Alex Smith vs Ryan Tannehill | Page 15 | FinHeaven - Miami Dolphins Forums

Alex Smith vs Ryan Tannehill

The Goat said:
Link to the part where he didn't attend WR meetings? Because from my recollection, it wasn't that he attended one over the other. As I recall, he attended BOTH.

Also, you might want to check your stats, because I'm pretty damned sure you're missing some JUCO stats. And attempts isn't really the point. Of all of those players...how many, exactly, switched from Wide Receiver (where he led the team one year) to Quarterback midway through their Junior season, then were drafted into the NFL 18 months later as a top 10 QB?
Click to expand...
I've already hit him up on Rodgers and Newton - 11 & 12 games including championships... that was enough to get the lay of the land and I stopped at that point . But I was thinking that if Tannehill had played JUCO there's no way he'd have "overlooked" that aggregate.. Bottom Line: garbage in/garbage out
 
Vaark said:
sigh.. the first 2 I checked I determined that your information is flawed- either by comission or omission.. I'll give you the benefit of the doubt for now

Cam Newton.. Blinn CC could not find number of attempts/completions BUT considering:
By fall, Newton was ready to play. He threw for 2,833 yards, rushed for 655, and accounted for 39 total touchdowns. The Buccaneers went 11-1, and won the NJCAA national championship
you could probably add another 200-300 attempts and 11 or 12 more games starting experience including championship ones.

Aaron Rodgers
Butte JCC
165-265 attempts, to lead Butte to a 10-1 record, NorCal Conf championship and No.2 ranking

I decided to stop there, cuz that's enough to make the point I think should be obvious by now.
Click to expand...

Honestly couldn't find any JC stats so i can't really add what i don't know.. But even if you generously add 300 more attempts to Cam thats still only 592 to Tannehill's 774. I would argue half a season playing against superior competition is worth more experience wise than 11 games against mostly scrubs.

Why bring up yds, tds, team record and such. You realize all i said was here are some QB's with less pass attempts than Tannehill. Besides Rodgers if you want to estimate his JC attempts, my statement is accurate as Tannehill had more attempts than all those QB's.
 
FinfanInBuffalo said:
(A) That is not what average means (I think you are looking for median)
(B) Even if it did, 12th in the league of 32 teams would be well above the median since there are a minimum of 32 QBs. Add the QBs with partial seasons but enough throws to qualify and the number is higher than 32 making the median higher than 16.


Slightly?

Also, why use rank with QB rating but computed average with yards? He was ranked 9th in yards in 2015.
Click to expand...

Because QB rating doesn't go up with the more games you play. If you play say 13 games and have a 93.5 rating it probably won't change dramatically in 3 games. It's a bit different than hypothetically having 4030 yards in 13 games, one could assume you would at least maybe end up with 4500 if your avg fell off or 4960 if you maintained your avg.

Also according to fox sports.com and football reference.com only 30 teams qualified for a league leader in QB rating so he was actually 12 out of 30. The Bears and the Browns did have any qualifying QB's.
 
Tannehill was playing much much better under Gase. Coaching matters. Alex Smith didn't take off until he had harbaugh. Passer rating also goes up in your 30s as history proves. Patience young grasshoppers. Give tannehill a full year under Gase
 
superphin said:
I made 0 references to games played and even less so to championships games, so yes you really showed me. But I'll play along lets use games played, so Tannehill played 1.5 years.

Cam Newton 2 years.
Alex Smith 2 years
Carson Wentz 1.5 years
Brock Osweiler 1.5 years
Vinny Testaverde 2 years
Jameis Winston 2 years

The original statement i replied to the gentleman said "There has not ever been a QB with the route to the NFL that Ryan Tannehill has had. He learned how to play QB on the job in the NFL" as if he was a WR his entire football career besides 1.5 years of QB play. He was a 3rd string QB who went to all QB meeting and took reps as a QB in practice who happened to be athletic enough to also play WR not the other way around.

So if Tannehill had played 6 more games at QB would that have transformed him in some way? Would that have accelerated his development? 1.5 years is not enough but 2 is just the right amount? Bottom line reading comprehension is important.
Click to expand...

