Matt Ryan- Numbers speak for themselves!!

[finfan54]

I just have one thought on Matt Ryan. If he is going to be drafted as high as you guys think he is, then it won't be by us. Parcells NEVER NEVER takes a quarterback that high.

Drew Bledsoe?

 

[finfan54]

Matt Ryan has all the prototype skills. He is also suppose to be good at reading defenses and such. His talent was not very good from what I have heard or read or their were injuries the team was dealing with at WR.

Ryan is a smart cookie who can improvise. It will take him time to develope however, just like any QB coming out. He does not have character issues and is a leader which is what they already know.

 

[StLouisFinFan]

Right and that's why every gm says he's the best QB in the country.

Sorry, Adam, but I've gotta call you on this one. Give me a list of "all GMs" who consider him the "best" in the country, please. From what I know, there are a couple of GMs, ala Charley Casserly, who provide their "professional" opinions on some of these draft nik web sites, magazines, etc., but that's hardly "every GM", or even "most GMs". You have to remember to take what some of these draft niks say about players coming out of college, as you'll often be fed a stream of garbage that they picked off of the junk heap of "scouting reports" they stole from other similar scouting services. If these guys were really talented at evaluating college level prospects, don't you think they'd have real jobs with real teams instead of playing the role of a poser while feeding the NFL media hype machine with regurgitated crap?

Cases in point:

Jerry Rice was too slow and didn't play top level competition
Brett Favre was too wild
Eric Dickerson ran too upright
Dave Meggett was too small
Zach Thomas was too small

And while I know that John Beck has his own set of question marks, a few question marks he shouldn't have had while coming out of college were his arm strength or his deep ball ability. I saw this crap from just about every one of those draft nik outlets, and yet I come to find out, on my own by reviewing game film and stats, that in his first two years, under a different offensive system that was geared for the vertical offense, he was slinging it long and hitting the mark. On top of that, he put up one of the highest ball velocity numbers in the combine in the last few years (2nd highest his draft year). So, you'll have to excuse me if I scoff at what is being written about certain players. It's mostly regurgitated, recycled garbage.

 

[I am Bane]

NY GIANTS:

1984- Jeff Hostetler round 3 #59

NE Patriots:

1993- Drew Bledsoe round 1 #1

NY JETS:

they got Pennington the year after he left

DALLAS COWBOYS:

not one in 5 years

MIAMI DOLPHINS:

2008- BANE round 1 #1


but looking at his draft history, man he finds some great palyers in low rounds, and much talent that lasts a long time. that also is due to great coaching!!!

 

[StLouisFinFan]

Matt Ryan has all the prototype skills. He is also suppose to be good at reading defenses and such. His talent was not very good from what I have heard or read or their were injuries the team was dealing with at WR.

Ryan is a smart cookie who can improvise. It will take him time to develope however, just like any QB coming out. He does not have character issues and is a leader which is what they already know.

Throwing a lot of Ints isn't prototypical for an NFL QB. I doubt any of his sub-par talented teammates threw those picks either. And true NFL QB superstars don't need someone else to offer up excuses to counter his red flags.

 

[adamprez2003]

Sorry, Adam, but I've gotta call you on this one. Give me a list of "all GMs" who consider him the "best" in the country, please. From what I know, there are a couple of GMs, ala Charley Casserly, who provide their "professional" opinions on some of these draft nik web sites, magazines, etc., but that's hardly "every GM", or even "most GMs". You have to remember to take what some of these draft niks say about players coming out of college, as you'll often be fed a stream of garbage that they picked off of the junk heap of "scouting reports" they stole from other similar scouting services. If these guys were really talented at evaluating college level prospects, don't you think they'd have real jobs with real teams instead of playing the role of a poser while feeding the NFL media hype machine with regurgitated crap?

