hoops
Tua time!
true. but a good qb makes the coach look better, the oline better, the rb more effective.
a good qb also gives you a chance to win games even with a bad d.
Armando: Finding a QB is more important than victories
- Thread starter Geforce
- Start date
true. but a good qb makes the coach look better, the oline better, the rb more effective.
a good qb also gives you a chance to win games even with a bad d.
NWFLJoe
VIPs: better looking than the riff raff
Here's my breakdown of the playoff quarterbacks from last year. I break them into three categories:
G: Great QB (3)
S: Serviceable QB, great supporting cast (8)
W: WTF? (1)
Here are the playoff quarterbacks (please ignore the spelling errors...I didn't feel like looking up Rothliesberger, Garrard, Hasselbeck, et al). I classified each as G, S, or W:
AFC:
Tom Brady (G)
Peyton Manning (G)
Phillip Rivers (S)
Ben Rothliesberger (S)
David Garrard (S)
Vince Young (S)
NFC:
Tony Romo (S)
Brett Favre (G)
Matt Hasselbeck (S)
Jeff Garcia (S)
Eli Manning (S)
Todd Collins (W) (for Jason Campbell, an S)
While some might argue that Rivers, Rothliesberger, Romo, Hasselbeck, or even Garrard could be classified higher, there are really only three quarterbacks on the list I'd classify as great -- those who can put a team on their back and who will ultimately end up in the HoF: Brady, P. Manning, and Favre.
Todd Collins is a WTF?...a nice story, sure, but still a WTF?, in that he didn't lead the team so much as he didn't derail them.
That means that 8 of the 12 playoff teams -- 75% -- had S quarterbacks, ones who are made better by their cast as least as much as they make their cast better. Serviceable, solid pros. But not GREAT quarterbacks.
Looking at the last 10 Super Bowls, 5 were won by 3 G quarterbacks (Elway, Brady x3, and P. Manning), and 3 were won by S quarterbacks (Warner, Rothliesberger, and E. Manning). In addition, the aforementioned pair of WTF? guys -- Dilfer and Johnson -- also hoisted the Lombardi.
Among the SB losers were 1 G (Brady), 6 S's (McNair, Warner, Gannon, Delhomme, McNabb, and Hasselbeck), and 3 W's (Chandler, Collins, and Grossman).
The point? And, yes...there is a point...
It doesn't take a great quarterback to win. A serviceable quarterback in a solid system can, and often does, translate into wins.
- 75% of last year's playoff teams were led by S QBs.
- 50% of the past ten Super Bowls were won by S or W QBs
- 70% of the past ten Super Bowl quarterbacks (14 of 20) were S or W.
Winning trumps having THAT GUY as your quarterback.
burger13
FinHeaven VIP
we're going in circles here.....obvioulsy any team strength can help compensate for other weaknesses. Baltimore's Defense made Trent Dilfer a Super Bowl Champion, Dan Marino kept Miami contenders with little-to-no help from a running game or a defense, and Devin Hester helps the Bears compensate for a lack of offense in general....you could go on for days.
but, while finding a QB may be more important than anything else, it is not more important than EVERYTHING else. :up:
ZachThomas76
☠️ Banned ☠️
I can see both sides to that. I just think if we are going to build from the lines out, and try and develop a power run game, having a good qb that can make plays when needed would be nice. Its all fine and dandy to have "serviceable" qb who plays the system, while having a good run game and defense at his disposal.
