Rex Ryan Looks Depleted...

[nyjunc]

I claim 2 Super Bowl wins and 2 Super Bowl MVPs make Eli Manning elite. I didn't claim anything other than that.



No. Plunkett's stats were far worse than Manning's are. Manning still can play another 8-10 years. I'm sure his stats will dwarf Plunkett's when all is said and done.

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He's good in the Super Bowl but not so much in the regular season to you and this is what makes him not elite? That he's better in the Super Bowl than the regular season? Can you get any more incorrect?

So b/c a ball stuck to a helmet Eli is elite?

Plunkett played in a completely different era, you cannot compare their #s.

Plunkett was 9-2 in postseason, Eli 8-3

yeah, 16 games tell me more than 1 game. It's not like he put up 40 pts in those Sbs either, he led his O to 17 and 19 pts. he needs to do all season not just in one game.

If Brandon Jacobs, Ahmad Bradshaw, or anyone on the Giants roster who was not Eli Manning proceeded to win two Super Bowl MVPs while a member of the Giants, how can they possibly not be elite?

The fact that you don't pay attention to full sentences makes you an unreasonable person to discuss information with.

he didn't deserve either and that's ONE game in 2 different seasons, you need to play at that level consistently. he has not done that.

All you can point to are the SB MVPs, you have yet to show me any other reasons. That alone should tell you he's not elite.

 

[DuderinoN703]

So b/c a ball stuck to a helmet Eli is elite?

Plunkett played in a completely different era, you cannot compare their #s. Plunkett was 9-2 in postseason, Eli 8-3. yeah, 16 games tell me more than 1 game. It's not like he put up 40 pts in those Sbs either, he led his O to 17 and 19 pts. he needs to do all season not just in one game.

Enough about Plunkett. A QB in the 80s is your argument? Classy

he didn't deserve either and that's ONE game in 2 different seasons, you need to play at that level consistently. he has not done that.

Coincidentally that ONE game is the game your elite Jets haven't been playing in over these last 3 elite years and 40+ overall

All you can point to are the SB MVPs, you have yet to show me any other reasons. That alone should tell you he's not elite.

There don't need to be any other reasons. You think his MVPs are rigged bull****. There's nothing else to be said about it.

 

[nyjunc]

Enough about Plunkett. A QB in the 80s is your argument? Classy





Coincidentally that ONE game is the game your elite Jets haven't been playing in over these last 3 elite years and 40+ overall



There don't need to be any other reasons. You think his MVPs are rigged bull****. There's nothing else to be said about it.

why enough about Plunkett? b/c it pokes holes in your theory? he's very similar to Eli but was never elite just like eli isn't. if this was 1984 you'd be telling me he's elite.


He had a ball stick to a helmet and had his D slow down great offenses so he only had to score 17 & 19 pts. Good for him.


If all he has are the SB MVps then he's clearly not elite. Steps up in big games like a Robert Horry hitting a big shot but not elite.

 

[Kinzua]

we'd have to adjust the other points. The jets played better teams in their title game runs than NE did in their SB run- that has to factor into it to.

No matter what way you slice it the jets have been an elite team the last 3 years.

The Jests did NOT even make the playoffs every year of the last three years.
The Jests did NOT win their division even once in the last three years.
The Jests did NOT even get to the Super Bowl once in the last three years.

They are NOT elite. A team cannot be elite if they can't even get to the big show. DOH!

 

[nyjunc]

The Jests did NOT even make the playoffs every year of the last three years.
The Jests did NOT win their division even once in the last three years.
The Jests did NOT even get to the Super Bowl once in the last three years.

They are NOT elite. A team cannot be elite if they can't even get to the big show. DOH!

they won the MOST playoff games! they were the ONLY team int he league to reach 2 conf title games

teams an be elite if they don't make the SB, elite teams are the best in the game. The elite teams over the past 3 years are(in no particular order):

NO
NYJ
NE
Bal
Pit
NYG
GB

 

[JETSJETSJETS]

Eli discussions remind of LTs statement the other day when asked if he preferred HoF bust or a SB ring. Obviously, you want a SB ring, but if you had the option to pick EITHER one, most would pick HoF bust IMO. David Carr has a SB ring, but he doesn't have Millions of dollars, and doesn't have the reputation LT had. In fact, Carr will always be remembered as a bust, yet he has a SB ring. Sure he didn't start, but SB rings are overrated when discussing a players talent. However, having a SB ring AND a league MVP award changes all that.