Cases in point:

Jerry Rice was too slow and didn't play top level competition
Brett Favre was too wild
Eric Dickerson ran too upright
Dave Meggett was too small
Zach Thomas was too small

And while I know that John Beck has his own set of question marks, a few question marks he shouldn't have had while coming out of college were his arm strength or his deep ball ability. I saw this crap from just about every one of those draft nik outlets, and yet I come to find out, on my own by reviewing game film and stats, that in his first two years, under a different offensive system that was geared for the vertical offense, he was slinging it long and hitting the mark. On top of that, he put up one of the highest ball velocity numbers in the combine in the last few years (2nd highest his draft year). So, you'll have to excuse me if I scoff at what is being written about certain players. It's mostly regurgitated, recycled garbage.

I cant believe Matt Ryan being the consensus best QB in the draft is still debatable. Only on FinHeaven

Here for you and cncc

Here is the Heckert article I mentioned earlier

http://chicagosports.chicagotribune...s-080124dan-pompei-nfl-draft,1,2370977.column

The Tribune asked seven NFL front office executives whom they would pick if they had the first selection. Six of them first said they would trade the pick if they could. But the chances of a trade are minimal — the Dolphins' only possibility would be if they accepted lower than market value for the pick.

"I don't see anybody moving into that spot," Browns general manager Phil Savage said. "Why? It's hard when there are really, really good players up there."

Told they couldn't trade, two front office men said they would take Boston College quarterback Matt Ryan, two would take Virginia defensive end Chris Long and two would take Arkansas running back Darren McFadden. One said he would take Louisiana State defensive tackle Glenn Dorsey.

Another mentioned Michigan offensive tackle Jake Long as a possibility, but conceded he rated Long below Joe Thomas, whom the Browns took with the third pick of the 2007 draft.

The Casserly statement was on CBS so unless you know how to get CBS transcripts the best I can do is indirect references from dtraft blogs

Matt Ryan is the consensus top QB in the opinions of NFL draft scouts. Charlie Casserly contacted all 32 teams and to inquire on where they ranked this years prospects. Casserly said "Ryan is head and shoulders above all the other QB's in the minds of the NFL scouts." Smart move by Ryan to not do anything to change that. Now somebody like Brohm could change that by having a lights out Senior Bowl, but that's out of Ryan's hands.

http://www.nfldraftcountdown.com/forum/showthread.php?t=17105&highlight=casserly+ryan

 

[Silverphin]

We never said that Matt Ryan isn't the best QB prospect. He just isn't worth the #1 pick.

 

[NorFlaFin]

Other then Glen Dorsey nobody is really worth the No.1 pick.

 

[adamprez2003]

We never said that Matt Ryan isn't the best QB prospect. He just isn't worth the #1 pick.

Well out of seven front office guys (pros not amatuers) Ryan shares the lead with Chris Long and Mcfadden so obviously he is worth it if you go by professional and not amateur opinions. He is "worth" it as much as C Long and McFadden are and more so than J Long and Dorsey. That at least is documented. Unless that's the legendary "smokescreen" all the front office guys are doing now. Its one thing to say we should go another direction which is a fair response. Its completely ridiculous to say he's not "worth" a number one. Could things change after the combine. Absolutely. One of these guys might vault ahead of everyone else. But as of now, they're all neck and neck and I would imagine that McFadden has dropped after his recent personal problems. As Parcells said he wont be listening to the cottage cheese industry of blog sites. He'll be listening to professionals. And no I wont find the quote for Parcells:shakeno::)

 

[adamprez2003]

Other then Glen Dorsey nobody is really worth the No.1 pick.

Actually that's the best way of putting it and if we're running a 3-4 Dorsey isnt even worth it:up:

 

[Silverphin]

Actually that's the best way of putting it and if we're running a 3-4 Dorsey isnt even worth it:up:

Dorsey is 6'2" 316 as of the Senior Bowl Measure, only four lbs off from ideal NT weight, plus Dorsey has the ability to play multiple positions and techniques on the line, as shown at LSU.

