Reggie Bush and the Ahmad Bradshaw effect.

Discussion in 'Miami Dolphins Forum' started by MRojas4, Feb 6, 2013.

  1. MRojas4

    MRojas4 The Cheese Connoisseur Finheaven VIP

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    Looks more and more like the RB FA market will be flooded this off season with some decent names. Should help in leverage with getting Reggie a team friendly contract.

    Bradshaw released by the Giants. Rumors Turner will also be released by the Falcons.
     
  2. kitt23

    kitt23 Starter

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    i was thinking the same
     
  3. TealAttack13

    TealAttack13 A True Fan

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    It could help unless these guys get insane contract offers. Given, it's deep in Fa, but most teams would love to get these types to establish the running game. The first signing will determine how the rest of the market goes. Trust me, I think this is going to be a slow process. Once more and more dominoes start to fall, these guys are going to start bidding wars. As far as supply goes, yes, its deep and the rational is that they will be cheaper, but I'm not sold on that totally. If Reggie is one of the last guys on the market, you're going to see the price driven up by the other teams that missed out.
     
  4. MRojas4

    MRojas4 The Cheese Connoisseur Finheaven VIP

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    I agree to an extent, but keep in mind that Reggie, Bradshaw and Turner are nearing the RB "death" age. Also, more and more teams are realizing that in todays NFL you dont need a super star or even elite RB to reach the Super Bowl.

    Throw in that we now have a massive showing of late round to UDFA RB's shining in the NFL it all adds up to high price RB's not being worth it.

    I'm sure Reggie, Bradshaw and other known name RB's will get work, just not at the price we are used to seeing.

    In addition I'm shocked, I mean SHOCKED, the Titans will keep CJ2K at his $10 mill price.
     
  5. So Be

    So Be A True Fan

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    "You Ain't Seen Nothing Yet" as to what the FA market will become. It will happen, and Ireland has us in great position to really do something.
     
  6. So Be

    So Be A True Fan

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    Yeah, Rice and Gore were both afterthoughts to the SB teams getting there. C'mon Man.
     
  7. MRojas4

    MRojas4 The Cheese Connoisseur Finheaven VIP

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    Obviously they helped out the team. But neither Gore or Rice are elite RB's.

    Gore 10th and Rice 11th in rushing this season.

    Alfred Morris 2nd, Doug Martin 5th, Stevan Ridley 7th.....
     
  8. Wildbill3

    Wildbill3 Misery Loves Company Administrator Finheaven VIP Donator

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    I would agree. You do not want a massive amount of money tied up in the running backs.
     
  9. hoops

    hoops exited stage left

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    more like let reggie bush walk and sign a vet that runs downhill...
     
  10. Nublar7

    Nublar7 Retired Finheaven VIP

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    I am starting to accept the truth that Reggie Bush has likely played his last down for the Dolphins. Ireland pulled off one of the better trades in franchise history by swapping 6th round picks in 2012 for him. He put together two very good seasons but the writing is on the wall that things are going to transitioned to Lamar Miller. Unless you can get Bush back for a reasonable contract you kind of have to let him walk. Running backs in their late 20s start to decline and you don't want to tie a lot of money to an aging running back. Declines for running backs happen fast, take Ronnie Brown for example. Do you pay a 28 year old Bush $5 million a year or roll with a 22 year old similar type back for $480,000?
     
  11. uk_dolfan

    uk_dolfan Founder of the FH Adam Gase fan club Moderator Finheaven VIP Donator

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    Bush was never going to be massively expensive, running backs never get paid anymore. I want Bush to stay, but im ok with DT, Miller and Thigpen if he wont take a team friendly deal.

    Im a really big fan of Thigpen, he has a future outside the return game.
     
  12. TealAttack13

    TealAttack13 A True Fan

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    Well, the Titans don't have too much more as far as franchise players are concerned. He's beyond overpaid, but he's one of the few worth watching. For the fans sake, I guess you keep me around. Excitement, jersey sales, etc.
     
  13. Bingit

    Bingit Well-Known Member

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    Yep! It would be nice to have Bush come back at the right price but I seriously doubt it will happen. Miller showed enough last season to be more comfortable in not giving Bush what he will be offered from other teams. With all the other needs we have the best move is to roll with Miller and put that 4.5 million towards another need like WR / TE or tackle when long walks.
     