Point is, you don't have to be elite to have two SB rings (Eli). You don't have to have SB rings to be considered elite (Marino).

 

[DuderinoN703]

why enough about Plunkett? b/c it pokes holes in your theory? he's very similar to Eli but was never elite just like eli isn't. if this was 1984 you'd be telling me he's elite.

You can only wish it pokes holes in my theory.

Eli Manning already has more TDs in 8 seasons than Plunkett had in his 15 year career. Manning already has more passes completed, more passes attempted, more passing yards, a better completion %, and a better "rating".

The two are nothing alike aside from having 2 Super Bowl rings each 30 years apart. More than your and I's franchises put together.

---------- Post added at 02:46 PM ---------- Previous post was at 02:45 PM ----------

they won the MOST playoff games! they were the ONLY team int he league to reach 2 conf title games

teams an be elite if they don't make the SB, elite teams are the best in the game. The elite teams over the past 3 years are(in no particular order):

NO
NYJ
NE
Bal
Pit
NYG
GB

And yet again, what is the one team in your list that hasn't been to the Super Bowl in the last 40 years?

---------- Post added at 02:47 PM ---------- Previous post was at 02:46 PM ----------

Eli discussions remind of LTs statement the other day when asked if he preferred HoF bust or a SB ring. Obviously, you want a SB ring, but if you had the option to pick EITHER one, most would pick HoF bust IMO. David Carr has a SB ring, but he doesn't have Millions of dollars, and doesn't have the reputation LT had. In fact, Carr will always be remembered as a bust, yet he has a SB ring. Sure he didn't start, but SB rings are overrated when discussing a players talent. However, having a SB ring AND a league MVP award changes all that.

Point is, you don't have to be elite to have two SB rings (Eli). You don't have to have SB rings to be considered elite (Marino).

Marino was elite b/c he owned almost all passing records during and after his career. Not every QB can say they did that. David Carr doesn't even need to be mentioned here b/c it isn't worth our time.

 

[nyjunc]

You can only wish it pokes holes in my theory.

Eli Manning already has more TDs in 8 seasons than Plunkett had in his 15 year career. Manning already has more passes completed, more passes attempted, more passing yards, a better completion %, and a better "rating".

The two are nothing alike aside from having 2 Super Bowl rings each 30 years apart. More than your and I's franchises put together.

---------- Post added at 02:46 PM ---------- Previous post was at 02:45 PM ----------



And yet again, what is the one team in your list that hasn't been to the Super Bowl in the last 40 years?

---------- Post added at 02:47 PM ---------- Previous post was at 02:46 PM ----------



Marino was elite b/c he owned almost all passing records during and after his career. Not every QB can say they did that. David Carr doesn't even need to be mentioned here b/c it isn't worth our time.

The fact that you are comparing individual #s from a QB from the 70s and early 80s to a QB of today tells me all I need to know.

what does the last 40 years have to do w/ the last 3 years?

 

[Bingit]

Eli discussions remind of LTs statement the other day when asked if he preferred HoF bust or a SB ring. Obviously, you want a SB ring, but if you had the option to pick EITHER one, most would pick HoF bust IMO. David Carr has a SB ring, but he doesn't have Millions of dollars, and doesn't have the reputation LT had. In fact, Carr will always be remembered as a bust, yet he has a SB ring. Sure he didn't start, but SB rings are overrated when discussing a players talent. However, having a SB ring AND a league MVP award changes all that.

Point is, you don't have to be elite to have two SB rings (Eli). You don't have to have SB rings to be considered elite (Marino).

Having a SB ring as a backup when you had nothing to do with it is meaningless. When you are the guy who led TWO 4th quarter, game winning drives in SBS it means a lot. I'll take 2 SB MVPs over a league MVP any day of the week.

 

[nyjunc]

Having a SB ring as a backup when you had nothing to do with it is meaningless. When you are the guy who led TWO 4th quarter, game winning drives in SBS it means a lot. I'll take 2 SB MVPs over a league MVP any day of the week.

any player can win a SB MVP award by playing one great game but you need excellence over the course of a full season to win a league MVP award.

 

[DuderinoN703]

The fact that you are comparing individual #s from a QB from the 70s and early 80s to a QB of today tells me all I need to know.

Are you ****ing kidding me? You're the one who brought Plunkett up in the first place and now it isn't fair to compare them to each other especially after you say:

why enough about Plunkett? b/c it pokes holes in your theory? he's very similar to Eli but was never elite just like eli isn't

Are you this blindly biased?

