NJFINSFAN1
FinHeaven Elite
I think we need an OLB, nobody we have despite Taylor can bring the pressure, and Taylor seems to have the writing on the wall.
Matt Ryan Pro-day
- Thread starter fishypete
- Start date
I think we need an OLB, nobody we have despite Taylor can bring the pressure, and Taylor seems to have the writing on the wall.
fishypete
FinHeaven Elite
We have Taylor...Porter...Torbor...and crowder...who gets the short end of the stick?
Philter25
MORE COWBELL!!!
Compare his times with other 3-4 SOLBs. Who plays SOLB in Dallas 3-4.... Greg Ellis? What was his 40 time?
We have JT under contract for 1 more year. You dont make a decision on the first pick in the draft based on the fact that you have a guy who plays his position on the roster for 1 more year.
Where there is smoke, there is fire. Why are all the JT trade rumors floating around? If you draft Chris Long, you trade JT. Simple as that.
Nah, too traditional, lets just put all bids in a hat and pick one.
fishypete
FinHeaven Elite
Taylor is under contract till 2009....thats two years right? Do we select a player with the first pick to sit for two years...I thought we changed that way of thinking...perhaps not. When Taylor gets traded...then we can acquire another linebacker...but you don't spend the top pick for a linebacker...there's not one linebacker thats playing today that was taken with the top pick...must be a reason. And finally...if you do the trade the way you stated...what team would give you anything for Taylor...if you trade Taylor...it has to be before the draft...not afterwards.
Added note...
G. Ellis was drafted while the Cowboys still used a 4-3 defense...right?
Finfanforever
Finfanforever
Then who Pete??? I say the Fins are down to Ryan or one of the Lond Bro's. I think it will be Chris Long.
fishypete
FinHeaven Elite
The only way the Dolphins select C. Long is if either Taylor or Porter is traded. Parcells is not going to spend 50-60 mil for a player to sit on the bench or to play part time.
Finfanforever
Finfanforever
Ok...at Taylors age I don't really think that's a factor. I also believe JT's days in a Fins uni are over....I think he get's traded on draft day.
fishypete
FinHeaven Elite
Who? Lets try looking at this with a open mind;
If the Dolphins stay with the top pick...and I believe like most people, they will do just about anything to get out of the first pick, they will select the best player at a need...right now that need is LT. If they trade down to 3, they will lose the chance to get that tackle because the Rams will select J. Long at 2... That leaves..C. Long, Gholston, Dorsey, Ellis and Clady. I'm going to add one player that could be in the mix...Harvey. Depending on where the Dolphins select...those are your obvious players to select from. Now...lets take away from the obvious...Dorsey and Ellis don't fit...so that leaves C. Long, Gholston, Clady and Harvey. I still see the need for a player that plays offense more than defense...so the obvious choice has to be Clady. So unless the Dolphins trade away either Taylor or Porter BEFORE the draft...imho the pick has to be Clady...if the Dolphins move down to the 3rd or even the 5th pick.
Philter25
MORE COWBELL!!!
Taylor is under contract for all of next year, thats what I was referring to. This season started, so we have jt under contract for one MORE year after this year.
The only way Long would sit is if you assume that we keep Taylor for those 2 years, which this team DIDNT have the intention of doing.
Why would we go after Calvin Pace and offer him 20 million guaranteed to play OLB? What about JT and Porter?
That ALONE told everyone that this team doesnt see JT in their long term plans and would have traded him.Greg Ellis was drafted years ago, but he plays SOLB. His 40 time doesnt change based on what position he was drafted to play.
The bottom line is thats how fast the guy is measured to be without pads and he currently plays SOLB in a 3-4. If you want to get caught up in the numbers games, the 40 time isnt the measuring stick for linebackers. You need to look at the other drills, like the 3 cone.While I completely agree that LT is a need, there are other positions that can easily be a need. We obviously think OLB is a need, because we offered Pace 20 million guaranteed not even a month ago. Remember that? If that position wasnt a need and we have Porter and Taylor, why the heck did we offer a guy that contract?
NewPhinPhan
FinHeaven VIP
ESPN just projected that this morning on SportsCenter. And, according to their analysts, Ryan's Pro Day wasn't super spectacular, as some here would like to believe.
Fluttering balls.
"Decent" arm strength
"Good" accuracy.
Those are not the descriptive words I'd use for a #1 pick prospect.
Right after the segment on Ryan, they did on on Chris Long, and they suggested that Long will go to Miami with the first.
Anything can happen.
fishypete
FinHeaven Elite
Taylor is under contract for all of next year, thats what I was referring to. This season started, so we have jt under contract for one MORE year after this year.
The only way Long would sit is if you assume that we keep Taylor for those 2 years, which this team DIDNT have the intention of doing.
