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Harris Island

No way in hell Harris would have been available at 32.
It's comical reading these fantasy posts where some of you are just so certain the draft would have gone down to fit your narrative
 
Dsteve said:
I also wouldn't have picked Ted ginn Jason Allen Jamal Fletcher John Avery Jared odrick dion Jordan and so on so I won't be silenced by the"they're the experts so atfu" rhetoric.
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Yeah, but last time I checked this regime didn't draft those players either. Maybe instead of trying to trash a player just give your opinion on what you wanted done instead.
 
Blackshade said:
I don't hate the Charles Harris pick but I do think some of you guys are so committed to defending the pick that you have lost some perspective too. He is talented kid but he does need a lot of development before he is reaching some of the milestones I see thrown around about him. Harris has a skill set that is in great demand in the NFL in rushing the QB but to me that is where I part company with a lot of his defenders.

People talk about the kid being a great pass rusher right now who is capable of getting 10 sacks this year or next but failed to mention that the kid hasn't really been that productive against average college OTs. I keep seeing the Dwight Freeney comparisons but Freeney had as many sacks in his last year in college that Harris had in his entire career there. I like the skill set but I don't like the lack of production and when you combine that with the lack of ability against the run I didn't quite see the value at 22. If Miami had traded back and gotten another high draft pick and then got Harris at 32 or so then he would be a pick that I think would be getting much less criticism.

I hope the kid does well and shuts up all his detractors but I do think some of his detractors have valid points about him.
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I'm shocked Harris doesn't have a FH nickname yet.

Looked at title of thread..... nevermind.
 
kcbrown said:
If Harris can become 70% of what Wake is I'd be happy.

Yes, he can't defend the run, and I hope he can learn some run defensive techniques, but if he never defends the run (like Wake), he'd still be worth a number one pick. Looking back at Wake's career - he's played like a 1st rounder no doubt.

Falcons fans were about to call Vic Beasley a bust after his first year sack total....then, in Year 2 (last year), he led the league. Give the kid a year or two, to learn some moves, get confident, then we can reevaluate this thing.
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I posted a thread in the draft forum, after seeing Beasley, at the start of the college football season, several years back; because I saw a guy with the quickest 1st step, I've ever seen. Charles Harris, while not Vic Beasley, is close in terms of his quickness off the ball and quick 1st step. They also compare, favorably, in terms of overall size. Charles Harris has all kinds of pass rush tools, not just his spin move that is reminicant of Dwight Freeney. Harris said in an interview after his selection, he was challenged to learn 1 pass rush move a week, by his college coach and responded be developing an array of moves. Harris credits this work ethic or training for his success. I love his attitude and passion to learn and master his kraft. It's almost like "The Karate Kid" movies, where Ralph Maccio trains to master his kraft.
 
Dsteve said:
A project because he's got multiple things to learn to have any consistent success at the next level. There's def more than one hole in his game. He needs a counter to his spin move, he needs to get off blocks better in the run game instead of just chasing the ball and so on. These things are very coachable but even then his upside based on physical size and speed limitations isn't as high as I would like given the compatible talent at his and other positions at that pick. Could have easily traded back and maybe still have gotten him, lamp or one of the other pass rushers.
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That's your assessment that he was still been available, and I don't agree. He was slatted to go somewhere between 11-16. The only reason he was around at 22 is probably because of the unexpected rush on offense of players.
You take that, and added how Foster was dropping like a rock and I can understand why Miami did not want to take a chance trading down. They obviously view this guy's talent as special and probably worth the time working on is "so-called" holes.
 
insomnia411 said:
I don't understand the negativity I've seen on this board towards Harris. The 2 main gripes that I've seen people have with the Harris selection are :
1. He didn't test super well at the combine
And
2. He will (barring injury) be limited to a pass rush specialist role this year, while a Lamp or Rueben Foster at 22 would have supposedly made a bigger impact year 1.
Allow me to address both of these issues.

1. NFL personnel people have a long and illustrious history of buffoonery in passing up great football players because according to some arbitrary metric or algorithm, said players didn't run in a straight line fast enough, didn't jump high enough, or didn't lift a relatively heavy metal rod off of their chests enough times. This has always allowed some lucky team to take advantage of a poor combine showing to steal an outstanding football player far lower in the draft than he should have gone.
Examples of this run from Anquan Boldin to Zach Thomas to Jerry Rice to Vontaze Burfict and the list goes on and on. If you put on the tape, Harris (much like Jerry Rice) plays a hell of a lot faster than he times, and is a passionate, firey beast on the field that loves the game and wants to be one of the greats. I frankly do not give a **** how fast a defensive end can run 40 yards in a straight line in his underwear. It has virtually no bearing on the position and it tells me absolutely nothing about Harris' repertoire of pass rush moves, his work ethic, his love for the game, his functional strength and intensity at his position, or his overall talent level. Harris just needs to improve his technique against the run and he'll be an elite DE in football for at least a decade.

2. So what? You don't draft a kid for what he will do as a rookie, you draft him for his long term outlook for his entire career. Any gm that spends a first rounder on a player over another better player at a position of higher value because mjjiumjjmjjhimimjcmjmicfljhe would (probably) plahzi7jnmighernjmcmmmiijmmhmuihumuy more as a rookie should be instantly ****in fired. Foster was a better prospect than Harris but he had huge red flags, and Harris plays a position of greater value... He obviously plays a position of much greater value than Lamp too. Basically if all of these guys pan out, you take the great end over the great mlb or G.
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spoke prematurely

now you can close it
 
jlfin said:
No way in hell Harris would have been available at 32.
It's comical reading these fantasy posts where some of you are just so certain the draft would have gone down to fit your narrative
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I don't think he'd of gone below 23. Someone would have moved up. Worst case scenario no way Dallas takes Taco over Harris. They were in love with Harris.

I don't know why some people are talking like this guy had a lower grade. Most mocks had him going between New Orleans at 11 and Miami at 22, with the majority somewhere in the teens.
 
Dsteve said:
Harris is a project. He's got things to learn in the run game and his pass rush needs a better timed bend and a counter move for that filthy spin move he's got. There were higher upside players at that position and some studs at other positions of great need. Not the pick I would have made but oh well.

I also wouldn't have picked Ted ginn Jason Allen Jamal Fletcher John Avery Jared odrick dion Jordan and so on so I won't be silenced by the"they're the experts so atfu" rhetoric.
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He's not a project as a pass rusher. He just needs to be taught correctly to take the guy blocking him more seriously to engage and shed the block while reading the play. That's why in the pros they still run those silly drills morning noon and night.
 
finfan54 said:
He's not a project as a pass rusher. He just needs to be taught correctly to take the guy blocking him more seriously to engage and shed the block while reading the play. That's why in the pros they still run those silly drills morning noon and night.
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He's not a project. His game will either translate to the pros or it won't and he'll be a step slow against NFL quality tackles and will have a pedestrian career. But I remember a lot of people had similar concerns about Landry and if he could beat NFL DBs at the same clip he was beating college DBs. So we'll just have to wait and see.
 
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