Scheme or Talent? | Page 3 | FinHeaven - Miami Dolphins Forums

Scheme or Talent?

Here's my question for whoever wants to answer it: with the talent we currently have on defense...who do you guys want to become our DC, and what scheme do y'all want the new DC to run?
 
DKphin said:
I agree totally, the biggest problem with this team is Tannenbaum. The guy is a moron. I know nothing about Grier, but T-Bum has done nothing but made some draft day decisions that has retarded the development of our organization. He is a cancer and he needs to be excised. But for some ungodly reason the owner remains oblivious to how much of a moron he is. How do you have OG problems and not draft a Guard until the 5th rd. Asiata might work out, but the guys we passed up. It just makes me want to vomit every time I think of that idiot being involved in personnel decisions.
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With respect, I don't agree with this at all. I have changed my tune on Tannenbaum and he hasn't been nearly as bad as I feared. He's supportive and from what I can tell doesn't micromanage. Our personnel decisions aren't made in a vacuum. Naturally, they include Tannenbaum, but are still collaborative. Grier runs the show in that area, and he discusses things with Gase and coordinators. I suspect Tannenbaum probably does what he does best and handles things in the building relationships and negotiating department etc.. But I would guess things probably don't start getting serious unless Gase determines there is a need.
 
phinfan33 said:
Here's my question for whoever wants to answer it: with the talent we currently have on defense...who do you guys want to become our DC, and what scheme do y'all want the new DC to run?
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Any DC who knows how to run a flexible and versatile scheme and isn't fixated on archaic prototypes.
 
Is this the same scheme that Cincinnati used during their most recent stretch of consistent contender status done in by qb play and attrition specifically at the lb level late in season and in the postseason?

If so I can tell ya that the qb play of dalton and lb attrition to vontaze burfict and mauluga in his prime were the biggest factors
 
This defense is missing it's leader, it's alpha, it's QB. It's missing "The Chef". One criminally underrated aspect of a successful defense is having it's captain. McMillon was not only drafted for his physical tools and football intellect he was drafted for leadership.
Kiko is not that guy, neither are various scrubs this front office insist of NFL level LB's. Timmons has a shot captain he's the most experience and has been a captain before.
When you look at the guys the Dolphins have signed as UDFA and FA in general they've all worn the "C". Get a savvy veteran who can wear the "C" and this defense will get better.
 
Talent.

It is always talent. Scheme makes talent better than they would be otherwise, but it's about the talent.

Scheme is the icing on the cake and it had better match your talent.
 
Stoobz said:
Talent.

It is always talent. Scheme makes talent better than they would be otherwise, but it's about the talent.

Scheme is the icing on the cake and it had better match your talent.
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[very loud and obnoxious buzzer sound for a wrong answer]

Then explain this quote from Bum Phillips about Bear Bryant & Don Shula,

"He can take his'n and beat your'n and take your'n and beat his'n."

Also, how has NE been able to not only consistently compete, but consistently dominate the NFL landscape for almost two decades now?


*To add,

I am not afraid of an army of lions led by a sheep; I am afraid of an army of sheep led by a lion. - Alexander the Great

IOW, it's about coaching and scheme.
 
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That's fine wisdom you have there. It was true when Bum said it.

Let me ask this - why did Shula never win another championship after '73, especially with Marino at the helm?

Are you telling me Miami has had shitty defensive coaches all these decades?

Are you telling me we have run the 'wide 9' garbage all this time? (No, we have run everything under the sun with seemingly similar results)

I seem to recall year after year the cry that Marino never had a good defense to go along with his arm. (Or a good running game for that matter) If that's true, *why* did he never have a good defense?

Name me all the HoF players since those epic early 70's teams. Jason Taylor wasn't even a huge majority pick - it was questioned by many.

Please tell me which of our current defensive players are the BEST at their position?

I'll grant Suh top 3-5, Jones top 8 maybe and Wake honorable mention as a DE with top 5 pass rush talent.

I'll just leave this here - "You can't make chicken salad out of chicken ****."
 
Stoobz said:
That's fine wisdom you have there. It was true when Bum said it.

Let me ask this - why did Shula never win another championship after '73, especially with Marino at the helm?

Are you telling me Miami has had ****ty defensive coaches all these decades?
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LOL. I take you are not familiar with Olivadotti.

We haven't had a great DC since Arnsparger. We had a few good DC's. One is currently the HC in NY, at one time Nolan was another, and I'm maybe missing a few others like Jimmy Johnson although he was obviously the HC.


Stoobz said:
Are you telling me we have run the 'wide 9' garbage all this time? (No, we have run everything under the sun with seemingly similar results)

I seem to recall year after year the cry that Marino never had a good defense to go along with his arm. (Or a good running game for that matter) If that's true, *why* did he never have a good defense?
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Again, see Olividotti.


Stoobz said:
Please tell me which of our current defensive players are the BEST at their position?

I'll grant Suh top 3-5, Jones top 8 maybe and Wake honorable mention as a DE with top 5 pass rush talent.

I'll just leave this here - "You can't make chicken salad out of chicken ****."
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No one is playing with chicken **** in the NFL.
 
I am all too familiar with Olivadotti, having spent many precious Sundays watching that foul defense (51-45 anyone?). He was too much of a friend for Shula to fire.

If it were all about scheme, everyone would run the same thing with the same results but that doesn't happen.

Talent first, maximized by scheme/coaching.
 
Yeah as really it is about finding talent. Earning the respect over in the scheme and coaching of it.
 
Coaching is just as important as talent. The ability to put your players in the best position to succeed and form a scheme that makes them win in different situations is the definition of coaching. Right now it does not seem as though this is happening on defense in regard to the running game. You can have all the talent in the world, but if the scheme is f-up it won't matter.
 
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