHeaven - Miami Dolphins Forums

Cap Situation - If Dolphins trade for LT Branden Albert

Southbeach 2 said:
With the new TV deals, the cap will increase next year, just a question of how much. I have seen estimates from a low of $5M to a high of $15M.

I would bet that Wallace has already agreed to a re-structure with the signing bonus next yearwhich was not there in his current deal.
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Pretty sure the NFL TV deal kicks in 2014 which means that would have an effect on the 2015 cap numbers and not the 2014 ones.

And as far as Mike Wallace already agreeing to a restructure..... think thats a little hasty. I dontk now it off the top of my head, but when was the last time the Dolphin's actually restructured a contract? Have we done it since Ireland has been GM? I'm not being sarcastic at all, I really just dont know the answer.

The reason I ask is because certain front offices have certain tendency's... for example some front offices do not restructure, some dont give signing bonus, some dont give work out bonus... its just how they do business. If we havent restructured a deal under this regime... its entirely possible its not even an option for Mike
 
damanref10 said:
Pretty sure the NFL TV deal kicks in 2014 which means that would have an effect on the 2015 cap numbers and not the 2014 ones.

And as far as Mike Wallace already agreeing to a restructure..... think thats a little hasty. I dontk now it off the top of my head, but when was the last time the Dolphin's actually restructured a contract? Have we done it since Ireland has been GM? I'm not being sarcastic at all, I really just dont know the answer.

The reason I ask is because certain front offices have certain tendency's... for example some front offices do not restructure, some dont give signing bonus, some dont give work out bonus... its just how they do business. If we havent restructured a deal under this regime... its entirely possible its not even an option for Mike
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Ireland restructured the contract of Will Allen once, and Vernon Carey, but Carey's was mostly considered as more of a paycut than anything else.
 
damanref10 said:
Good call.

So now the question becomes what the NFL and NFLPA negotiate the cap increase to be.
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It is not subject to negotiation, it is what the numbers say it is, based on the CBA. However, many differ on what the initial impact will be. Based on the history of the last time this happened, the cap should jump by $20M but, many owners see it differently. It is gonna be some fun next off season.
 
CRAZYDOLFAN305 said:
Ireland restructured the contract of Will Allen once, and Vernon Carey, but Carey's was mostly considered as more of a paycut than anything else.
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Hmmm i just looked up the Will Allen one and PFT used the word restructure... but then said it was a paycut.

I'm wondering if we have done any traditional restructures where its guaranteed money into signing bonus...

---------- Post added at 02:21 PM ---------- Previous post was at 02:19 PM ----------
Southbeach 2 said:
It is not subject to negotiation, it is what the numbers say it is, based on the CBA. However, many differ on what the initial impact will be. Based on the history of the last time this happened, the cap should jump by $20M but, many owners see it differently. It is gonna be some fun next off season.
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totally right again there SOBE... just got out of donating blood, little woozy and not sure what the hell I was thinking
 
CRAZYDOLFAN305 said:
Ireland restructured the contract of Will Allen once, and Vernon Carey, but Carey's was mostly considered as more of a paycut than anything else.
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History means nothing here. Wallace took nothing this year but, did get his guaranteed money. His deal will be re-structured next year. I would bet on it.
 
damanref10 said:
Hmmm i just looked up the Will Allen one and PFT used the word restructure... but then said it was a paycut.

I'm wondering if we have done any traditional restructures where its guaranteed money into signing bonus...

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totally right again there SOBE... just got out of donating blood, little woozy and not sure what the hell I was thinking
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Not a problem Daman. Good to talk with a cap knowledgeable Phinatic.
 
damanref10 said:
And just for reference.. 41 players under contract in 2014 right now with 100 million committed. Plus, lets assume 1 million for practice squad. plus 5 for draft picks next year (just averaged 4-6 as likely number), with limited to no roll over from this year..You are looking at 106 million tied up in a 123 million dollar cap... with A LOT of roster holes. The way you alleviate that problem is good drafting.... adding a giant Albert $$ figure in there doesnt help one bit, and even though we can cut a few guys who dont have any dead money repercussions, the wiggle room is pretty damn tight
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Seems to me by this post 41 vets + 4-6 Rookies = 45 to 47 players on the roster of 106 million cap... leaving 4-6 roster spots open and 17 million (assuming the cap limit stays the same) to spend on FA and 2014 draft class. That's without a restructure or cut. Hardly cap hell in my eyes.
 
The Omen said:
Seems to me by this post 41 vets + 4-6 Rookies = 45 to 47 players on the roster of 106 million cap... leaving 4-6 roster spots open and 17 million (assuming the cap limit stays the same) to spend on FA and 2014 draft class. That's without a restructure or cut. Hardly cap hell in my eyes.
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+ 4-6 million for rookies drafted in the 2014 draft
+ if we create some room this year by extending starks..lowering his number this year, but adding money to later cap
+ "top 5 LT" money if we sign albert, which is what this whole thread is presuming round which is going to be 7-9+ million a year possible... and POOF... 17 million is more than gone already
 
damanref10 said:
+ 4-6 million for rookies drafted in the 2014 draft+ if we create some room this year by extending starks..lowering his number this year, but adding money to later cap+ "top 5 LT" money if we sign albert, which is what this whole thread is presuming round which is going to be 7-9+ million a year possible... and POOF... 17 million is more than gone already
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so basically worse case senario we are right at the limit... yes? still not cap hell... Not arguing, just making sure I understand.

