o-gun to be on espn news in 5 minutes | Page 11 | FinHeaven - Miami Dolphins Forums

o-gun to be on espn news in 5 minutes

Jimmy James said:
You also see the team not signing him. Why not pound the team for that?
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not true, I have seen a team say they will sign him to a long term deal, just not before the draft.
 
Well, it's after the draft now. That excuse doesn't really hold much water. I think it's just great how so many people here are keen to move that out to 6/2 now that the draft has passed, too.
 
I am so sick of O-gun right now. He is acting like a child and him saying JT had nothing to do with it?!!! Yea that doesnt make me happy much. I want to keep O-gun here, but his attitude is starting to make me think we need to just get rid of him!
 
The number of games that a player has to play to accrue a season is most certainly in the CBA. This is true because accrued seasons are what RFA and UFAs are determined on. Ogun, would have been a UFA this year but because he had to sit out his rookie year, he did not accrue 4 seasons.

He was eligible for the Fins to put a tender offer and they chose to tender him at the highest level ($1.8M and a 1st and 3rd round compensation from a team trying to sign him before April 17th). The team has not done anything wrong here and neither has Ogun. He has the right to negotiate in the press if he so desires. The problem for him is that when he does so, he turns the public against him...most of us work for peanuts compared to the contracts these guys sign, so when I hear a guy complaining about $1.8M, it's hard to feel bad for him. I do, however, understand the system and the reason for him making the money he does and do not begrudge him the ability to negotiate for more. I do not like that he is negotiating in the press.

The FO has chosen its path in this issue as well. They have chosen to keep the tender offer on the table and wait, at this point in time before negotiating with him. There is nothing wrong with this either. Jimmy, you keep preaching the players side of this and not giving equal due to the FO side of this. I have seen several posts about the FO screwing with Ogun or whatever, they are not, apparently. It seems to me they just have not begun the negotiations yet. But they don't have to yet.

They can force his hand in this by following the letter of the CBA and reduce his salary to 105% of what he made last year if he does not sign the tender by the week before training camp. They can negotiate a 1 year deal and let him become a UFA next year. I'm sure there are other things they can do (trades, long-term, etc). But Jimmy keeps saying that Ogun should be paid more because he is worth it (which I do agree, in fact Im on the 'sign him back to a LT deal soon bandwagon') but the FO has the business issues and cap to deal with as well as the well as the individual contracts. You can't begrudge the team for using the options it has available either. We don't know what the team wants to do, because they have not tipped their hand publically yet.

Ogun and his agent know the ramifications of a holdout. They know that it is NOT in their best interests. I still think this is merely bantering rhetoric that they are throwing out trying to get the FO to move. The FO will show its hand when it needs to. There is still the June 1 cuts and,who knows, they may be looking to trade him too ?? I think there is a medium here and we, as fans, need to just calm down and wait to see what happens. The FO has not lied to us. They said they would negotiate on their timeline. Ogun wants to get it done now...besides, Ogun will get his money...either here long term, or with another team long term, or here for a season and then a UFA next year, or if he plays out this season and the Fins transition tag him....any way he gets his money....the only way he does not is if he does not sign the tender offer and then holds out the 10 weeks...he will make about $170k for the 2004 season and then have to try to negotiate with a team next year as a "trouble-maker or whatever you want to call him". The ball is still in the FOs court and they haven't brought it in yet....and neither they nor Ogun has done anything wrong legally.
 
I agree

Chisel Monkey said:
That would be a stupid thing to do, who's to say he doesn't get hurt after almost a year of not playing. Or he sucks the last 6 games cause he hasn't played in almost a year. I say we call his bluff.
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let's see if he's just huffing and puffing. is there compensation if he sits out? how is that handled?
 
LarryFinFan said:
The number of games that a player has to play to accrue a season is most certainly in the CBA. This is true because accrued seasons are what RFA and UFAs are determined on. Ogun, would have been a UFA this year but because he had to sit out his rookie year, he did not accrue 4 seasons.

