QB T.J. Yates, North Carolina | Page 2 | FinHeaven - Miami Dolphins Forums

QB T.J. Yates, North Carolina

I really love Yates' commitment to the play-action. He looks loose and natural which is far removed from the Hennebot play-action. It looks like 50-55 yards is about as far as he can throw but that's fine because he's extremely accurate at that range. These are highlights from 2 years ago and he already has great deep ball accuracy and play-action fakes.

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=u_aMQ2R7dYQ
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=fS6L070REw0
 
If you watch college football at all you should know Yates has as good shot at working in the nfl for years and years as any QB coming out this or any year.

He has a natural feel for the game you don't see much.
 
justdev7 said:
I really love Yates' commitment to the play-action. He looks loose and natural which is far removed from the Hennebot play-action. It looks like 50-55 yards is about as far as he can throw but that's fine because he's extremely accurate at that range. These are highlights from 2 years ago and he already has great deep ball accuracy and play-action fakes.

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=u_aMQ2R7dYQ
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=fS6L070REw0
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Two years ago he had Hakeem Nicks, Brandon Tate (for part of the year) and Brooks Foster...three very good receivers. His numbers dropped off significantly in 2009 (bit of a red flag there) when he didn't have as much talent around him. He picked it up a bit this year though and that was after a lot of the talent he should have had around him was suspended. In his junior campaign he was a turnover machine. Not only did he throw 15 INTs (to go with only 14 TDs) but he fumbled the ball a lot. I watched him a lot (they're always on here since I live in North Carolina) in his Soph. and Junior season, didn't watch him as much this year.

I'm actually going to start evaluating him today starting with the LSU game which was one of his better games this year against a very solid defense.
 
caneaddict said:
CK-

You mentioned a quote from a scout in another thread that went something like "if i don't like a guy as a 3rd rounder then why would i like him in the 5th" The reason I bring that up is it seems we have to keep our ultimate goal in mind when looking at QB's. I don't think you go out and spend a draft pick to bring in a guy that you'll immediately be looking for his replacement. That's generally what happens with all non-elite QB's QB is a binary position - either a guy is a franchise type QB or he's not, if he's not than you are looking for his replacement. With that in mind this draft probably won't yield more than 1 or 2 guys who will end up starting 80 games for 1 NFL team. It's always strange to me to hear guys give QB's 2nd and 3rd round grades. To me either you think this guy can be our franchise QB or you don't.

With other positions there's a long spectrum of potential productivity but with QB it really seems like a binary yes/no. I'm sure the 4th or 5th best LB in this draft (as viewed by production several years later) will provide actual value to the team he's on. I'm sure the 6th best DB in this draft will provide production and will be a decent nickel or dime type player. The 3rd best QB in this draft will probably spend the majority of his career watching the game either from the sideline or a couch. So when analyzing QB's don't you eventually have to just take it down to the 2 or 3 guys you think will have the highest likelihood of being a franchise QB? That's not to say you expect that everyone can come in right away. Maybe the list includes the #1 overall pick, another early 1st rounder and then one other guy that you think will take a few years to develop (and therefore he's a 2nd or 3rd rounder) but you have strong conviction that he WILL develop into a franchise guy. To me, the rest of the players would simply be off the board.
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I guess I agree somewhat with this but it's really not as simple as just who is in and who is out. There are percentages that HAVE to be accounted for. Joe Flacco, for instance. He had all the physical tools and the accuracy, but he only faced FCS opponents...and no matter what his physical tools are you just don't know if he'll crumble when he makes that HUGE leap to the next level of talent with faster, bigger, stronger bodies flying around him and hitting him, and faster, smarter DBs out there trying to bait him into bad throws. And so, you just can't give the guy as high a grade as Matt Ryan.

The Draft is not an exact science. There are factors in a player's game that can and can't be overcome. Two guys can have the same problem and one guy overcomes it, the other guy doesn't. There are odds at play and that's why you have tiers as to whether you like the guy as a #1 overall or a top 5 or top 10 pick, you like him as a 1st rounder, you like him as a 2nd rounder or you like him as a 3rd rounder.

But I do agree with you that if your need is at QB, you don't try and satisfy that need by taking a 4th to 7th round guy. Those areas are reserved for the teams that have QBs and are trying to pick up a guy they think might be worth developing so that they can polish him up and he either be a career backup for them or he gets the opportunity to play, looks good, and you package him off for draft compensation (Hasselback, Feeley, etc).
 
ckparrothead said:
Quarter by Quarter Passing Results:
1st: 129.5 QB Rating - 83 of 100, 1128 yards, 6 TDs, 1 INT, 13 runs, 52 yards, 0 TDs, 5 sacks, -38 yards
2nd: 88.6 QB Rating - 62 of 105, 719 yards, 4 TDs, 1 INT, 10 runs, 45 yards, 2 TDs, 8 sacks, -69 yards
3rd: 84.7 QB Rating - 55 of 88, 624 yards, 4 TDs, 3 INTs, 9 runs, 49 yards, 0 TDs, 11 sacks, -57 yards
4th: 93.6 QB Rating - 64 of 94, 765 yards, 4 TDs, 3 INTs, 10 runs, 40 yards, 0 TDs, 10 sacks, -77 yards
Total: 100.1 QB Rating - 264 of 387, 3181 yards, 18 TDs, 8 INTs, 42 runs, 186 yards, 2 TDs, 34 sacks, -241 yards

.
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CK

Great info, thanks. One question however, what are your thoughts on his sack per attempt 'Issue' from the first half to the second half, especially the 4th quater.

4th - 10 sacks in 94 attempts, versus
1st - 5 sacks in 100 attempts.