The problem is, if you have a team like that, and you get down 14-0 early, your qb can get exposed for what he really is. I want a qb that falls into the good category, I dont think we need a great one to win consistently. I look at Hasselbeck. Hes nothing special, but certainly much better than average. If we can get qb play at that level, Id be fine with that. I dont wanna hear a peep either Hoops. :unsure:
The problem is, if you have a team like that, and you get down 14-0 early, your qb can get exposed for what he really is. I want a qb that falls into the good category, I dont think we need a great one to win consistently. I look at Hasselbeck. Hes nothing special, but certainly much better than average. If we can get qb play at that level, Id be fine with that. I dont wanna hear a peep either Hoops. :unsure:
hoops
Tua time!
those are excellent points. but how many of those qbs have won superbowls??? the 3 great ones and eli manning (whose d really won that game and i consider serviceable.)
my thought is you've got a much better chance of being a lasting power in the nfl and a repeat champion if you've got a great qb. unfortunately 28 or 29 teams in the nfl can't seem to say that and primarily those 28 or 29 teams are the ones not playing or winning superbowls of late.
hoops
Tua time!
NWFLJoe
VIPs: better looking than the riff raff
The past 10 Super Bowl winning QBs:
1998: Elway (G)
1999: Warner (S)
2000: Dilfer (W)
2001: Brady (G)
2002: Johnson (W)
2003: Brady (G)
2004: Brady (G)
2005: Rothliesberger (S)
2006: P. Manning (G)
2007: E. Manning (S)
Of the ten, five were won by three great quarterbacks: Elway, Brady (x3), and P. Manning.
The other five were won by S and W quarterbacks.
hoops
Tua time!
well, i can't argue that. you make great points. i'm just one of those guys that always wants the carson palmer type behind center. the rifle arm the flawless mechanics. the big stats.
i guess my perception was the great qbs cause of how much brady and peyton manning we've seen of late in the big game.
i do know that if you've got an s or worse qb by your ranking you better have a top notch d and running game to win the big one.
ZachThomas76
☠️ Banned ☠️
I dont live in Florida, but just curious for those of you that do, what is your opinion of Armando? from what ive read on various sites, hes widely regarded as a moron. true?
NWFLJoe
VIPs: better looking than the riff raff
Truer words were never spake...or writ, to be more precise.
I just happen to think that you've got a better chance to win with a team that's great on defenses and in the running game, but has an average QB than with an average team and a great QB.
Just my opinion. I could be wrong. It's happened before.
Once.
Absolutely agreed. I think this is why they agreed to terms with WAS in the JT trade. They are looking to make a run in 2009-10.
I believe that the "plan" is to crown Henne the franchise QB. But as he is groomed...they try out Beck with McCown as the team #2(unless he impresses as shows us a Rich Gannon late career turnaround)...
If we decide not to sign Bentley as our last remaining piece to a fully rebuilt OL, then I could see MIA either using some of their newly found cap space/money to sign a superstar LG next offseason or drafting one in the 2nd round of the 2009 draft.
However you look at it, I don't expect MIA to draft another QB in the first day of the draft. I think they are going to groom Henne to supplant Beck eventually.
hoops
Tua time!
i would think the regime feels they have the answer at the other guard long term with either shawn murphy or donald thomas.
TX-FinFan
Seasoned Veteran
Disagree with the article. If you have a solid team with an average QB you stand a better chance to win against a great QB with an average team. Look at what happened to Marino. Never had a running game or good defense. Never won the big game.
My #1 interest this season is to see how productive our OL is and how both Ronnie and Ricky perform. A solid ground game is needed with young QBs in the mix. And since our defense is no longer a top 10 unit, we will need to control the clock/ball by grinding it out. This is not a high octane powered offense that will get in a shootout with the Colts in a 40+ point game.
My #1 interest this season is to see how productive our OL is and how both Ronnie and Ricky perform. A solid ground game is needed with young QBs in the mix. And since our defense is no longer a top 10 unit, we will need to control the clock/ball by grinding it out. This is not a high octane powered offense that will get in a shootout with the Colts in a 40+ point game.
Kendra_Chelsea
General Martian Army
here is something to think about a serviceable quarterback can win the big one-sure.
But how many of them has lead a dynasty?
Anyone up for a team thats one and done?
But how many of them has lead a dynasty?
Anyone up for a team thats one and done?
what statistics or NFL have you been watching? teams that win most super bowls are the teams with the great QBs, not the ones with the journeyman/average QBs. ????