Ya know, I'm about to put you on /ignore. Your hatred of Tannehill is about as nonstop and unfiltered as the other guy's and what's funny is that you can post and convolute as many negative permutations as you can think up, and ignore or rationalize away the positive ones and it's still ****ing meaningless because your opinion and my opposing one are both worthless when it comes to effecting change or the status quo.

You will not change one single mind! But continue to go bonkers over Tannehill; just realize that it means nothing to those who disagree with you which are still the majority last I looked. There will be no epiphany, nor capitulation. We get it, you hate Tannehill. We also get that you have some underlying need to heavy handedly foist your opinion on strangers who could give a ****. So knock yourself out. .. I'm tapping out of this circle jerk!
 
Vaark said:
Ya know, I'm about to put you on /ignore. Your hatred of Tannehill is about as nonstop and unfiltered as the other guy's and what's funny is that you can post and convolute as many negative permutations as you can think up, and ignore or rationalize away the positive ones and it's still ****ing meaningless because your opinion and my opposing one are both worthless when it comes to effecting change or the status quo.

You will not change one single mind! But continue to go bonkers over Tannehill; just realize that it means nothing to those who disagree with you which are still the majority last I looked. There will be no epiphany, nor capitulation. We get it, you hate Tannehill. We also get that you have some underlying need to heavy handedly foist your opinion on strangers who could give a ****. So knock yourself out. .. I'm tapping out of this circle jerk!
Click to expand...

OMG dude where in this exchange did i say anything negative about Tannehill if you can show me, I will log out right now and go away. I simply said he had 774 something pass attempts in reference to the gentleman who said he learned to play QB in the NFL.

Don't lump me with other people when i have stated multiple times that he is the best QB we've had since Marino. I never said he sucked or that we should cut him or anything of the sort. My biggest issue is inconsistency not lack of talent.
 
superphin said:
Because QB rating doesn't go up with the more games you play. If you play say 13 games and have a 93.5 rating it probably won't change dramatically in 3 games. It's a bit different than hypothetically having 4030 yards in 13 games, one could assume you would at least maybe end up with 4500 if your avg fell off or 4960 if you maintained your avg.

Also according to fox sports.com and football reference.com only 30 teams qualified for a league leader in QB rating so he was actually 12 out of 30. The Bears and the Browns did have any qualifying QB's.
Click to expand...
superphin said:
Because QB rating doesn't go up with the more games you play. If you play say 13 games and have a 93.5 rating it probably won't change dramatically in 3 games. It's a bit different than hypothetically having 4030 yards in 13 games, one could assume you would at least maybe end up with 4500 if your avg fell off or 4960 if you maintained your avg.

Also according to fox sports.com and football reference.com only 30 teams qualified for a league leader in QB rating so he was actually 12 out of 30. The Bears and the Browns did have any qualifying QB's.
Click to expand...

Still above average in both categories. especially when you take into account supporting casts.
 
superphin said:
OMG dude where in this exchange did i say anything negative about Tannehill if you can show me, I will log out right now and go away. I simply said he had 774 something pass attempts in reference to the gentleman who said he learned to play QB in the NFL.

Don't lump me with other people when i have stated multiple times that he is the best QB we've had since Marino. I never said he sucked or that we should cut him or anything of the sort. My biggest issue is inconsistency not lack of talent.
Click to expand...

I get you man . . . despite the shortcomings around him, Ryan himself was a prety inconsistent player his first 69 games. He does have these "light switch" moments tho. His first one came in 2014 vs. the Raiders in London. Something about that game always stood out to me, it was like his ball placement became a strength when through his first 36 games I thought it was an area he needed noticeable improvement.

A light switched on in that PIttsburgh game in 2016 and that was a different player and it was almost immediately noticeable. Some people will say "He was always that guy" . . . well I wouldn't go that far, but I saw a more confident player in the pocket in that game and it carried through all the way to the Arizona game in which he hurt the knee (certainly a few tough games mixed in but there was no decline in the player).