Just a coincidence or something to consider further? I dont know the numbers for Henne, but my perception is that when its on the line, he takes sacks or makes mistakes, i.e. interceptions. Is there something in the numbers for Yates, or am I just reading into it too much?
 
Pat-London said:
CK

Great info, thanks. One question however, what are your thoughts on his sack per attempt 'Issue' from the first half to the second half, especially the 4th quater.

4th - 10 sacks in 94 attempts, versus
1st - 5 sacks in 100 attempts.

Just a coincidence or something to consider further? I dont know the numbers for Henne, but my perception is that when its on the line, he takes sacks or makes mistakes, i.e. interceptions. Is there something in the numbers for Yates, or am I just reading into it too much?
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Not a coincidence. I think it's a figure that's naturally going to go up in the second half and in the fourth quarter, unless you're on one of those powerhouse teams that dominates everyone. In the second half you're playing catch-up, you're trying to execute comebacks, you're more likely to be executing pass plays that the defense sees coming and so the defensive linemen know to pin their ears back and rush the QB...and he has a pretty shaky line. His tendency to go turtle under pressure is already a concern, though it did get visibly better from 2009 to 2010 so he's continuing to work on it.

Remember that one of the things you have to like about the kid is that he's giving every sign that 6 years from now there will be aspects of his game that are visibly better than they were 5 years from now, that 7 years from now there will be aspects of his game that are visibly better than 6 years from now, etc. Some guys have a short aptitude for getting better, they'll reach a point where they're going to be about as good as they're going to be. To me, Yates has a long road ahead of him and he'll keep finding new ways to get better. His handling of pressure is one of those ways he can and already has gotten better...and actually to be honest I was kind of impressed once I put together all of the data, to find that in instances where he was either sacked or he ran the ball, he lost only an average of -0.7 yards per play. If you track that amongst today's QBs, that's a good number. There are some guys that once they make the decision to scramble or they get sacked, they're losing 8 or 9 yards each time that happens.
 
ckparrothead said:
Not a coincidence. I think it's a figure that's naturally going to go up in the second half and in the fourth quarter, unless you're on one of those powerhouse teams that dominates everyone. In the second half you're playing catch-up, you're trying to execute comebacks, you're more likely to be executing pass plays that the defense sees coming and so the defensive linemen know to pin their ears back and rush the QB...and he has a pretty shaky line. His tendency to go turtle under pressure is already a concern, though it did get visibly better from 2009 to 2010 so he's continuing to work on it.

Remember that one of the things you have to like about the kid is that he's giving every sign that 6 years from now there will be aspects of his game that are visibly better than they were 5 years from now, that 7 years from now there will be aspects of his game that are visibly better than 6 years from now, etc. Some guys have a short aptitude for getting better, they'll reach a point where they're going to be about as good as they're going to be. To me, Yates has a long road ahead of him and he'll keep finding new ways to get better. His handling of pressure is one of those ways he can and already has gotten better...and actually to be honest I was kind of impressed once I put together all of the data, to find that in instances where he was either sacked or he ran the ball, he lost only an average of -0.7 yards per play. If you track that amongst today's QBs, that's a good number. There are some guys that once they make the decision to scramble or they get sacked, they're losing 8 or 9 yards each time that happens.
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I would add that Yates' OC, John Shoop, is not good at all with half time adjustments. What he runs in the first half is what he runs in the second half. He often gets out coached and he's not a good strategist. That part of the issue with more sacks and lower production especially in the 3rd quarter.
 
datruth55 said:
I would add that Yates' OC, John Shoop, is not good at all with half time adjustments. What he runs in the first half is what he runs in the second half. He often gets out coached and he's not a good strategist. That part of the issue with more sacks and lower production especially in the 3rd quarter.
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And that contrasts with Blaine Gabbert's coaches who are good half time adjusters, and Blaine himself starts seeing things a little better after halftime, to where his highest QB rating is in the 3rd quarter. But it emphasizes how much Yates really comes to bring it in the 4th quarter, that even though the defenses have caught onto what Shoop is doing after the 1st quarter, he's able to elevate his play in the 4th quarter when it matters most.
 
justdev7 said:
I really love Yates' commitment to the play-action. He looks loose and natural which is far removed from the Hennebot play-action. It looks like 50-55 yards is about as far as he can throw but that's fine because he's extremely accurate at that range. These are highlights from 2 years ago and he already has great deep ball accuracy and play-action fakes.
Click to expand...

Henne hates PA, it makes him have to reset his stare
 
Yates had one good season in college. He could be decent QB in the nfl but do any of you really think he could ever win a championship? His junior year was HORRIBLE, north carolinas offense that year looked like ours this year, and he had some playmakers to work with.

Essentially he had a nice senior season, and based off that were going to draft him with a 2nd or 2rd?
 
I would absolutely think that way as well, if I didn't watch him play and scrutinize him so thoroughly. But this is about personal performance, this isn't about the offense's overall production or statistics. His performance on a play by play basis has been superb. He shows a mastery of the offense and the game. He reads defenses. He understands how to hurt teams.

You can call him a one year wonder but in reality he's played this way through the years and shown many of the things he's showing now, the big difference is that because he's limited his tendency toward risky throws, those positives are allowed to shine without negatives that outweigh.

---------- Post added at 06:54 PM ---------- Previous post was at 06:54 PM ----------

Incidentally, Carson Palmer was also a "one year wonder" at USC.
 
jbyrd850 said:
Yates could be decent QB in the nfl but do any of you really think he could ever win a championship? ?
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Who knows? Stranger things have happened. Yates however is not the type of QB I am looking forward to watching at Dolphins.
 
He's playing very much like himself. Excellent decision-making and execution of the offense. Generally accurate throws.
 
He doesn't look very sharp tonight. He has made several bad throws. He doesn't seem to have any mobility, almost like he's a little gimpy.
 
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