AggieFin21
The 12th Man
Schleprock said:
Dude, you just totally lost the debate by making it personal. No need for it what so ever....
I'll take Vince Young
- Thread starter West-Fin_Fan
- Start date
Dude, you just totally lost the debate by making it personal. No need for it what so ever....
saves said:
And this is why I am stopping the conversation. You either aren't reading my posts, aren't intelligent enough to understand them, are too blinded by BG orange, or just want to argue. Considering he hasn't played in the pro's yet that leaves that chance of evidence out...HOWEVER...I have stated about 1 million times so far in this thread my point why he won't be a good pro...he has all the same PHYSICAL and ENVIRONMENTAL conditions that other good college, bad pro players have had. How am I suppose to get anymore clear than that in my point????? What exactly do I need to say or do to show why I think he will not be that good besides cite countless players who were just like him????? Sure, he could pan out...just like the New orleans Saints could win the Super Bowl this year, some hardship teams have had successful seasons but the chances aren't in their favor.
Look at almost every solid quarterback and you'll see one who came from a well rounded school, offensively.
Schleprock said:
Alright, you've given me names of good college players who have given you flops, and I've have given you numbers and statistics. My agrument to you is he is NOT just like them. He compares much more favorably to the other highly touted MAC QB's who you have discounted. When you give me some type of FACT maybe that will be a valid argument, I really can't sit here and get the statistics of ever player you named and compare them because quite frankly I don't have the time, but I did get you stats that showed that last year the school did have around 1500 yards on the ground and about 20 rushing TD's, yet somehow their offense isn't quite balanced enough for you. But sorry, I'm probably just not intelligent enough to have a conversation with you, your argumentative skills are just blowing me out of the water.
Yeah, a personal note always makes one lose a debate based on facts of unrelated thingsAggieFin21 said:
especially when my point on his age WOULD effect the debate...and I was correct A person younger then 20yrs...unless they were a football guru in their 7-10 yer old timeframe, would have no idea who half those players I mentioned were. Also, I apologize, but it is not my fault that people online hide their age and then pull the "I'm more mature card".Thank you Byroan for calling it how you saw it.
Please give me a list of Qbs...even outside the MAC....who have had a college career like Jacobs and turned into the type of pro you and others are making of Jacobs.saves said:
Big Ben and Rivers don't count; haven't played more than one season if that.
Leftwich don't count: people are still questioning him, especially with Garrards play.
Pennington don't count: shows ability btu can't put together 1 full solid season.
Show me a good list and I will reserve my opinion on Jacobs..
not saying you did...but it is standard practice by many young folks onlinesaves said:
Schleprock said:
Okay I guess since the 3 recent quarterbacks that compare favorably with Jacobs and his current situation, and are franchise quarterbacks of their respective teams do not count you've really backed me into a corner. BTW Rivers isn't from the MAC.
And I have never said once he will be a superstar in the pros, I think he is a fine prospect and the fact that you are already calling him a bust is outrageous.
ckparrothead
Premium Member
Alright I don't want to say anything about Vince Young until I get to see him on game tape. But I HAVE seen Kyle Wright now, and I HAVE seen Omar Jacobs. And, of course, I've seen Leinart.
Jacobs has the most physical tools of the three, and is probably the most accurate passer of them to boot. Leinart is the best game manager, as would be expected coming from such a winning program. Kyle Wright is as green as a leaf in spring time.
His "problem" was not that his offensive line was letting blitzers through. On at least 5 of the 9 sacks, Wright took a coverage sack when he SHOULD have gotten rid of the ball. That's his "problem" right now, is he's basically a YOUNG quarterback who doesn't know how to get rid of the ball. This was his first college start, so nobody should expect him to already be hearing that clock in his head yet telling him when he should have the ball thrown by.
What he DOES have, is tools that are almost as good as Jacobs, however. He needs some serious bulk, and that will take away from his 40 speed (which right now at 4.58 is fast enough to outrun some of the best linebackers in the business). He's got an arm, although he needs to develop consistency in the strength of his throws. He needs to develop better footwork, to prevent overthrows. Scouts will love him as the prototypical new age NFL passer that can throw well and has great mechanics, and can run well. They'll talk up his over the top throwing motion over Jacobs 3/4 sling.
