This Christian Ponder Nonesense Needs to Stop!!!!!! | Page 4 | FinHeaven - Miami Dolphins Forums

This Christian Ponder Nonesense Needs to Stop!!!!!!

This tackle class is thin, because after you get beyond the top players there aren't many to like. However, there's nothing lacking in the top tackle prospects. Anthony Castonzo, Gabe Carimi, Derek Sherrod, Tyron Smith and even Nate Solder are all going to play in the NFL, either on the left or the right. Beyond them, I'm quite sure Jah Reid is a starting Right Tackle in this league. And James Carpenter is a pretty decent prospect. Orlando Franklin could play Tackle but his best position is Guard. James Brewer will probably end up playing.

Once you get beyond those guys, I don't know if there's a single Tackle prospect I could even stand behind drafting. That's what I mean by 'thin'.
 
If we draft another AVERAGE college qb in hopes that he can manage not to lose games... I'm officially going to be fed up. Let's get a real Quarterback prospect, or just not throw the damn ball. I'd rather ride it out with Henne for a few years until we get a chance to take a supreme signal caller, than to just take another leftover out of desperation.
 
i think there's some solid kids in the tackle class...good value picks...but there's not a tackle in this class i'd take in the top 10...smiths the only one that i think has that kind of upside...
 
jah reid is a strange guy for me...he looked stiff and like a non athlete at the combine in drills to me...and he looks to me like a guy that used to be like 400 lbs and lost a lot of weight...he's got those corn dog calves
 
Tackle, QB, safety, RB, TE there are some good guys but not many elite prospects with all-round games. Arguably, all of those position are position of need for the Fins, so it'll be a bit of a lottery whether players we pick this year work out.

On the other hand, with no clear consensus pick at some of these positions, there's a good chance an excellent player will fall to us if we traded down.

I don't consider OT or safety to be immediate needs and I would be disappointed if we spent a 1st rd pick on a OT.
 
The good thing about this draft class for Miami:

It's loaded at RB, and it's pretty damn good in the 2nd-4th round range at WR. It also has some nice depth at G/C.

There are a ton of reasons to like Ponder. In him, Daboll might see a significantly better version of C. McCoy, who he did pretty well with.
 
I've been saying for a while now, and TedSlimmJr and I talked about it a year ago, how even though the 2010 draft class was regarded to be so awesome, we saw an incoming 2011 class that should be full of talent. I still stand by that. The only position that looks real disappointing to me is safety, and even that position is one where I think teams are going to find some bargains, some guys that shine up like a new penny.

This WR class is stocked. Absolutely stocked with contributors. At the top you have guys as good of a top tier as I've seen in A.J. Green, Julio Jones and Leonard Hankerson. Then you have guys I have a ton of faith in like Denarius Moore, Edmond Gates, Randall Cobb. Jon Baldwin I don't have tons of faith in but I know that dude is going to scare some defenses one way or another, and he belongs in that group. I love guys like Niles Paul, Torrey Smith and Jerrel Jernigan as potential 2's. Greg Little and Titus Young have no shortage of talent, it's just will they get beyond their attitude issues? Those guys are all starters to me at the position. Then you have guys like Greg Salas, Dwayne Harris, Tandon Doss, Terrence Toliver, Austin Pettis, Aldrick Robinson, Tori Gurley, Ronald Johnson...one way or another they're probably making your team. You can probably say the same about Dane Sanzenbacher whose agility scores were off the charts (3.97, 6.46), and who no matter what you can't say that mother effer doesn't get open.

The RBs class is full of contributors. Mark Ingram is the only premium guy but there are a ton of guys that can take carries. Mikel Leshoure, Ryan Williams, Kendall Hunter, Daniel Thomas, Jordan Todman, Shane Vereen, Delone Carter, Bilal Powell, Alex Green, Roy Helu, Dion Lewis, Allen Bradford, Johnny White...every single one of those guys can take carries for me any time. Can they do all the other stuff to be an all-around player? I don't know. I hate to leave out guys like DeMarco Murray, Taiwan Jones, Jacquizz Rodgers and Derrick Locke...they're also going to be valuable role players...and that's what the RB position is full of nowadays in the NFL. It's all role players. And there's no shortage of them in this class. There are so many guys that when I watch them play I'm genuinely excited about what they can do. That's unusual. That doesn't happen every year.