---------- Post added at 12:52 PM ---------- Previous post was at 12:51 PM ----------
damanref10 said:
+ 4-6 million for rookies drafted in the 2014 draft+ if we create some room this year by extending starks..lowering his number this year, but adding money to later cap+ "top 5 LT" money if we sign albert, which is what this whole thread is presuming round which is going to be 7-9+ million a year possible... and POOF... 17 million is more than gone already
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not to mention you're not counting the 2013 draft class in this equation.
 
The Omen said:
so basically worse case senario we are right at the limit... yes? still not cap hell... Not arguing, just making sure I understand.

---------- Post added at 12:52 PM ---------- Previous post was at 12:51 PM ----------

not to mention you're not counting the 2013 draft class in this equation.
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I understand you arent arguing, neither was I.. didnt mean for it to come off argumentative

My entire stance on this thing is that we are not in cap hell like some suggest, but that the potential is most certainly there.

If this team wins games and doesnt have to alter the roster significantly, there shouldnt be any problems, but if the team doesnt win next year, with big money extensions looming for Reshad Jones and Branden Albert if we do indeed trade for him... we wont have enough money to replace impending free agents except through the draft. If we hit on the draft picks, then you have great talent at a cheap cost.. but if we dont (which is kinda how we have been lately)... then you have serious roster holes but no way to fix them.

Southbeach made a great point earlier about the possibility of the cap significantly increasing next year due to the impending NFL TV deals... but until those figures actually come through.. you have to assume the cap isnt going to go up significantly.

Basically, are we in cap hell... no we are not. Is the potential there, especially with trading for and extending the contract of Branden Albert... now the potential implications are a lot more dire. If the team wins.... it means this group works and alterations dont need to be great and the cap should work just fine for us... if we dont win, need to cut players, take on dead money and find suitable replacements..... well now you are in "cap hell" because you dont have to room needed to do that.

Win games, and this all fixes itself.
 
Is Albert worth the $7-9M/year he is asking for? Is everyone on board with his talent level, or are the Dolphins just grabbing the best available LT? Is Albert a top 5 LT in the league?
 
damanref10 said:
I understand you arent arguing, neither was I.. didnt mean for it to come off argumentative

My entire stance on this thing is that we are not in cap hell like some suggest, but that the potential is most certainly there.

If this team wins games and doesnt have to alter the roster significantly, there shouldnt be any problems, but if the team doesnt win next year, with big money extensions looming for Reshad Jones and Branden Albert if we do indeed trade for him... we wont have enough money to replace impending free agents except through the draft. If we hit on the draft picks, then you have great talent at a cheap cost.. but if we dont (which is kinda how we have been lately)... then you have serious roster holes but no way to fix them.

Southbeach made a great point earlier about the possibility of the cap significantly increasing next year due to the impending NFL TV deals... but until those figures actually come through.. you have to assume the cap isnt going to go up significantly.

Basically, are we in cap hell... no we are not. Is the potential there, especially with trading for and extending the contract of Branden Albert... now the potential implications are a lot more dire. If the team wins.... it means this group works and alterations dont need to be great and the cap should work just fine for us... if we dont win, need to cut players, take on dead money and find suitable replacements..... well now you are in "cap hell" because you dont have to room needed to do that.

Win games, and this all fixes itself.
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Thanks for the explanations. In a couple of your posts you write that we could possibly be in cap hell if this group of players doesn't work, but I have repeatedly read on Finheaven that under most of the players contracts we have signed this year the Fins did a great job of providing themselves an out for the rest of the contract after the 3rd year. Does the site you get your information for contracts show this or is this a common misconception.

Edit: BTW overthecap.com is great. How did I not know about this site?
 
mnphinfan said:
Thanks for the explanations. In a couple of your posts you write that we could possibly be in cap hell if this group of players doesn't work, but I have repeatedly read on Finheaven that under most of the players contracts we have signed this year the Fins did a great job of providing themselves an out for the rest of the contract after the 3rd year. Does the site you get your information for contracts show this or is this a common misconception.

Edit: BTW overthecap.com is great. How did I not know about this site?
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No problem man, and I appreciate the banter (and Sobe's) because obviously not everything I understand through the cap is understood correctly, so if you see a discrepancy, please dont hesitate to call me out on it and we'll try and find out if it's correct or not.

The presiding logic is that if we survive 3 years through most of these contracts... we should get through the woods, however... think about it this way, if we lose this year, and Ireland gets fired... the team goes into potentially a "full rebuilding mode" depending on the vision of the new GM.... soooo new GM takes over with a 3 year plan in place that wasnt his... yet he cant do much because for 2 more years there are serious consequences.

Thats the irony of this whole situation. If we win... great. If we lose and Jeff gets canned.... why does he care how bad the contracts are... its not his mess to clean up.

And overthecap is a phenomenal resource. Jason, the guy who runs it, started off with NYjetscap.com and then recently launched overthecap... its great. The reality of most NFL extensions with good players is that they arent set up to last the full 5 years or whatever, but it creates flexibility by apportioning giant signing bonus's across more years, so it lowers the hit by each year... however, lets say we give Branden Albert a 5 year deal... who has an injury history.. or Mike Wallace who lets say doesnt become an elite receiver like we hope (and paid him to be)... or ellerbe and wheeler turn out to be serious downgrades in LB.... now you have to make cuts, on giant deals... and assuming that happens... it probably didnt take until year 3 to figure it out...

Either way, the possibility of problems exists.. but right now its all "what if" scenarios.... question is... which ones are more likely than others... and not to be the pessimist, but betting on the team to "finally" win this year... although more likely than past years... is still highly questionable
 
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