 

[cnc66]

I cant believe Matt Ryan being the consensus best QB in the draft is still debatable. Only on FinHeaven

Here for you and cncc

Here is the Heckert article I mentioned earlier

http://chicagosports.chicagotribune...s-080124dan-pompei-nfl-draft,1,2370977.column

The Tribune asked seven NFL front office executives whom they would pick if they had the first selection. Six of them first said they would trade the pick if they could. But the chances of a trade are minimal — the Dolphins' only possibility would be if they accepted lower than market value for the pick.

"I don't see anybody moving into that spot," Browns general manager Phil Savage said. "Why? It's hard when there are really, really good players up there."

Told they couldn't trade, two front office men said they would take Boston College quarterback Matt Ryan, two would take Virginia defensive end Chris Long and two would take Arkansas running back Darren McFadden. One said he would take Louisiana State defensive tackle Glenn Dorsey.

Another mentioned Michigan offensive tackle Jake Long as a possibility, but conceded he rated Long below Joe Thomas, whom the Browns took with the third pick of the 2007 draft.

The Casserly statement was on CBS so unless you know how to get CBS transcripts the best I can do is indirect references from dtraft blogs

Matt Ryan is the consensus top QB in the opinions of NFL draft scouts. Charlie Casserly contacted all 32 teams and to inquire on where they ranked this years prospects. Casserly said "Ryan is head and shoulders above all the other QB's in the minds of the NFL scouts." Smart move by Ryan to not do anything to change that. Now somebody like Brohm could change that by having a lights out Senior Bowl, but that's out of Ryan's hands.

http://www.nfldraftcountdown.com/forum/showthread.php?t=17105&highlight=casserly+ryan

First, like I said Adam, it's not all that important to me where he ranks among the other qb's, to me, that is irrelevent, but this article does not support your claim. You said;

Originally Posted by adamprez2003
Right and that's why every gm says he's the best QB in the country.

Now I couldn't find that ^^ anywhere, this Chicago Trib article doesn't support your contention.

I did find some stuff "I" believe to be true, and I think this is the heart of "our" disagreement. To me, Ryan is not even close to being the best option for our team, "I" don't think he is any better than Beck. Now John is not the next manning, but I think he will be good qb, same as Ryan and Quinn. It is just not in our best interest to set aside everything for what is likely not an upgrade. It is prudent to draft another qb, but not with the first overall. Here is the part I agreed with

But most teams do not rate Ryan as highly as some previous top quarterback picks such as JaMarcus Russell, Eli Manning and Carson Palmer.

"This year none of the quarterbacks are franchise guys," one team president said. "You can't even argue they might be.

Now, on that second link.. it didn't support you either.. It was talking about scouts, not gm's, and it doesn't even say "all" the word of contention.

I hope Parcells sells everyone and their mother we are going to pick this kid.. MAYBE Atlanta will freak out and get stupid, but our first pick needs to be Howie's kid or Dorsey.

 

[StLouisFinFan]

I cant believe Matt Ryan being the consensus best QB in the draft is still debatable. Only on FinHeaven

Here for you and cncc

Here is the Heckert article I mentioned earlier

http://chicagosports.chicagotribune...s-080124dan-pompei-nfl-draft,1,2370977.column

The Tribune asked seven NFL front office executives whom they would pick if they had the first selection. Six of them first said they would trade the pick if they could. But the chances of a trade are minimal — the Dolphins' only possibility would be if they accepted lower than market value for the pick.

"I don't see anybody moving into that spot," Browns general manager Phil Savage said. "Why? It's hard when there are really, really good players up there."

Told they couldn't trade, two front office men said they would take Boston College quarterback Matt Ryan, two would take Virginia defensive end Chris Long and two would take Arkansas running back Darren McFadden. One said he would take Louisiana State defensive tackle Glenn Dorsey.

Another mentioned Michigan offensive tackle Jake Long as a possibility, but conceded he rated Long below Joe Thomas, whom the Browns took with the third pick of the 2007 draft.

