Here’s the deal... | FinHeaven - Miami Dolphins Forums

Here’s the deal...

MiaFins31

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Let’s start with what we have as far as players with value...

Tua Tagavailoa (Franchise QB or Trade Value)
Myles Gaskins (Starter or Depth)
DeVante Parker (Starter)
Preston Williams (Starter or Depth)
Jaylen Waddle (Starter)
Mike Gesicki (Starter)
Hunter Long (Starter or Depth)
Austin Jackson (Young Depth)
Solomon Kindley (Starter or Depth)
Robert Hunt (Starter)
Liam Eichenberg (Starter)
Christian Wilkins (Starter)
Raekwon Davis (Starter)
Jaelan Phillips (Starter)
Andrew Van Ginkel (Depth and ST)
Jerome Baker (Starter)
Xavier Howard (Starter or Trade Value)
Byron Jones (Starter or Trade Value)
Jevon Holland (Starter)
Jason Sanders (Starter)

The parentheses indicates what they are what they would eventually be or that they bring trade value. Now I’m not saying so and so will be a future superstar or so and so is a bust. I’m simply saying these are the legit NFL players on our roster and they are the most valuable players on our roster. That’s 20/53. That’s less than half of this team that are real NFL caliber guys or have trade value. That’s nowhere near enough for us to compete. Half of those guys (10) are on this list because they’re 1st or 2nd year players so we really don’t know anything yet other than they have the potential which is what gives them value.

Now from what I understand unless we just totally flop and go 1-16/2-15/3-14 Flores almost assuredly will be back. However with any of those records my guys believe Grier would definitely be gone and if we finish with a losing record they still believe Grier would be gone however I want to emphasize that... that is purely speculation and nothing concrete. That’s just what I’ve been told. But Flores has breathing room with Ross bc of the 1st 2 seasons he had. So I’m pretty certain Flores isn’t going anywhere even though I firmly believe he should be gone regardless bc like I said 2 weeks ago he completely lost me going for a tie in OT at LV but that’s for another day.

Grier is on thin ice as we speak. Ross fully expected a playoff team this year and at a minimum we had better been very close. As we all see barring some miracle turnaround that’s not going to be the case. Let’s take a look at the mistakes Grier has made and these are just off the top of my head. Please feel free to add any that I’m missing...

As I’ve stated in other threads we can’t put the Tua selection on him bc as I’ve said that was Ross pulling rank. Other than that....
2020 Draft 3 1st round picks... 1 clear bust in Iggy. It’s teetering on bust for Jackson. All we had to do was move up from 18 to 13 to get Tristan Wirfs who we had rated as the top OL on our draft board but we didn’t want to part with that 3rd rounder that would become Brandon Jones. And Tua we still don’t know 100% for sure even though I’m on the he’s not the guy side of things but nonetheless we don’t know that 100% for sure. When I say we I’m referring to the “football people” in the FO. He will have the rest of this season to show it or not. So if Tua fails that’s 3 complete misses with those 3 1st rounders from 2020. Even though as I said we can’t put Tua on Grier but still it counts somewhat.

The decision in 2019 to send a 2nd and 5th for Josh Rosen. Another complete failure as he lasted 1 year.

Completely ignoring the OL in FA basically the last 2 offseasons as we haven’t signed a guy out of FA that has solidified a starting spot on the OL.

Signing Kyle Van Noy who lasted 1 year. Signing Shaw Lawson who lasted 1 season. I’d say it’s fair to say Byron Jones hasn’t lived up to being worth the highest paid CB in the game bc that’s what they made him at the time and that’s an understatement. Ereck Flowers who lasted 1 year. Ted Karras lasted 1 year. Jordan Howard didn’t even last half a season. All money wasted.

Trading a 4th rounder for Lynn Bowden who’s spending the season on IR and has done nothing. Another deal with no return on investment.

Even though it was a conditional 7th rounder he still made a deal for Isaiah Wilson who didn’t last even a week.

Trading for Bernardrick McKinney who couldn’t even make the final roster cuts.