And for all the bitching and moaning about the tight ends class there are eight interesting guys that I would REALLY be excited to get into my training camp to see what they'd do. I'd love to bring Kyle Rudolph, D.J. Williams, Virgil Green, Luke Stocker, Jordan Cameron, Julius Thomas, Lance Kendricks or Rob Housler to my camp. Those are all really, really interesting guys to me.

For all the bitching about the quarterbacks class, you could legitimately have five quarterbacks go in the 1st round. Cam Newton and Blaine Gabbert will definitely go 1st round. I think when all is said and done so will Ryan Mallett and Christian Ponder, and all it takes is one team to really like Jake Locker's ability to make big throws on the run. When it comes to the bottom of the QB class, there are definitely some interesting guys there, from T.J. Yates to Colin Kaepernick, Ricky Stanzi, Pat Devlin, Andy Dalton...all of those guys have the physical ability, all of them have production, all of them are winners, all of them are smart with great character. If any of those guys jumps up and becomes a starter, is that really going to be a shock? Really? Even Jeff Van Camp is an interesting physical specimen. And you know Greg McElroy's going to kick around for a long time as a backup.

The tackle class may be top heavy (as are most tackle classes I've evaluated, that tends to be the nature of the position), but there are a lot of interior linemen that I would swear are going to play football, from Orlando Franklin to Mike Pouncey, Danny Watkins, John Moffitt, Will Rackley, Justin Boren, Daniel Kilgore, Rodney Hudson and Stefan Wisniewski.

I don't even have to go into the defensive line class because everyone already is super high on it, but we saw that happening a year in advance.

I think this linebackers class (the true linebackers, not the pass rushers) is pretty darn underrated, too. Guys like Martez Wilson, Quan Sturdivant, Colin McCarthy and Nate Irving will play football. Bruce Carter will at the very least play on passing downs. Guys like K.J. Wright, Ross Homan and Mark Herzlich will play football. Then you've got some guys I can't help but find interesting like Tressor Baptiste, Mario Harvey, Jonas Mouton, Scott Lutrus, Winston Venable, Casey Matthews, Chris White and Ben Jacobs.

At pass rusher, Dontay Moch is about as interesting and unique a role player as I've ever seen at the outside rush spot (note: I do think he's just a role player). I love Chris Carter. I love Von Miller. Akeem Ayers has a ton of talent. Justin Houston is just solid, maybe a little overrated, but he'll play football. A lot of people I respect are super high on Brooks Reed. Aldon Smith is an excellent prospect. Jabaal Sheard is an excellent prospect. Clay Nurse is going to play football.

At cornerback I love the top of the class, I love Patrick Peterson and I love Prince Amukamara. They're the next Champ Bailey and Darrelle Revis. I truly believe that. Brandon Harris can play, I don't care what anyone says. Jimmy Smith is more of a question for me. I haven't done my homework on the depths of the CB class, but when I see guys I'm familiar with like Ras-I Dowling, Rashad Carmichael, Marcus Gilchrist, Shareece Wright, Cortez Allen and Chris L. Rucker languishing in the middle to bottom of the class, that has to be a pretty good sign.

As for the safety position it's clearly lacking all the way around, and especially at the top. But that doesn't mean you're not going to get some bargains. Smart evaluators are going to find players for that position, converts like Marcus Gilchrist, Cortez Allen and Chris Culliver, guys with big play ability but some issues like Rahim Moore and DeAndre McDaniel, and then really underrated guys like David Sims, Tejay Johnson and Mistral Raymond. I also like Chris Conte a lot, you could see his explosion on tape and then going to the Combine and having a 10'7" broad jump shows that the explosion you could see on tape was for real.
 
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jah reid is a strange guy for me...he looked stiff and like a non athlete at the combine in drills to me...and he looks to me like a guy that used to be like 400 lbs and lost a lot of weight...he's got those corn dog calves

I thought he looked good in Combine drills.