  14. Casas9425

    Casas9425 A True Fan

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    One of the best trades in franchise history? Jesus Christ.
     
  15. JAMAICA

    JAMAICA Banned Hammered

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    Gore and Rice aren't elite running backs because of where they finished in rushing yards in a single season? What an idiot statement with idiotic reasoning.
     
  16. So Be

    So Be A True Fan

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    Define elite?
     
  17. So Be

    So Be A True Fan

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    Don't know mon, elite has different meaning to different Phinatics. IMO, no reason to call anyone an idiot. Who do you consider elite? A very fair question.
     
  18. Travis34

    Travis34 chea Finheaven VIP Donator

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    :sidelol:

    None of those guys are better than Ray Rice. Maybe on the level of Gore at this point of his career.

    I'd wager Ray Rice is elite as well.
     
  19. miamiron

    miamiron A True Fan

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    You do realize there is more to a running back than yards rushing
     
  20. Travis34

    Travis34 chea Finheaven VIP Donator

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    I think 'elite' is probably thrown around too much these days. Very few should be worthy of that status. Ladainian Tomlinson was, I believe Ricky was.

    Adrian Peterson IS. Could up end up the best of all time if people are ready to move on from Walter/Barry one day.

    But who else right now could make the claim of elite? Surely not two rookies or Stevan Ridley lol. Doug Martin has a lot of potential though

    Names I'd throw out there I guess... Arian Foster, MJD, Rice, Jamaal Charles, SJax, Marshawn Lynch. But I don't know if any of them belong in the elite tier with Peterson. Surely all upper-echelon though
     
  21. dcnr226

    dcnr226 A True Fan Donator

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    Feel free to name a better one.
     
  22. MRojas4

    MRojas4 The Cheese Connoisseur Finheaven VIP

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    I understand there is more to a RB than yards. Hence why neither Gore or Rice finished top 10 in TD's either. Who would I consider elite? I would honestly say AP is the only RB in the game right now I consider elite.
     
  23. Nublar7

    Nublar7 Retired Finheaven VIP

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    One of the "better" trades, and there is no denying that the Dolphins got a great deal with the Bush trade. All they had to do was swap 6th round picks and they got a two year production of 2,660 total yards and 15 total touchdowns. I would say that was absolutely a home run of a trade and one of the "better" trades in franchise history. So get out of here with your condescending "Jesus Christ" response.
     
  24. dcnr226

    dcnr226 A True Fan Donator

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    If i had to go into ONE GAME i had to win with only ONE RUNNING BACK, im riding with Frank Gore. Nobody stops the guy, he always gets his yardage. Instinctive, tough, doesn't fumble. The most natural running back i've ever seen. You can have the Chris Johnsons and Adrian Petersons all you want...give me Frank Gore.
     
  25. MRojas4

    MRojas4 The Cheese Connoisseur Finheaven VIP

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    So how else to measure? By TD's? Morris, Martin, Ridley all finished with mode TD's than Rice or Gore... Neither even finished top 10 in TD's. No one is saying Gore and Rice are not good they are just amongst the cluster of "good" RBs in the league.
     
  26. So Be

    So Be A True Fan

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    Funny, I enjoy listening to Mike & Mike at 6-7 in the morning. They had the same debate on QB's, and what is elite. FWIW, they came up with a QB who you can count on to win a big game when he needs to. I liked that description.
     
  27. Awsi Dooger

    Awsi Dooger A True Fan

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    It goes with the territory these days. That's the happy 40% adjustment crowd.

    I really wish certain plays were bettable. Put a so-called downhill running back in the same exact spot as Reggie. Same blocking. Same everything. Then let's wager on what the difference would be, between what Reggie ended up with and what the downhill guy ends up with. Do you realize how clueless the 40% adjustment crowd would be? The biggest problem would be not to laugh. Their numbers would be so far off base they might as well be out in the cornfield. They are offended by the stutter steps so that justifies in their mind that they should hand out 3-5 extra yards every time, minus the stutter. And they'll continue along the happy 40% adjustment lines every time unless you call them on it. Heck, even if you do call them on it. It's typical simplistic analysis.