Outsmarting himself by moving from #3 to #12 and back up to #6 while giving away our own 1st rounder next year to Philly which is looking more likely by the week to be a top 10 pick and maybe even top 5. This is the one that’s just unforgivable to me personally. I knew it was a bad deal when we did it and stated so.

This one goes hand in hand with the paragraph above but trading what’s more than likely going to amount to 2 top 10 picks for a slot WR in Jaylen Waddle is another huge mistake. As JaMarr Chase is showing he was the guy to select at #3. I like Waddle and think he’s going to be very good but he’s getting to where he’s dropping multiple balls every week now. While Chase is putting up 100 yard games with TDs. I wanted Chase and said it over and over here so this isn’t hindsight. We could have stayed at #3 selected Chase and even though we wouldn’t know how to use we would own our 1st rounder for next year which is almost certainly going to be more valuable than SFs 2 #1s combined. We could have even selected Penei Sewell at #3 and I’d still feel a lot better. Some around the league even think that’s what we should have done.

After deciding not to give up a 3rd rounder to move up for Tristan Wirfs in 2020 he decides he won’t let it happen again so he decides to give up a 3rd rounder to move up in the 2nd round for Liam Eichenberg. I like Eichenberg but he’s not Tristan Wirfs. So let’s get this straight. Grier wouldn’t give up a 3rd to move up in the 1st round for the top rated OL on his draft board in Wirfs. But he’s willing to give up a 3rd to move up in the 2nd round for Eichenberg who they like but definitely didn’t have rated as the top OL on the draft board. Another head scratching move.

He’s completely avoided selecting any running back with all these picks the past 2 drafts. Even though Gaskins is starting to really show it now why not select at least 1 tailback in the 1st 3 rounds in the past 2 drafts to compliment him? Another mistake added to the list.

This past year in FA Corey Linsley was willing to visit us and hear an offer. Grier didn’t even pick up the phone and call him. He didn’t even try. So Linsley went to LA to protect Justin Herbert and you see the improvement in LAs OL? Amazing what the best Center in football can do for an OL.

Spent 10 million on Will Fuller who everybody in the league knows is always going to miss games because of injuries. He’s played what 1 game our of the first 5 for us so far? Another terrible decision.

Mike Gesicki is a top 10 TE in football and probably has been our most productive player over the past couple seasons and does he extend him? Nope and probably won’t.

Yet we extend Jakeem Grant who is now traded for a measles 6th rounder. We extend Jerome Baker and even though it’s not a terrible deal money wise for a starting LB Baker is rather average and was about as bad today against TB as I’ve seen him. More head scratching decisions.

All these decisions have been huge mistakes. How can any GM of an NFL franchise survive all these mistakes? I mean everybody is going to make mistakes it happens. But all of these compounded one on top of another? It’s just unbelievable.

I’m on the train of both Grier and Flores along with the entire staff and FO should be gone after this flop of a year and we just start over. The thing is we don’t have to start from scratch like we did when we started this present regime. We have some talent on this team. I fully believe that. We have a very young team but we need a coaching staff that’s going to teach coach and develop these young guys and get them to reach their potentials. A new staff would bring new energy. We need a proven head coach and GM that get hired together as a team and not forced on each other. We need them to have a plan of what we want to be offensively and defensively. We need a staff that’s going to continue to build around the pieces we have now. We still have draft picks coming up and we have money to spend in FA. We need a new staff to bring in some veterans to teach these young guys the NFL way and how to practice how to workout how to treat their bodies nutritionally. We need to do it after this season while we have ammo still in the reserve.
 

Regulus

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What do your sources say about Flores and the players? Is he difficult to deal with like the rumors keep saying?
 

EasyRider

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Let’s start with what we have as far as players with value...

