I know you're talking to Junc but personally I didn't watch Plunkett play b/c he went to the Super Bowls when I wasn't alive up until I was 3. That's such a long time ago I don't see it's relevance.
Should we talk about Bart Starr next?
AFC East Quarterback Rankings
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I know you're talking to Junc but personally I didn't watch Plunkett play b/c he went to the Super Bowls when I wasn't alive up until I was 3. That's such a long time ago I don't see it's relevance.
Should we talk about Bart Starr next?
The game is different but QBs still got most of the credit for wins and blame for losses.
I despise the Giants, I hate them more than any other team(equal w/ duke basketball) but I happen to like Eli.
I think he was excellent in late game situations but keep in mind the last 2 weeks where they needed to win both games it was Victor Cruz not Eli carrying that O. Eli had a bad game against us but Victor took that 5 yd pass and ran 99 yds for the TD to totally change that game, the next week he took another short pass, made defenders miss for a long TD then after Dallas got close and NYG had a 3rd and long Eli threw one up for grabs into double coverage and Victor came out w/ it.
I really like Eli, he's a great guy and a really good QB now but I am not putting him in the elite category based on a few good games in january. To be elite you have to do it Sept through Jan/Feb. I'd rather have Eli QBing my team in a big game than Peyton but Peyton is elite and Eli is not.
I saw Plunkett play, he was vital to their runs but that doesn't mean he was great. Dilfer, Brad Johnson, McMahon and Eli '07 were vital to those runs too but none were great.
Plunket''s were 4 seasons apart, Eli's 5. Thank you for correcting my mistake.
No worries. I don't expect many guys here to have watched Plunkett, but he is relevant to the point.
I'll admit I am surprised you saw Plunkett play as I suspect most folks on here probably are not old enough. I do understand your comparison but you have to take into account that Eli put that team on his back in the 2 biggest moments of an NFL season and won the game.
In your opinion, who's better? Eli vs Peyton
You know I love busting your chops Junc.
Eli made plays, he didn't put them on his back and both of those moments came about b/c of mistakes other teams made. he easily could have thrown an INT to Samuels in XLII then needed a football to stick to a helmet, in Feb if Welker makes that catch that probably dooms the Giants and then he had that great pass and catch that easily could have been ruled incomplete.
Peyton is better, I'd rather have Eli in a big game.
It's all in fun, I don't take anything personal and you shouldn't either.
I actually saw Plunkett play several times in the Coliseum in '83 (including one of the early season games where he beat our Fins), and in '84; to compare him to Trent Dilfer is as delusional as comparing Sanchez to Philip Rivers. :idk:
Well he's just trying to get me to look dumb regarding my 'elite' definition, that's all.
I'm not trying to make you look dumb, I'm trying to make your assertion that Eli is elite look dumb. Jim Plunkett was never elite, Eli has never been elite. Both helped teams win 2 SBs in a relatively short period of time.
Plunkett was a decent QB, Eli is better than Plunkett but neither were/are great. IF Eli keeps up his postseason play through reg and post the next few years we can discuss.
Yeah I get your belief that Eli Manning isn't elite. That's why you're trying to dig up 35 year old stats to back your claim up. To you, Eli Manning needs to win more than two Super Bowls for us to start discussing his being elite.
You're lucky we aren't Giants fans here b/c I guarantee you this would never end.
It's not about wining more SBs, he's won enough, it's about playing at a consistent elite level which he has NEVER done.
ahhh, but on your homeristic sliding scale: 1 good season without a championship sandwiched between 2 mediocre if not worse ones with a lucky last 2 game scheduling fluke and then 2 more against hapless opponents = "Ellite." Yeah, right.
Using Plunkett as a comparison to Eli is a bad one just because he won the same amount of SBs. Eli was not elite when he won his 1st SB during the regular season, but he was above average, then he was lights out in the playoffs, last year, Eli was one of the best QB during the regular season, and got even better in the playoffs.
Plunkett was a QB that never looked as good as Eli, but he did have elite talent (Reason why he was picked as high as he was by the Pats), including one of the tightest and best looking Spirals in the NFL (At that time, Tommy Kramer from the Vikings and Plunkett both had the best looking balls every game), which helped him put very catchable balls each game. If you remember Plunkett, you will also probably remember during the Raider and Flores years, he was thought of as one of the better QB playing at that time, yet at his best, never was he as good as Eli has been looking these past 4 years.
No Marcus Allen for Plunkett, the Raiders probably don't even reach another SB, yet take another good QB with Allen, they probably still reach and win another SB. As for Eli, there is no player in 2012 that wa not there in 2007 that would hurt the Gaints from again reaching the playoffs and winning another SB....unless that player was Eli, then the Giants would probably fail this past year.
I was told Eli is elite b/c he has 2 SBs, I brought up Plunkett b/c he has 2 SB wins too so it's a valid comparison.
No Victor Cruz and the Giants don't make the playoffs last year so yeah there was one player. Cruz carried them the last 2 weeks of the reg season, w/o his great play they don't even make the playoffs. Remember, that team missed the TWO previous postseasons.
Yet no knees from Indy and the the Jets don't make the playoffs in 09. Remember they missed the playoffs the TWO previous postseasons including a 4-12 beauty...but that team was "elite" That would have been 4 straight seasons without a playoff game.
:d-day:Yet no knees from Indy and the the Jets don't make the playoffs in 09. Remember they missed the playoffs the TWO previous postseasons including a 4-12 beauty...but that team was "elite" That would have been 4 straight seasons without a playoff game.
sorry we didn't get 5-6 dead teams to end '08 and no Brady. The '09 Jets made the AFC Championship Game, did so again in '10 and are the only team in the last 3 years to reach 2- that's elite.
'07, '08 and '09 would have been 3 seasons w/o a postseason- we made it in '06.
but we made it in '09 so our streak was only 2 years, the longest drought since '95-'97. Miami broke their 6 year drought in '08 and picked up where they left off a year later as this year will be 4 and counting