Chad Henne vs. Ryan Tannehill: A Scary Thought? | Page 12 | FinHeaven - Miami Dolphins Forums

Chad Henne vs. Ryan Tannehill: A Scary Thought?

shouright said:
I think what you mean is that those things aren't measurable? If so, and if they contribute to effective QB play, why wouldn't they be reflected in his QB-relevant statistics?

If he's so much better than Chad Henne in these areas, and these areas are related to winning (as I presume you think they are), then why wouldn't they be reflected in statistics that are based on QB play and also strongly related to winning?

Are you telling me that Peyton Manning, for example, who does what you're saying above probably better than anyone in the league, has QB statistics that don't reflect these abilities? Is his QB rating devoid of any input of these abilities on his part?

If these abilities contribute to Peyton Manning's QB rating, why don't they contribute to Ryan Tannehill's?
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What I'm saying is Peyton at the start of his career didn't have incredible numbers, many of the best QBs didn't. But you could see they were improving, making better reads, faster reads, changing to the right plays, confused less by defenses and confident. This something I hope Henne would do but he just didn't improve. He stayed stagnant. Tannehill has already improved many of the thing he had as problems his last year of university and his first year as a pro. Progression is the key. Am I sure he's the one? Of course not but he does a lot of the things great QBs do already. He's not the finished product. Things I personally think he need to improve are his pocket awareness ( you can tell, by the coaches comments that he's being coached to stay in the pocket more than pull it down and run) so he must learn the nuances of the pocket like Peyton or Brady, he has to identify missed assignments by the defense even if it's not his first read, his manipulation of safeties and LBs with his eyes and more so his entire head, and his deep throws. But from watching him he does many of the things Bree's, Manning, Brady do before the snap and after the snap.
 
This post doesn't account for the total points scored by the offense, which have almost entirely been set up by the passing game even if the running backs have taken the ball across the line.
 
Canadi-Phin said:
What I'm saying is Peyton at the start of his career didn't have incredible numbers, many of the best QBs didn't. But you could see they were improving, making better reads, faster reads, changing to the right plays, confused less by defenses and confident. This something I hope Henne would do but he just didn't improve. He stayed stagnant.
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And I suspect you're able to make that judgment now with the benefit of hindsight, or you were part of the minority of the forum at the time who, even going into Henne's third year as a starter (2011, the one after we've been talking about in this thread), didn't think he would "light it up."

Tannehill has already improved many of the thing he had as problems his last year of university and his first year as a pro. Progression is the key. Am I sure he's the one? Of course not but he does a lot of the things great QBs do already. He's not the finished product. Things I personally think he need to improve are his pocket awareness ( you can tell, by the coaches comments that he's being coached to stay in the pocket more than pull it down and run) so he must learn the nuances of the pocket like Peyton or Brady, he has to identify missed assignments by the defense even if it's not his first read, his manipulation of safeties and LBs with his eyes and more so his entire head, and his deep throws. But from watching him he does many of the things Bree's, Manning, Brady do before the snap and after the snap.
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Let's put it this way: if his QB rating is where it is now (about 85) at the end of the season, I'll consider this year a smashing success. Seriously. :up:

---------- Post added at 09:20 PM ---------- Previous post was at 09:18 PM ----------
Sirspud said:
This post doesn't account for the total points scored by the offense, which have almost entirely been set up by the passing game even if the running backs have taken the ball across the line.
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The only way we would know if the original post didn't account for that is if that particular issue was different for Henne in 2010 than it has been this year for Tannehill. If there is no difference in that regard, it's immaterial.
 
shouright said:
And I suspect you're able to make that judgment now with the benefit of hindsight, or you were part of the minority of the forum at the time who, even going into Henne's third year as a starter (2011, the one after we've been talking about in this thread), thought he would "light it up."

Let's put it this way: if his QB rating is where it is now (about 85) at the end of the season, I'll consider this year a smashing success. Seriously. :up:

---------- Post added at 09:20 PM ---------- Previous post was at 09:18 PM ----------

The only way we would know if the original post didn't account for that is if that particular issue was different for Henne in 2010 than it has been this year for Tannehill. If there is no difference in that regard, it's immaterial.
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I think many of us even me were hopeful he would "light it up". The problem as soon as that year started he was the same player. He was very disappointing because he just didn't get better or improve. Sometimes that's the danger of drafting a senior who went to a good school, they sometimes have been coached up to their personal ceiling. This is how I feel about a guy like Andy Dalton, or prospects from Alabama. They've had so much experience or such good coaching that they won't get any better in the pros. Tannehill was such a short time starter but showed the skills to be much better, he was at his floor coming in at least I hope he was.
 
Um, Henne had four years at Michigan to play QB and show exactly what he was.

I saw the exact same thing on the field from pretty much day one. And told everyone who would listen. I did have some FH experts who disagreed w. me, at first.

And a whole host of "regular fans" who crucified me.

Bottom line: Tanny ain't Henne. The people who think so are the same ones who look at a stat sheet and declare that Devon Bess is a better WR than Megatron.

lol. smh.

LD
 
LDaniel7 said:
Bottom line: Tanny ain't Henne. The people who think so are the same ones who look at a stat sheet and declare that Devon Bess is a better WR than Megatron.
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I almost forgot about that one. :sidelol:
 
shouright said:
[/COLOR]The only way we would know if the original post didn't account for that is if that particular issue was different for Henne in 2010 than it has been this year for Tannehill. If there is no difference in that regard, it's immaterial.
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But there is a difference, in only one of Henne's first 4 2010 games did we score over 20 points, and that was a loss, while in only one of Tannehill's first 4 have we scored less than 20, with all of his wins having more than twenty points. And added into Henne's first 4 was a defensive TD in a game where only 14 points were scored.
 
Sirspud said:
But there is a difference, in only one of Henne's first 4 2010 games did we score over 20 points, and that was a loss, while in only one of Tannehill's first 4 have we scored less than 20, with all of his wins having more than twenty points. And added into Henne's first 4 was a defensive TD in a game where only 14 points were scored.
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Do you think that represents a difference between Henne and Tannehill's performances? If so, why isn't it reflected in their statistics?
 
Sirspud said:
But there is a difference, in only one of Henne's first 4 2010 games did we score over 20 points, and that was a loss, while in only one of Tannehill's first 4 have we scored less than 20, with all of his wins having more than twenty points. And added into Henne's first 4 was a defensive TD in a game where only 14 points were scored.
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It should be noted that in henne's 1st 4 games the dolphins scored over 30 points in each game. It was a feat that had not been accomplished since the Marino era.
 
shouright said:
Do you think that represents a difference between Henne and Tannehill's performances? If so, why isn't it reflected in their statistics?
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Tannehill has had 5 rushing touchdowns from his backs, the 2010 Dolphins only had one in their first 4 games. 4 More TD drives in four games is a pretty significant difference and the 7 extra points a game is the difference in winning many, which is why we're 3-1 and Henne was 2-2 at that point.
 
Sirspud said:
Tannehill has had 5 rushing touchdowns from his backs, the 2010 Dolphins only had one in their first 4 games. 4 More TD drives in four games is a pretty significant difference and the 7 extra points a game is the difference in winning many, which is why we're 3-1 and Henne was 2-2 at that point.
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But if Tannehill is accounting for a greater number of TD drives, why isn't that reflected as a difference from Henne in his yardage and YPA?
 
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