    It reminds me of true crime sites I used to post on. I finally had to give it up when the grasp of basic probability was so inept it cluttered every board and threw the focus off base. The D. B. Cooper case was a prime example. One poster after another was insisting he died during the jump. I asked what they thought the success rate would be, of a parachute landing under those conditions? The responses were priceless. I was receiving numbers like 25% or 30%. And they were serious. It told me I needed to get out of there. It was a lost cause.
     
  28. Dolphanboy101

    Dolphanboy101 Active Member

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    Hey diddle diddle Ray Rice up the middle is all I got to say
     
  29. Casas9425

    Casas9425 A True Fan

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    Ricky Williams. I know he flamed out but he was one of the best players in the entire league in 2002 when we traded for him. He carried the entire offense. Reggie Bush is a guy that was benched at times last season and washed out of the team after 2 seasons. It was an ok trade because you gave up a sixth round pick for a guy that the Saints were going to cut and he played very well for stretches here and there.
     
  30. Nublar7

    Nublar7 Retired Finheaven VIP

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    Ricky Wlliams was the better player(pre-2004 retirement) but in terms of compensation given up for and production I think it is arguable which was a better trade. Bush didn't get traded for a 6th round pick, it was a SWAP of 6th round picks so the value of the trade is very high based on production. Ricky had one historic season, two very good seasons and four seasons as a role player/backup. He was also out of the league for almost three full seasons during his time in Miami. Ricky produced more than Reggie ever did but he also came to Miami for four draft picks including two 1st round picks.

    The Bush trade was one of the "better" trades because of the relation of compensation given up for return production. I don't think you find anyone who thinks Bush was a better player than Williams, but in terms of compensation given up it is debatable.
     
  31. Adam Strange

    Adam Strange Question Authority Finheaven VIP

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    No way. The Williams trade belongs on the worst ever Dolphins trades list. Compared to what we had to give up for Williams, we got Bush for a bag of footballs and a Coke. Only thing both trades have in common is that neither one got the team any closer to the playoffs, much less a championship.
     
  32. Twitches Brew

    Twitches Brew A True Fan

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    Ray Rice is elite. Total yards from scrimmage during his 4 years as a starter:

    2009: 2,041
    2010: 1,776
    2011: 2,068
    2012: 1,621

    The guy plays every down, is a key target on 3rd down, they made the playoffs every year (not just because of him, obviously, but it's worth noting), and he has never missed a game. Versatility and reliability are huge in the NFL nowadays (as are 2,000 yard seasons).
     
  33. dcnr226

    dcnr226 A True Fan Donator

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    I'd say more than debatable. We gave up a lot for a player that we made the focal point of our franchise and he left us stranded. I don't think we were on the verge of Super Bowls but in his prime..he abandoned us. Those first picks ostensibly could still be suiting up for us..
     
  34. chriscarter

    chriscarter Scout Team

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    Ray Rice IS elite. He's basically what we've been looking for in Ronnie/Ricky, Reggie/Daniel, yet the Ravens found it all in one back. And they complimented him with a back that can also run the ball (Pierce). Until we find that back that can run/catch/block, we need to keep Miller, Thomas AND Reggie, because none can do all three things and be great at those things.
     
  35. hoops

    hoops exited stage left

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    ray rice is definitely elite...and i'm pretty sure that if reggie bush was viewed as the perfect match for this offense and this scheme miami wouldn't be balking at paying him $5 mil per year on a contract extension...which seems to be the # thrown around about him...that's not deal breaker money by any means...i get that he makes something out of nothing a lot...i get it...i also get that he takes 2 yard losses or tries to bounce things wide plenty instead of pressing the hole and gaining what he can...and yeah he will throw in a 20 or even 40 plus yarder in there about once a game but from a consistency stand point it's just not there...i'd rather go with someone more consistent and one cut north and south in this o and blocking scheme...
     
  36. Valandui

    Valandui Lumberjack Batman Donator

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    The one with the Colts for Don Shula.
     
  37. GCD960

    GCD960 A True Fan

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    Rice is elite - top 3 RB in the legue
     
  38. Valandui

    Valandui Lumberjack Batman Donator

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    As for Alfred Morris, no Mike Shanahan RB (with the possible exception of Terrel Davis) should ever be considered elite. I could run for 1000 yards in his scheme.
     
  39. Valandui

    Valandui Lumberjack Batman Donator

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    Thomas needs to be replaced period.
     
  40. BigScuingili

    BigScuingili Starter

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    Both rbs are elite.
     

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