Dolphins coaches asked Incognito to toughen up Martin, sources say

[Fin Thirteen]

I felt the coaches were culpable for not seeing there was an issue between Martin and Incognito and dealing with it.

Now that it appears they instigated the whole mess - I'm literally dumbfounded.

So, Martin needed to toughen up - I think we can all agree on that. And the coaches decided the best way to do that was not positive reinforcement, was not extra coaching on the more physical aspects, was not a "buddy system" - where one physical lineman tries to bring out the physical side of Martin by them both going off and doing "physical stuff" in a peer situation.

Oh No.

The coaches decide the best way of eliciting the best response form this Stanford graduate left tackle is to ask the team's most volatile, control-averse individual to try to force him to be physical or face the consequences. I mean, the chances of this working are virtually nil. The price of it not working is that you say goodbye to your second-round pick and starter (and, as it turns out, Incognito himself, among maybe others).

I just can't see how this could have worked - what the purpose of Incognito was - even if he had done it more "tactfully". People say Martin should have pushed back. Unquestionably he should have. But would that suddenly have made him a tougher player in a game?!!! I absolutely fail to see the point of it.

It's an astonishing bit of mismanagement. I could give a flying **** if it happens in other teams or in the US military or whatever. It's a completely redundant idea if you're trying to elicit positive change. If you're trying to force a guy out of the team altogether, I can see how it might work, but it's still very risky in an NFL team.

I'm really close to being permanently done with this team. The media has certainly blown this up out of proportion. I don't think Martin is a p***y or Incognito is a psychopath. I know that the NFL is full to bursting of all kinds of screwed up individuals in one way or another and the league could basically care less. But I do care about the way the team is being run and it just doesn't reflect any of the reasons/values I began supporting the Dolphins for.

This better be a major watershed for the people in managerial/coaching posts in the NFL. If this doesn't elicit some major behavioural changes in them, maybe we need to send in Nick Saban to threaten them into being better coaches.

 

[mithga13]

Agreed. Huge miscalculation on his part...

Agreed, and this in my opinion is why Philbin has to own this whole debacle. Especially if he sicced a rabid dog on Martin. And make no mistake, anyone who has seen how Incognito acted on Hard Knocks, or in the past, would know that he would take it ten times too far. Jesus, Incognito has been kicked out of how many places? And this is the guy you want as a team leader? Stupid move.

I think the only possible way Philbin survives all this at this point is if he comes out and says that all hazing, no matter how insubstantial is banned by the team. Seattle was awful and turned around quickly. The same can happen here. Bring in the right coach, and the right GM and this can turn around quickly. I'd take Tannehill over Wilson all day. So we're already part way there.

 

[JJW1339]

The movie "A Few Good Men"...is the first thing I thought of when I heard that Richie I was given orders to toughen up J. Martin... He was given a "Code Red"...

 

[Canadianfishfan]

Stinking soft Martin taking everyone down with him.

Typical I'm a poor victim and everyone has to change for me.

Sorry I know are going to people my statement, but you see it all the time with other issues as well. Girls wanting to be in boy scouts etc.

You weren't cut out to hang with the Real men of this world Mr. Martin. You weren't cut out to play a MANS game Mr. Martin. You weren't MAN enough to defend yourself Mr. Martin.

Sorry, when you're involved in a game the trains men from the their childhood to inflict pain and punishment, when you're involved in a sport that is the modern day gladiator, you weren't capable to handle it.

It's not everyone else who must soften to your levels of comfort, it is you who must remove yourself, and find a line of work more suitable to your temperament.

 

[MD]

Stinking soft Martin taking everyone down with him.

Typical I'm a poor victim and everyone has to change for me.

Sorry I know are going to people my statement, but you see it all the time with other issues as well. Girls wanting to be in boy scouts etc.

You weren't cut out to hang with the Real men of this world Mr. Martin. You weren't cut out to play a MANS game Mr. Martin. You weren't MAN enough to defend yourself Mr. Martin.

Sorry, when you're involved in a game the trains men from the their childhood to inflict pain and punishment, when you're involved in a sport that is the modern day gladiator, you weren't capable to handle it.

It's not everyone else who must soften to your levels of comfort, it is you who must remove yourself, and find a line of work more suitable to your temperament.

This story leads off the Today show, Good Morning America, CNN, and I wouldn't be surprised if The View talks about it. America doesn't want to hear Neanderthal thinking that it's a sport of Gladiators. They're outraged because bullying is a hot topic of discussion and is brought up every time there is an incident involving gun violence. They hear the term "bullying" and all of a sudden the NFL is out of control.

The reality here is that the NFL is a huge business that is cleaning up the game's violence so they can maintain financial dominance over the sports world. You're kidding yourself if you think they won't clean up hazing and harassment of its players because America doesn't like it. You need to step back and look at the big picture and whether or not you like it, it's changing.

Jonathon Martin is not the culprit here. A lack of leadership is the root of the problem.

 

[dolpns13]

Martin has a better chance of playing than RI does.

Martin will never play in the NFL again.

 

[J. David Wannyheimer]

IMO at this point the only sequence of events that prevents a total franchise implosion and lots of quick firings is:

1. Richie Incognito comes out and apologizes, says he took things way too far, begs for forgiveness, says he is going to seek immediate help.
2. Team settles things privately with Martin and the NFL investigation results in 'recommendations' for 'workplace improvements' that are then mandated throughout the league.
3. Martin's camp quietly stops trying to raze the earth over his signing bonus and salary.


I'm pretty sure NONE of that is going to happen, considering that the parties involved are: 1) a guy who is a borderline nutjob, 2) the same group that went ballistic after the stadium renovation fiasco, and 3) some bigshot attorney who wrote a book about juvenile bullying.

All parties involved have a vested personal interest in this thing and are very, very emotional. Could get ugly unless some heads cool off quickly.

 

[ChambersWI]

is anybody mentioning how the article points out that Joe Philbin has cut down on rookie hazing or has tried to?

 

[J. David Wannyheimer]

is anybody mentioning how the article points out that Joe Philbin has cut down on rookie hazing or has tried to?

I did, but that's all lost in the spin cycle. I think Joe is polishing up his resume right now.

 

[petefins]

Loving all the armchair commandos thinking they're all manly and tough behind their wee little keyboard.

 

[Canadianfishfan]

This story leads off the Today show, Good Morning America, CNN, and I wouldn't be surprised if The View talks about it. America doesn't want to hear Neanderthal thinking that it's a sport of Gladiators. They're outraged because bullying is a hot topic of discussion and is brought up every time there is an incident involving gun violence. They hear the term "bullying" and all of a sudden the NFL is out of control.

The reality here is that the NFL is a huge business that is cleaning up the game's violence so they can maintain financial dominance over the sports world. You're kidding yourself if you think they won't clean up hazing and harassment of its players because America doesn't like it. You need to step back and look at the big picture and whether or not you like it, it's changing.

Jonathon Martin is not the culprit here. A lack of leadership is the root of the problem.

It likely will lead to intense media coverage.

But all I can think of is this. In any other workplace this isn't called bullying. It's called HARASSMENT.

In any other work place employees don't leak all of their grievances to the media in a statement without original documents of proof.

Most employees, don't leak information to the media until after they've acquired legal counsel, and have filed papers in court.

This is harassment. Adult MEN usually don't get bullied. It's a term I usually leave to children.

No Martin is not the culprit, but "his people" has done him a disservice.

The battle is now being fought in the media and the public court of law.

It should be fought in an actual court of law, where ALL the evidence is gathered, and assessed. Disclosure is given to the defending parties. and responses are able to be tabled.

No Martin was very smart to not follow usual lines. He has gained sympathy of a nation. Likely spared him costly legal fees. In a way extorted his pay from the Dolphins while quitting on them, and crucified Incognito and the Dolphin organization in a manner where they cannot in anyway shape or form defend the allegations properly.

I have a problem with that. I believe in due process. I believe in justice and not vigilantism.

The media is now "lynching" Incognito and this organization. This should make people angry.

Remember how everyone was calling Jonathon Vilma guilty and was exonerated.

This process needs to be fulfilled and the TRUTH revealed.

All we've heard is one side of the story, and quite frankly that isn't fair.

 

[NCFINFAN13]

IMO at this point the only sequence of events that prevents a total franchise implosion and lots of quick firings is:

1. Richie Incognito comes out and apologizes, says he took things way too far, begs for forgiveness, says he is going to seek immediate help.
2. Team settles things privately with Martin and the NFL investigation results in 'recommendations' for 'workplace improvements' that are then mandated throughout the league.
3. Martin's camp quietly stops trying to raze the earth over his signing bonus and salary.


I'm pretty sure NONE of that is going to happen, considering that the parties involved are: 1) a guy who is a borderline nutjob, 2) the same group that went ballistic after the stadium renovation fiasco, and 3) some bigshot attorney who wrote a book about juvenile bullying.

All parties involved have a vested personal interest in this thing and are very, very emotional. Could get ugly unless some heads cool off quickly.

If Ritchie comes out and says he's gay and suffers from PTSD due to childhood abuse... this ends today.