Tua Tagavailoa (Franchise QB or Trade Value)
Myles Gaskins (Starter or Depth)
DeVante Parker (Starter)
Preston Williams (Starter or Depth)
Jaylen Waddle (Starter)
Mike Gesicki (Starter)
Hunter Long (Starter or Depth)
Austin Jackson (Young Depth)
Solomon Kindley (Starter or Depth)
Robert Hunt (Starter)
Liam Eichenberg (Starter)
Christian Wilkins (Starter)
Raekwon Davis (Starter)
Jaelan Phillips (Starter)
Andrew Van Ginkel (Depth and ST)
Jerome Baker (Starter)
Xavier Howard (Starter or Trade Value)
Byron Jones (Starter or Trade Value)
Jevon Holland (Starter)
Jason Sanders (Starter)

The parentheses indicates what they are what they would eventually be or that they bring trade value. Now I’m not saying so and so will be a future superstar or so and so is a bust. I’m simply saying these are the legit NFL players on our roster and they are the most valuable players on our roster. That’s 20/53. That’s less than half of this team that are real NFL caliber guys or have trade value. That’s nowhere near enough for us to compete. Half of those guys (10) are on this list because they’re 1st or 2nd year players so we really don’t know anything yet other than they have the potential which is what gives them value.

Now from what I understand unless we just totally flop and go 1-16/2-15/3-14 Flores almost assuredly will be back. However with any of those records my guys believe Grier would definitely be gone and if we finish with a losing record they still believe Grier would be gone however I want to emphasize that... that is purely speculation and nothing concrete. That’s just what I’ve been told. But Flores has breathing room with Ross bc of the 1st 2 seasons he had. So I’m pretty certain Flores isn’t going anywhere even though I firmly believe he should be gone regardless bc like I said 2 weeks ago he completely lost me going for a tie in OT at LV but that’s for another day.

Grier is on thin ice as we speak. Ross fully expected a playoff team this year and at a minimum we had better been very close. As we all see barring some miracle turnaround that’s not going to be the case. Let’s take a look at the mistakes Grier has made and these are just off the top of my head. Please feel free to add any that I’m missing...

As I’ve stated in other threads we can’t put the Tua selection on him bc as I’ve said that was Ross pulling rank. Other than that....
2020 Draft 3 1st round picks... 1 clear bust in Iggy. It’s teetering on bust for Jackson. All we had to do was move up from 18 to 13 to get Tristan Wirfs who we had rated as the top OL on our draft board but we didn’t want to part with that 3rd rounder that would become Brandon Jones. And Tua we still don’t know 100% for sure even though I’m on the he’s not the guy side of things but nonetheless we don’t know that 100% for sure. When I say we I’m referring to the “football people” in the FO. He will have the rest of this season to show it or not. So if Tua fails that’s 3 complete misses with those 3 1st rounders from 2020. Even though as I said we can’t put Tua on Grier but still it counts somewhat.

The decision in 2019 to send a 2nd and 5th for Josh Rosen. Another complete failure as he lasted 1 year.

Completely ignoring the OL in FA basically the last 2 offseasons as we haven’t signed a guy out of FA that has solidified a starting spot on the OL.

Signing Kyle Van Noy who lasted 1 year. Signing Shaw Lawson who lasted 1 season. I’d say it’s fair to say Byron Jones hasn’t lived up to being worth the highest paid CB in the game bc that’s what they made him at the time and that’s an understatement. Ereck Flowers who lasted 1 year. Ted Karras lasted 1 year. Jordan Howard didn’t even last half a season. All money wasted.

Trading a 4th rounder for Lynn Bowden who’s spending the season on IR and has done nothing. Another deal with no return on investment.

Even though it was a conditional 7th rounder he still made a deal for Isaiah Wilson who didn’t last even a week.

Trading for Bernardrick McKinney who couldn’t even make the final roster cuts.

Outsmarting himself by moving from #3 to #12 and back up to #6 while giving away our own 1st rounder next year to Philly which is looking more likely by the week to be a top 10 pick and maybe even top 5. This is the one that’s just unforgivable to me personally. I knew it was a bad deal when we did it and stated so.

