Full AFC East Grades (Plus NY Giants) | Page 9 | FinHeaven - Miami Dolphins Forums

Full AFC East Grades (Plus NY Giants)

SammySmif said:
What constitutes research anymore? Who actually watched Thomas play games live and unbiased? I saw this guy play and had no idea who he was, and had to go look him up. He stuck out to me as a serious stud. Basically carried the K State offense in an area of the country where running the football is king, and the Dlines and Olines are giants. I can't wait to watch this guy run behind Long, it is going to be a thing of beauty.

Now I pray that the Fins sign Noel Devine once this lockout is over. He will be a great guy to take a risk on in camp. If the Fins do get Reggie bush or Deangelo Williams, Devine could push them in camp. But honestly, Devine has succeeded at every level of football, and even though his size is in question, he could be a home run threat out of the backfield for us.

I also love Clay. We can line up in the I spread with Bess in the slot..motion him to TE and give teams some headaches.

These were all very solid picks. I am not sure about the last one..but I think Ireland has made up for the past Parcell's drafts. I can't believe I am saying that, but I think BP just lost his mojo when he drafted Pat White.

Also very excited to see last year's #1 finally gets to hit the field as well. The Fins D should easily be top 5, and now we just need to address the QB position.
Click to expand...

Yes clearly everyone who disagrees with you must be biased. :rolleyes:
 
ckparrothead said:
The TERMS of the trade up with Washington were good. I made it very CLEAR that I evaluated the trade totally separately. It's simple, look at the terms of the trade, and look at the quality of players that went between picks #62 and #78, versus the quality of players that would have been available at #79. That trade deserves the B+.

Daniel Thomas is a decent player. I wanted to make that clear. He's not, for instance, a Stevan Ridley...who I didn't like at all as a player. But was Daniel Thomas the 4th best running back in the Draft? No. Was Daniel Thomas a 2nd rounder to me? No. Were there better running backs available? Yes. Were there better players available at other positions, including Mallett? Yes. That is what the grade is based on...using a high caliber resource on a player that is not "the" answer at tailback, when you could easily have players that are nearly as good or even better later in the Draft.
Click to expand...

Couldn't agree more. Now that the draft has played out I look at what we did trading back up into the second round and I wonder if instead of
1. Pouncy 2. Thomas 4. Gates 6. Clay 7. Kearse 7. Wilson

then maybe it would have been better looking like this:

1. Pouncy 3. Gates 4. Powell 5. Yates 6. Clay 7. Locke 7. Kearse 7. Wlison

I just really didn't like giving up that 5th rounder. There were some pretty good players that were left on the board where we would have picked in the 5th. Its pretty obvious this regime wasn't going to draft a QB very high and that they didn't consider a speedy TE as a must have. But I think Yates in the 5th might have been in their wheelhouse perhaps.
 
ckparrothead said:
To get back to something I harped on in my initial post....let's talk about the future/present value of draft picks.

How many of you believe it's perfectly OK to trade a future 1st for a present 2nd...long as you really like the player you end up taking in the 2nd?

Let's pretend that this belief, which seems to be a commonly held one in the NFL...is generally accepted to where a team trying to sell off one of their picks will find no problems getting a pick one round higher in a future year.

So in 2012 you're sitting there with your 7 picks. You decide heck, I'm gonna use my 1st rounder, but sell the rest for future picks. Then in 2013 you're sitting there with all these picks, you use both of your 1st rounders and you say heck, I'm gonna do the same thing again.

By 2018 you will be picking seven players in the 1st round, and will continue to do so every single year so long as other teams continue to be willing to value a present pick as worth a pick a round higher in the future.

Imagine that. Every year, seven 1st rounders.
Click to expand...

Personally I think the only scenario where trading a future 1st for a present 2nd is ok is if you would actually draft the guy from your future 1st position. The thing is, you never know where your future 1st position is going to be. I think what happens is most teams that do this convince themselves that they player is really 1st round talent and they're spending a 1st for him. In reality most of the time the guy was not a first rounder or else he would have already been drafted. In other words, he really didn't meet the original criteria (worthy of your 1st round spot).

I love your hypothetical of trading all but your 1st round pick every year. If you did a good job in free agency the first few years you could probably pull it off because every single year you are adding multiple first rounders to your roster. Assuming you choose the correct 1st rounders every year, you are adding more and more premium talent each year.

One problem is I think the salary cap (if it comes back) impact of having that many first round players would eventually get to you, although if a rookie wage scale is put in place, maybe not.
 
ckparrothead said:
Yes clearly everyone who disagrees with you must be biased. :rolleyes:
Click to expand...

I think you are biased because your obvious disappointment in the FO not proving you right and getting Mallet (who sucks) was mentioned in your post and clouded your judgement. To give Thomas such a low grade is simply ridiculous and I am giving you the benefit of the doubt by saying you are biased instead of questioning if you have any idea what you are talking about.

Thomas is going to be a great back for us. He is not a D- draft pick. No one in the world thinks that but yourself.

I would like to add that I would love bill Cowher to coach here, but your assumption that it is definitely going to happen is also over the top and extremely negative.

The fins traded up to get Thomas ahead of the Packers who were going to take him. Thomas was their guy and they did what they had to do to get him.
 
My father-in-law attended K State, so we watch them often on Saturday afternoons. Thomas seemed to me like a really good college player, who lacked the explosive speed to be a Pro Bowl type RB.

My alma mater is Missouri State, who played K State, so I watched them there as well.

He looked to me like he should have more power for his size honestly. Seemed to run tall. I thought he was pretty instinctual for a guy who was a QB in Juco. Had more wiggle than I expected, and quick feet. In short, he ran like a small guy in a big guys body. Maybe they can teach him to run lower and get behind his pads a little more and make him a stud back, but his skill set didn't seem any better than, say, Bilal Powell's, who went in the 5th I believe.

Like the player, just thought we should have gotten the QB and then tried reading up for the RB instead of the other way around. In a world of supply/demand, if you like two resources, and you can get another resource that will reasonably give the same returns, or at least one less standard deviation of results, and the second resource has no other substitute or alternative that will give you even within that same one standard deviation range of the previous resource, you take the more rare resource every time.

In short, it seemed Mallett was the last QB resource that they liked available, and there were other RB resources they could have gotten even if they couldn't get back into the 3rd for Thomas.

That's just poor resource allocation to me.
 
Rick Gosselin's NFL draft gems


Here are the draft picks viewed by NFL writer Rick Gosselin as the best values in each round:

First round - NICK FAIRLEY, DT, DETROIT: The Lions had a choice between DTs Ndamukong Suh and Gerald McCoy with the second overall pick in 2010. They took Suh. Fairley is better than McCoy, and the Lions got him at 13. A dynamic pass rusher.
Second round - DANIEL THOMAS, HB, MIAMI:
The prototypical big back in this draft at 6-0, 230 pounds, the Dolphins stole Thomas at the end of the round with the 62nd pick. He punished the Big 12 for 1,585 yards and 19 touchdowns last season.

Third round: RYAN MALLETT, QB, NEW ENGLAND: Bill Belichick seems to take a dozen picks into every draft. That quantity allows him to take some chances. NFL teams had character concerns about Mallett — but no one doubted his ability.
Fourth round - LUKE STOCKER, TE, TAMPA BAY:
There were only three three-down tight ends in this draft, and the Bucs traded up to get Stocker, the last one. He has the size (6-5, 258) that will allow Kellen Winslow to operate out of an H-back role.

Fifth round - JEREMY KERLEY, WR, NY JETS: Not only did the Jets land an accomplished slot receiver, Kerley was one of the five best kick returners in this draft. He averaged 27.2 yards on career kickoffs and 13.8 yards on punts.
Sixth round - TYLER SASH, S, NY GIANTS:
 
Now based on Rick Gosselin we did pretty good in the 2nd round in fact I have been surfing the net on the Thomas pick a bit this am and every site approx 6 have him as a 2nd round pick. A couple have 2nd /3rd but all had him in the 2nd. Anyway because Mallett was also there that is what made this pick so controverisal on this site. Now this Rick Gosselin is suppose to be rated the best or almost best of all the draft gurus out there and yes he lists Mallett on his list too. So take it for what it is worth we may have gotten a very good running back while a very good QB "may" have slipped to the 3rd round. IMO rewinding this draft when we did not trade back in the first for whatever reason that was a very large key for our draft not coming out better than it did. We were out of bullets when we needed them and the running back issue would have been solved earlier before we had to trade up into the 2nd round.
 
Wonder if he could have actually gone 8th... obviously a lot of teams were rubbed the wrong way during the process.
 
i just find it hard to believe that these kids don't realize what an opportunity they have and just blow it off like that...ehh...i'll get there when i want...like they don't know that especially at qb the front office is gonna want the guy to be the first one in the building and the last one leaving and you've got millions of dollars on the line in the predraft process and you don't care enough to even show up in the building on your visit on time...

no wonder people were deathly afraid of placing their franchise future in his hands...i can't even count on the kid to show up when he's supposed to...add the drug rumors and the uneasiness in the interview room he evidently gave some people and what you get is a draft day slide..despite the need

and the i'm sick excuse or i didn't get the wake up call the first time maybe the 2nd time...my ***
 
Chris-

I agree 100% we missed out on Mallett. If we could have moved abck into Round 3 and snagged him than we are talking best Dolphins draft since Marino. I think Daniel Thomas is better than your giving him credit for. The Dolphins draft was a solid B and middle of the pack. We didn't wow people like the Lions, Giants, Texans, or Saints and we didn't disappoint like the Seahawks, Chargers, or Redskins.

I see that we left the draft with 2 SOLID players who will start in Pouncey and Thomas and 2 players who bring diversity to a stale offense in Clay and Gates
 
After grading out the drafts pick-by-pick (and with the entirety of the draft in mind), I graded out the AFC East this way:

Bills: B-
Dolphins (in two parts): this regime: D, for the next: B+/A-
Patriots: C-
Jets: A-
 
wilkerson to the jets at #30...meh...i see a guy who has an on again off again motor...inconsistent on tape...guess he was drafted as a 5 tech i can see that but i won't be surprised if he's a pretty average pro...flashes from time to time and disappears a lot

but the ellis pick was quite a big time move if he pans out off the field...thats 1st round physical talent in round 3 imo...i liked the powell pick cause joe mcknight i think sucks and kerley is ok...nothing special

the patriots when they did actually draft players i think outside of the ras i dowling pick which i told people years ago this kids got elite talents but he's got a long injury history and can struggle vs the deep ball i think the pats draft stunk...vereen too high ridley is run of the mill nate solder i think is a bust at tackle just a very ugh draft imo considering all the assets they had

miami i would give a b but we drafted interior oline at #15 and that lack of value for the pick imo drops a full letter grade...c
 
ckparrothead said:
This from the same people who told us Ryan Mallett was out all night after dinner during his Carolina visit, and then called in sick.

Except Carolina themselves validated Mallett's side of the story.

The NFP is turning into the National Inquirer.
Click to expand...


maybe but there's been an awful lot of smoke...and this kid did fall like a stone despite 1st round talents all day long
 
You must log in or register to reply here.
Back
Top Bottom