He's a body development story. In college you can only work on your body so hard but I've heard coaches at UCF talk about how he transformed his body more than anyone they've ever seen. He was a 400 pound guy coming in, something like 370 lbs as an incoming frosh. I think the earlier the tape of him you watch the less you're going to be impressed, because he's been working hard on his body and his conditioning. But what's come out of it is damn impressive. The guy that played against Georgia, and in that Shrine Game, is a right tackle in the NFL that will start for ten years. And he's only getting better.
 
don't forget quinton carter at safety either...that kids gonna play in the pros...i still think there's no safety in the class worth more than a 3rd round pick...

reid looked lumbering to me in the move drills...i did like the game cuts on him though
 
I also like the tackles in this draft, well the first round tackles . . . would have been a great time to draft a tackle if we took Ryan over Long in 2008. Constanzo and Smith would be ideal . . . but I don't see the need for a tackle, regardless of what you think of Carey on the rightside, with the pick at 15 . . . and especially if you can get a QB or Ingram. Carimi would be a slight reach, but the fact that he could potentially man the LG position and eventually the RT position when Carey is done is the only guy I would be semi cool with.

How is Smith's potential as a LG?

I saw a poll where Mallet and Ingram were on the board . . . I think a better question is, if you can't trade down, and by some miraculous reason: Newton, Peterson, Green, Jones, Ingram, Prince, Quinn, Miller, Mallet, Gabbert, Locker, Bowers, Dareus and Fairley are off the board . . . who does Miami select?

That would be the worst scenario for this team . . . but they could get a good player. JJ Watt and Cam Jordan . . . Smith or Constanzo or Carimi . . . Smith or Houston . . . Smith or Harris . . . reach for Smith or Hankerson (damn alot of Smith's in this damn draft) . . . Leshoure or Ponder? Ugh

The best value would be the 3-4 DE or the pass rusher I guess.

Trade for a 2012 pick :lol:
 
i still haven't found anything about ponders shoulder other than he was medically cleared at the combine...so with what i do know if thats the case i'm gonna view it as a non issue going forward...

if anyone does know anything different please share
There is nothing wrong with his shoulder. He tried to make a tackle his junior year ans separated it. The shoulder was not an issue last year. Last year, towards the beginning of the season, he took a helmet off of his throwing elbow causing a nagging injury all season. He had fluid drained off of it on a weekly basis. Jimbo Fisher sat him during the ACC championship because he did not want to jeopardize his future. It was an injury that would, and did heal with time, but how many guys are going to give up their senior season to let it? And again, as I have stated in several posts...he was injured on plays that would have injured any qb. That doesn't make him injury prone, it just means he took a bad hit. I know they are baseball players, but Chipper Jones and Mike Hampton are injury prone. Christian Ponder took two bad hits, that's all.
 
CK,

Can't speak for anyone else who questioned this draft class, but what I mean is that there are very few consensus elite players there (away from the d-line maybe). Plenty of intriguing and talented players all over the place, but not as much of a hierarchy as I remember the last couple of seasons anyway. Nobody seems to be able to agree on who if any is the best QB prospect, the best TE prospect, the best OT prospect....

There are always differences of opinion, but this draft sees just about everyone debating the merits of everyone.

I am far from a talent evaluator, but I'm going to have a very hard time knowing if any of our picks were good/bad ones this time round, with the exception maybe of Ingram and Constanzo, who just about everyone seems to agree are top quality players at their position. Whether you pick those position in r1 is another debate.
 
Unfortunately, last year was the year to get an offensive playmaker . . . and this year was the year to get a DLineman. We are getting good players in round 1, but if we look back:

I actually don't have a problem with that. Our defense, with injured and very young players, was 6th in the league, so it is clearly getting it done with the players on hand. As well, because this draft is so defensive heavy, we can have offensive players drop to us. Say we had gone after offensive players last year(and for sake of the argument, lets say we still finished around the middle of the draft), we still would only be up for the 3rd/4th/or 5th best prospect at a position of need. Admittedly, the 3rd best prospect this year is better then in other years, but it still would have question marks.

I believe the really damning thing is the fact that this past season was a very bad year to be quarterback. Teams that had previously locked up the position(perhaps including us) and looked to be moving on are suddenly doing about faces. The entire Panthers offense was a disaster in the coaches lame duck season. The Bengals franchise player is threatening to retire. The development plan in Arizona was rushed and blew up. Mike Singletary screwed the pooch in San Fran and Alex Smith lost yet another offensive coordinator. Vince Young self destructed for the last time in Tennessee. Despite resigning McNabb to a contract extension he back fired for Washington. And Favre finally got injured after 2 decades and seems to be retiring in Minnesota.
7 teams in the top 12 picks that had the quarterback position locked down, most for at least a few years, are now forced to take another look at that position. Had those previously "franchise guys" worked out, only Buffalo and (maybe) Minnesota would be in the market to draft a young prospect in the top 15. Oh well.
 
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