That guy who came of age in the Pitt game and stayed through the rest of the season is a guy this Miami team can win a championship with. Now taking a few steps back, he's gotta be healthy, he has gotta continue that amazing work ethic he has always displayed and he has to continue to improve his overall game, like all great players should do . . . but I feel like we have a QB who can win big games for you . . . if you surround him with a capable supporting cast.

Getting that feeling from a QB is not an easy task. Hell I argued on Ryan for several years but in the middle of those arguments I applauded the extension they gave him because you know what . . . finding a QB just ain't easy as it looks and truthfully we never gave him a great chance to have success since the day he stepped foot in the building. He showed enough to be a starter in this league at the time and that contract was starter money for a mid 20's guy.

You return a healthy Ryan Tannehill and put a top 15, not a top 5, just a top 15 defense and a top 15 offensive line around him . . . with our current skills . . . we are legit battling New England for the AFC East in 2018 and a first round bye. That kid was no longer a kid you can shrink the field on . . . he was making defenses pay left and right in 2016 for doing it. It really saddens me that dude didn't get a chance to see that season out, he earned it and more.
 
Kdawg954 said:
I get you man . . . despite the shortcomings around him, Ryan himself was a prety inconsistent player his first 69 games. He does have these "light switch" moments tho. His first one came in 2014 vs. the Raiders in London. Something about that game always stood out to me, it was like his ball placement became a strength when through his first 36 games I thought it was an area he needed noticeable improvement.

A light switched on in that PIttsburgh game in 2016 and that was a different player and it was almost immediately noticeable. Some people will say "He was always that guy" . . . well I wouldn't go that far, but I saw a more confident player in the pocket in that game and it carried through all the way to the Arizona game in which he hurt the knee (certainly a few tough games mixed in but there was no decline in the player).

That guy who came of age in the Pitt game and stayed through the rest of the season is a guy this Miami team can win a championship with. Now taking a few steps back, he's gotta be healthy, he has gotta continue that amazing work ethic he has always displayed and he has to continue to improve his overall game, like all great players should do . . . but I feel like we have a QB who can win big games for you . . . if you surround him with a capable supporting cast.

Getting that feeling from a QB is not an easy task. Hell I argued on Ryan for several years but in the middle of those arguments I applauded the extension they gave him because you know what . . . finding a QB just ain't easy as it looks and truthfully we never gave him a great chance to have success since the day he stepped foot in the building. He showed enough to be a starter in this league at the time and that contract was starter money for a mid 20's guy.

You return a healthy Ryan Tannehill and put a top 15, not a top 5, just a top 15 defense and a top 15 offensive line around him . . . with our current skills . . . we are legit battling New England for the AFC East in 2018 and a first round bye. That kid was no longer a kid you can shrink the field on . . . he was making defenses pay left and right in 2016 for doing it. It really saddens me that dude didn't get a chance to see that season out, he earned it and more.
Click to expand...

Well said. I agree that Tannehill showed flashes in 2013 and 2014. 2015 was a step back. 2016 (after the slow start) should have been the eye opener for all the naysayers. Obviously I have been in his corner since 2013 and I am the first to admit that I was projecting how he would play as he gained experience and a better supporting cast. His improved ball placement (IMO) was largely due to Lazor and I give Lazor credit for coaching up the mechanics and footwork. Gase continued the physical development that last season and significantly grew the mental development.

I think it is important to state that the inconsistency early in a career (especially with significant changes around the QB) are the norm. Luck, Mariota, Carr, Winston, Flacco, Prescott, Newton have all experienced the same thing. The only QBs that are able to maintain consistency year to year are either superstars or have a stable team around them or both.
 
Also outside of Russel Wilson every young qb or younger qb is inconsistent. See Cam Newton this year? How about last year? Carr this year was terrible..Mariotta was bad. Bortles sucks. Winston is a bust IMO, Prescott wasn't good either, Goff was good this year after one of the worst rookie campaigns ever.

Wentz looks like a star, a bigger Aaron Rodgers..About every decade a star like that comes around..It happens..Some teams have never had a star qb...
 
You must log in or register to reply here.
Back
Top Bottom