The Casserly statement was on CBS so unless you know how to get CBS transcripts the best I can do is indirect references from dtraft blogs

Matt Ryan is the consensus top QB in the opinions of NFL draft scouts. Charlie Casserly contacted all 32 teams and to inquire on where they ranked this years prospects. Casserly said "Ryan is head and shoulders above all the other QB's in the minds of the NFL scouts." Smart move by Ryan to not do anything to change that. Now somebody like Brohm could change that by having a lights out Senior Bowl, but that's out of Ryan's hands.

http://www.nfldraftcountdown.com/forum/showthread.php?t=17105&highlight=casserly+ryan

I agree, he is probably the best prospect, THIS year. But drafting Ryan at No. 1, or even in the top 15, IMO, is sort of like buying a house that's worth $100K for $200K just because you're itching to get out of your existing house, which really just needs some new paint, a little sanding and some new furniture to accentuate, and the current housing market is in the crapper. Sure, maybe it's the best of what's available now, but that doesn't mean I have to settle on a house I don't really like, and pay double in the process. I'd rather put a little blood, sweat and tears into the one I already have. Now, if I wanted to settle on a long term investment property, then by all means invest in a "fixer-upper" to hedge my investments.

 

[adamprez2003]

First, like I said Adam, it's not all that important to me where he ranks among the other qb's, to me, that is irrelevent, but this article does not support your claim. You said;


Now I couldn't find that ^^ anywhere, this Chicago Trib article doesn't support your contention.

I did find some stuff "I" believe to be true, and I think this is the heart of "our" disagreement. To me, Ryan is not even close to being the best option for our team, "I" don't think he is any better than Beck. Now John is not the next manning, but I think he will be good qb, same as Ryan and Quinn. It is just not in our best interest to set aside everything for what is likely not an upgrade. It is prudent to draft another qb, but not with the first overall. Here is the part I agreed with



Now, on that second link.. it didn't support you either.. It was talking about scouts, not gm's, and it doesn't even say "all" the word of contention.

I hope Parcells sells everyone and their mother we are going to pick this kid.. MAYBE Atlanta will freak out and get stupid, but our first pick needs to be Howie's kid or Dorsey.

See that kind of disagreement I'm perfectly fine with. So long as the arguments are based on Beck becoming good enough and we should be addressing other needs. Its when the arguments digress to Ryan suck or isnt worth a top ten pick or isnt worth a number one that they get silly. There are probably 7 players that areworth a number one and Ryan is certainly in the mix. We all have our preferences but I cant say I would be upset with any of them. I trust our GM and the shadow behind him.

As to the article. Fine 32 scouts. the majority have ryan head and shoulders above all the other QBs. What's a reasonable guess as to what head and shoulders constitutes and what's you're best guess as to the number that view it that way- 25 of 32, 17 of 32, 30 of 32? C'mon CNCC, I know you're just busting my chops but seriously, how many GMs or scouts do you reasonably believe have any QB rated ahead of Ryan. Maybe Matt Millen has Ainge rated ahead of Ryan. I can understand having this debate in October and maybe again after the combine but at this stage its pretty much settled dont you think

Here. I'll make you a deal. Find me one GM who's on record saying that he doesnt think Ryan is the number one QB prospect in the nation

 

[adamprez2003]

I agree, he is probably the best prospect, THIS year. But drafting Ryan at No. 1, or even in the top 15, IMO, is sort of like buying a house that's worth $100K for $200K just because you're itching to get out of your existing house, which really just needs some new paint, a little sanding and some new furniture to accentuate, and the current housing market is in the crapper. Sure, maybe it's the best of what's available now, but that doesn't mean I have to settle on a house I don't really like, and pay double in the process. I'd rather put a little blood, sweat and tears into the one I already have. Now, if I wanted to settle on a long term investment property, then by all means invest in a "fixer-upper" to hedge my investments.

:wink: Great way to put it. Me I'm looking to purchase a summer home