He was eligible for the Fins to put a tender offer and they chose to tender him at the highest level ($1.8M and a 1st and 3rd round compensation from a team trying to sign him before April 17th). The team has not done anything wrong here and neither has Ogun. He has the right to negotiate in the press if he so desires. The problem for him is that when he does so, he turns the public against him...most of us work for peanuts compared to the contracts these guys sign, so when I hear a guy complaining about $1.8M, it's hard to feel bad for him. I do, however, understand the system and the reason for him making the money he does and do not begrudge him the ability to negotiate for more. I do not like that he is negotiating in the press.

The FO has chosen its path in this issue as well. They have chosen to keep the tender offer on the table and wait, at this point in time before negotiating with him. There is nothing wrong with this either. Jimmy, you keep preaching the players side of this and not giving equal due to the FO side of this. I have seen several posts about the FO screwing with Ogun or whatever, they are not, apparently. It seems to me they just have not begun the negotiations yet. But they don't have to yet.

They can force his hand in this by following the letter of the CBA and reduce his salary to 105% of what he made last year if he does not sign the tender by the week before training camp. They can negotiate a 1 year deal and let him become a UFA next year. I'm sure there are other things they can do (trades, long-term, etc). But Jimmy keeps saying that Ogun should be paid more because he is worth it (which I do agree, in fact Im on the 'sign him back to a LT deal soon bandwagon') but the FO has the business issues and cap to deal with as well as the well as the individual contracts. You can't begrudge the team for using the options it has available either. We don't know what the team wants to do, because they have not tipped their hand publically yet.

Ogun and his agent know the ramifications of a holdout. They know that it is NOT in their best interests. I still think this is merely bantering rhetoric that they are throwing out trying to get the FO to move. The FO will show its hand when it needs to. There is still the June 1 cuts and,who knows, they may be looking to trade him too ?? I think there is a medium here and we, as fans, need to just calm down and wait to see what happens. The FO has not lied to us. They said they would negotiate on their timeline. Ogun wants to get it done now...besides, Ogun will get his money...either here long term, or with another team long term, or here for a season and then a UFA next year, or if he plays out this season and the Fins transition tag him....any way he gets his money....the only way he does not is if he does not sign the tender offer and then holds out the 10 weeks...he will make about $170k for the 2004 season and then have to try to negotiate with a team next year as a "trouble-maker or whatever you want to call him". The ball is still in the FOs court and they haven't brought it in yet....and neither they nor Ogun has done anything wrong legally.
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thanks Larry - i posted before I saw your response.

nj
 
I skipped half the argument because it was monotenous.

Both sides are well within their rights. Nobody is doing anything wrong here.

Wale needs public support/pressure so he goes to the media. We could see that move coming from a million miles away.

Wale ISN'T under contract, BUT he IS taking up salary cap space.

Wale has no case because HIS union agreed to the system in place. If they didn't like it they shouldn't have voted it in.

Wale is not under contract so he has every right to sit out as long as he likes. It may benefit him, or it may harm him, time will tell, but it is HIS call.

This is all media posturing right now, I would be shocked if Wale didn't play 16 games this year, barring injury.

He may hold out, but how often do players hold out and have great seasons? I would like to see that stat and I'm sure Rosenhous knows it off by heart.

NOBODY is in the wrong, BOTH parties are working the system that is in place. Don't get too emotional people, start worrying in Week 1 if Wale isn't here.
 
Larry,

I think perhaps the strength of my arguments for Wale have given you the false impression that I have something against the team's side here. That isn't the case. I bring up the things I do in the hopes that everyone will see that this is just business between the two parties and that they each have their own sets of rights and interests. I just don't emphasize the team's side because it appears people have a pretty good grasp on that part.

I like your message about calming down a lot. I worry that I'm stirring these things up, but it's tough to leave some of this stuff unanswered.
 
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