Why would we go after Calvin Pace and offer him 20 million guaranteed to play OLB? What about JT and Porter?
Greg Ellis was drafted years ago, but he plays SOLB. His 40 time doesnt change based on what position he was drafted to play.
While I completely agree that LT is a need, there are other positions that can easily be a need. We obviously think OLB is a need, because we offered Pace 20 million guaranteed not even a month ago. Remember that? If that position wasnt a need and we have Porter and Taylor, why the heck did we offer a guy that contract?
First...did the Dolphins really want Pace...think about it...they lost him for 2 thousand dollars difference...do you really think that if Parcells wanted him...he wouldn't have paid that difference? Not every offer is to acquire a player...sometimes it to make the other team...pay more.
Lets remember who the Dolphins screwed on that deal.
The only way the Dolphins will get anything for either Porter or Taylor is if they trade them before the draft...not afterwards...are you going to lose value for no reason?
Whats the cap hit against the Dolphins if they trade Porter...after one season? Unless Parcells already has a deal for Taylor...signed...he's not going to trade him after the draft...that would be insane.
Philter25
MORE COWBELL!!!
That is the craziest thing I ever heard. So you mean we really didnt want Pace, but we offered him 20 million guaranteed anyways? And the reason we did it, was JUST to get the Jets to pay more? Seriously? What would have happened then say the Jets pulled their offer and Pace signed ours? We would have a guy making 20 million guaranteed that we didnt want.
Show me ONE article ANYWHERE from a reputable source where a team offered a player a contract of that magniture, WHO THEY DIDNT WANT, just to get another team to pay more!
And they didnt lose him for 2 thousand dollars difference, they lost him for 2 MILLION. Big difference.
Porter wont be traded due to his guaranteed money and he is younger than JT. The dolphins CAN trade JT after the draft, it will just be for a 2009 draft pick.
fishypete
FinHeaven Elite
What would have happened then say the Jets pulled their offer and Pace signed ours? We would have a guy making 20 million guaranteed that we didnt want.
Show me ONE article ANYWHERE from a reputable source where a team offered a player a contract of that magniture, WHO THEY DIDNT WANT, just to get another team to pay more!
And they didnt lose him for 2 thousand dollars difference, they lost him for 2 MILLION. Big difference.
Porter wont be traded due to his guaranteed money and he is younger than JT. The dolphins CAN trade JT after the draft, it will just be for a 2009 draft pick.
Sorry...my mistake...2 mil.
Kind of refreshing having a real GM doing business...thats the problem...your use to idiots running the funny farm.
Again..IF Parcells really wanted Pace...2 mil wouldn't have stopped him...he surely had the money...and especially if he already knew that he had a trade worked out for JT..he would have had more money...now wouldn't he.
Don't you have common sense...why do I have to show you something thats done every day...thats business.
Why would Parcells trade Taylor AFTER the draft.. Taylor can just say...I'm retiring? Then what does Parcells have? Nothing. A trade has to be done prior...not after...and it has to be done to a team that has a very good chance to win...or else Taylor just retires.
Philter25
MORE COWBELL!!!
We HAD the cap room to sign Pace, but there is a line that you set with a player. Sure, we could have afforded another 2 million, but that doesnt mean we would have signed him. What if Pace went back to the Jets and they upped it to 24 million? Heck, thats another 2 million, we can afford it. Then what if Pace went back to the Jets and they upped it to 26 million? Heck, thats another 2 million, we can afford it. Then what if Pace went back to the Jets and they upped it to 28 million? Heck, thats another 2 million, we can afford it. Then what if Pace went back to the Jets and they upped it to 30 million? Heck, thats another 2 million, we can afford it.
Eventually there is a point where you decide that financially, the player is going to cost too much and you dont want to overpay or get into a bidding war. Did you notice our trend in free agency? We didnt go after the highest price first tiered free agents, even though we can afford them. We went after a bunch of the younger second tiered guy. Pace's contract was reaching the price of the first tier players and we decided it was WAY too much money. That showed we ARE interested in an OLB.
We OBVIOUSLY wanted Pace, or we wouldnt have offered him a contract.
I never thought a guy who wanted to move Zach Thomas to SS would be questioning MY common sense. Seriously Pete, no team offers a guy 20 million guaranteed if they dont want him JUST to get another team to pay 2 million more.
Like I said Pete, if its so common place, find me ONE example of a club offering a guy that magnitude of a contract so another club will outbid them by 2 million.
Umm, why couldnt JT do that BEFORE the draft? The exact argument you made can be made before the draft. You can trade a player anytime during the season before the trading deadline, and a player can retire at anytime, before or after the draft.
It doesnt matter when you trade JT.