---------- Post added at 03:59 PM ---------- Previous post was at 03:58 PM ----------

any player can win a SB MVP award by playing one great game but you need excellence over the course of a full season to win a league MVP award.

Explains why no one in the Jets organization has done so in our lifetime. You know, it being so easy and casual to accomplish and all.

 

[nyjunc]

Are you ****ing kidding me? You're the one who brought Plunkett up in the first place and now it isn't fair to compare them to each other especially after you say:



Are you this blindly biased?

---------- Post added at 03:59 PM ---------- Previous post was at 03:58 PM ----------



Explains why no one in the Jets organization has done so in our lifetime. You know, it being so easy and casual to accomplish and all.

It's not fair to compare stats, 2 totally different eras. Both are similar QBs, #1 overall picks, struggled early, helped teams win 2 Sbs in short amount of time, won SB MVPs, neither made an all pro team.

It's easier to win a SB MVP, again one great game can get you that award but you need greatness throughout 16 to win a league MVP.

Doug Williams(and if he didn't win it Timmy Smith would have won that one), Larry Brown, Desmond Howard, Dexter jackson, Deion Branch, Eli Manning. None of these players were/are great players, they happened to have great games or make big plays in the SB. The award does skew towards QBs which is why Doug and Eli won their SB MVP awards but Eli is as elite as those other players were- elite for a day.

 

[The New Guy]

Justic Tuck was, he and the D were the main reasons they won. Eli was very fortunate in the first one w/ Samuel dropping the easy pick then having a ball stick to a helmet. Eli was much better this past SB but again he still doesn't have an elite full season under his belt. When he starts doing that consistently I'll consider him elite.

I'm not going to get into the "Eli is or isn't elite" discussion, but I have a problem with the highlighted statement. I remember us talking about Brady in his first SB win and debating who played the biggest role in the win. I told you that I thought that the D was the main reason for the win. They held the Rams to just 17 points (The D also scored a TD) making it to where the Pats O just needed to score 11 points to win the game. You claimed that the D collapsed in the 4th quarter and allowed 14 points which allowed the Rams to tie the game. We all know Brady led Ne into FG range and NE won the game. You claimed that Brady was the main reason for that win.

So, how can the Giants D be the main reason for the win when they held their opponent to 17 points (no defensive scores) and needed Eli to lead the game winning drive, but Brady is the main reason for the win when NEs D held their opponent to 17 points (scored a TD on D) and Brady did less to put them in FG range than Eli did when the Giants scored a TD. :idk:

 

[Bingit]

any player can win a SB MVP award by playing one great game but you need excellence over the course of a full season to win a league MVP award.

It wasn't just 1 game. Eli has TWO SB MVPs. He led the Giants on TWO game winning drives in the 4th quarter to win SBs. Enough Said!

 

[nyjunc]

I'm not going to get into the "Eli is or isn't elite" discussion, but I have a problem with the highlighted statement. I remember us talking about Brady in his first SB win and debating who played the biggest role in the win. I told you that I thought that the D was the main reason for the win. They held the Rams to just 17 points (The D also scored a TD) making it to where the Pats O just needed to score 11 points to win the game. You claimed that the D collapsed in the 4th quarter and allowed 14 points which allowed the Rams to tie the game. We all know Brady led Ne into FG range and NE won the game. You claimed that Brady was the main reason for that win.

So, how can the Giants D be the main reason for the win when they held their opponent to 17 points (no defensive scores) and needed Eli to lead the game winning drive, but Brady is the main reason for the win when NEs D held their opponent to 17 points (scored a TD on D) and Brady did less to put them in FG range than Eli did when the Giants scored a TD. :idk:

The NE D blew a 14 pt lead in the 4th qtr for the first and ONLY time in history. I always gave NE's D credit for keeping them in that game but when it was winning time they folded- did the Giants D blow a huge 4th qtr lead in either SB?

As great as Eli's drives were they weren't close to Brady's in that SB b/c he got the ball at his 17 w/ NO timeouts. Time was not a factor in Eli's drives.

---------- Post added at 04:40 PM ---------- Previous post was at 04:38 PM ----------

It wasn't just 1 game. Eli has TWO SB MVPs. He led the Giants on TWO game winning drives in the 4th quarter to win SBs. Enough Said!

He did, he had a ball stick to a helmet before hitting a wide open Plax to win the first one. He doesn't have a single elite full season- how can he be considered elite? Great job in postseason, I'd take him in a big game over almost any QB in the game but to be elite you must be great a majority of the time, he has rarely been great.