This one goes hand in hand with the paragraph above but trading what’s more than likely going to amount to 2 top 10 picks for a slot WR in Jaylen Waddle is another huge mistake. As JaMarr Chase is showing he was the guy to select at #3. I like Waddle and think he’s going to be very good but he’s getting to where he’s dropping multiple balls every week now. While Chase is putting up 100 yard games with TDs. I wanted Chase and said it over and over here so this isn’t hindsight. We could have stayed at #3 selected Chase and even though we wouldn’t know how to use we would own our 1st rounder for next year which is almost certainly going to be more valuable than SFs 2 #1s combined. We could have even selected Penei Sewell at #3 and I’d still feel a lot better. Some around the league even think that’s what we should have done.

After deciding not to give up a 3rd rounder to move up for Tristan Wirfs in 2020 he decides he won’t let it happen again so he decides to give up a 3rd rounder to move up in the 2nd round for Liam Eichenberg. I like Eichenberg but he’s not Tristan Wirfs. So let’s get this straight. Grier wouldn’t give up a 3rd to move up in the 1st round for the top rated OL on his draft board in Wirfs. But he’s willing to give up a 3rd to move up in the 2nd round for Eichenberg who they like but definitely didn’t have rated as the top OL on the draft board. Another head scratching move.

He’s completely avoided selecting any running back with all these picks the past 2 drafts. Even though Gaskins is starting to really show it now why not select at least 1 tailback in the 1st 3 rounds in the past 2 drafts to compliment him? Another mistake added to the list.

This past year in FA Corey Linsley was willing to visit us and hear an offer. Grier didn’t even pick up the phone and call him. He didn’t even try. So Linsley went to LA to protect Justin Herbert and you see the improvement in LAs OL? Amazing what the best Center in football can do for an OL.

Spent 10 million on Will Fuller who everybody in the league knows is always going to miss games because of injuries. He’s played what 1 game our of the first 5 for us so far? Another terrible decision.

Mike Gesicki is a top 10 TE in football and probably has been our most productive player over the past couple seasons and does he extend him? Nope and probably won’t.

Yet we extend Jakeem Grant who is now traded for a measles 6th rounder. We extend Jerome Baker and even though it’s not a terrible deal money wise for a starting LB Baker is rather average and was about as bad today against TB as I’ve seen him. More head scratching decisions.

All these decisions have been huge mistakes. How can any GM of an NFL franchise survive all these mistakes? I mean everybody is going to make mistakes it happens. But all of these compounded one on top of another? It’s just unbelievable.

I’m on the train of both Grier and Flores along with the entire staff and FO should be gone after this flop of a year and we just start over. The thing is we don’t have to start from scratch like we did when we started this present regime. We have some talent on this team. I fully believe that. We have a very young team but we need a coaching staff that’s going to teach coach and develop these young guys and get them to reach their potentials. A new staff would bring new energy. We need a proven head coach and GM that get hired together as a team and not forced on each other. We need them to have a plan of what we want to be offensively and defensively. We need a staff that’s going to continue to build around the pieces we have now. We still have draft picks coming up and we have money to spend in FA. We need a new staff to bring in some veterans to teach these young guys the NFL way and how to practice how to workout how to treat their bodies nutritionally. We need to do it after this season while we have ammo still in the reserve.
Do you have a readers digest version of this?
 

MiaFins31

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What do your sources say about Flores and the players? Is he difficult to deal with like the rumors keep saying?
I’ve said it in a couple other threads but yes he’s very difficult to deal with. He’s more like Belichick than any of Belichicks other assistants. He thinks he’s smarter than everyone else and he’s stuck up. He’s not the type of the guy to shoulder blame it’s always somebody else fault. It’s why he’s always preaching lack of execution in post game pressers which is a way of saying it’s the players not me.
 

Phantom

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Cliff notes?

As far as that list of players, what you have there is a poor team.
 

dadecounty

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What I don’t get is how did Grier ignore Chase’s combine. Dude was a freak.
 

bane

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So what can we hope for as best case situation for the rest of season? Has team quit? Can Flores change? What should we be focused on because playoffs are not it
 

bane

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Btw thanks for insight. You know someone who works for team?
 

joenhre

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Ross would be a complete moron to fire Grier but allow Flores a free pass. If you are going to change then make a clean sweep. Hire a football Czar and let that person hire the new GM and head coach. Why saddle a new GM with Flores?
 
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