But Jacobs will be the best of them all, if you ask me. He's got more physical tools at his disposal than any QB I have seen in college football, and most guys I have seen in the pros. Leinart will always need more help to get great production than IMO Jacobs will need. People talk about Jacobs throwing motion but Dan Marino would look at that throwing motion and just say "He's got a quick release and doesn't waste any motion, gets great velocity on the ball and throws an ultra-tight spiral with good accuracy. What's the problem?" His throwing motion questions are nowhere near the questions about Phil Rivers, because Rivers' throwing motion is arguably affecting his velocity and spirals, while probably helping his accuracy.
Omar Jacobs...PERFECT for Miami's deep passing attack too.
Jacobs has the most physical tools of the three, and is probably the most accurate passer of them to boot. Leinart is the best game manager, as would be expected coming from such a winning program. Kyle Wright is as green as a leaf in spring time.
His "problem" was not that his offensive line was letting blitzers through. On at least 5 of the 9 sacks, Wright took a coverage sack when he SHOULD have gotten rid of the ball. That's his "problem" right now, is he's basically a YOUNG quarterback who doesn't know how to get rid of the ball. This was his first college start, so nobody should expect him to already be hearing that clock in his head yet telling him when he should have the ball thrown by.
What he DOES have, is tools that are almost as good as Jacobs, however. He needs some serious bulk, and that will take away from his 40 speed (which right now at 4.58 is fast enough to outrun some of the best linebackers in the business). He's got an arm, although he needs to develop consistency in the strength of his throws. He needs to develop better footwork, to prevent overthrows. Scouts will love him as the prototypical new age NFL passer that can throw well and has great mechanics, and can run well. They'll talk up his over the top throwing motion over Jacobs 3/4 sling.
But Jacobs will be the best of them all, if you ask me. He's got more physical tools at his disposal than any QB I have seen in college football, and most guys I have seen in the pros. Leinart will always need more help to get great production than IMO Jacobs will need. People talk about Jacobs throwing motion but Dan Marino would look at that throwing motion and just say "He's got a quick release and doesn't waste any motion, gets great velocity on the ball and throws an ultra-tight spiral with good accuracy. What's the problem?" His throwing motion questions are nowhere near the questions about Phil Rivers, because Rivers' throwing motion is arguably affecting his velocity and spirals, while probably helping his accuracy.
Omar Jacobs...PERFECT for Miami's deep passing attack too.
I have the right to show while he'll be a bust just as much as those who are touting him. However, on this board and many others if you don't follow the masses you are supposedly "wrong". Examples are shown here in this thread, AJ Feeley threads where he should have been given "more time" or is better than Gus, Kay jay Harris threads where he has done nothing but "is still a great back and definitely needs to be on our PS", past Ricky Williams threads where people said he was such a X person/player, and even Fred Russell threads last year.saves said:
ckparrothead
Premium Member
Schleprock said:
LOL. Show me one good example. But not this guy, this guy, this guy, or this guy. Or this guy. Or that one. A good example aside from these guys over here in general, this general area over here, anyone but this group...
Have you ever thought of trying out for a comedy troupe?
ckparrothead
Premium Member
Schleprock said:
BTW there are plenty of QBs that came from shotgun offenses that did well in professional football. It is not viewed as an overly big hurdle. I suppose I'm not allowed to name Steve McNair either, though, for some reason or other lol.
Schleprock said:
But the problem is, you havn't showed why he will be a bust. You've just listed players you think compare to him that have been busts, while asking me to list players that compare to him but not letting me say the obvious, sucessful ones. I don't get it.
ckparrothead said:
Oh yeah, ckparrothead is here to flame up an argument again?
I stated why those Qbs don't count out of all the QBs in history you are allowed to name, and the reasons are validated. Go ahead and name Pennington and Leftwich if you want, but they aren't valid considering they haven't really put much together.
show me your list then: