Is it time to start asking what's up with Dion Jordan?

[roy_miami]

I remember the argument "you can never have too many LB'ers/DE's when we had very big holes elesewhere. Trade this clown for something now before word gets out.

I still think there is some truth to it. How do you know that Vernon didn't push himself to go that extra mile because we drafted Jordan? There is some merit to the philosophy of trying to create one elite unit rather than a bunch of mediocre units. A bunch of good WRs (or DEs) could push each other from good to the realm of elite through competition for playing time. And if you have an elite group of WRs that might mask the issues you have at RB or o-line.

It looks to me like we want to stack the playmaking positions of WR, CB and DE with the hopes that if those positions are elite the weaker positions won't matter so much. I won't be shocked at all if we take a WR or CB in the first next year even if we appear to be loaded at those positions.

 

[datruth55]

Don't forget Keenan Allen who had a 1,000 yard season at WR for the Chargers.

Yep, he was a 3rd round pick. Kiko Alonso is another guy but he's hurt. Terron Armstead who was taken right before Keenan Allen and is now starting at LT I think for the Saints (he would have been a really good fit for us).

 

[Zounds]

There were elite players in 2013...they just weren't taken in top 10. Too early to say either way. I agree that 2013 was a weak draft all the way around but I can think of 5 guys who could have big seasons...Ziggy Ansah who was taken 5th had 8 sacks last year for Detroit, Star Lotulelei was a big reason the Carolina Panthers had one of the top rush defenses in the league last year, Tyler Eifert was a nice weapon for Cincy last year, Cordarrelle Patterson made some huge plays for Minnesota last year mostly in the return game but I think this year he could be a major impact in the passing game and Gio Bernard made some huge plays for Cincy last year...heck he almost killed us single handedly.

There will no doubt be some prospects that develop into great players from the 2013 draft, but I'd still argue there were no elite prospects coming out of college. There was no Andre Luck, Jadevon Clowney, or big playmaker type of prospect that normally goes in the top 5. I mean, there were two OGs drafted in the top 10 that year, and three OTs....for a total of 5 OL drafted in the top 10 that year, and only 1 skill position player drafter top 10. It was just a bad year to be drafting top 10, and probably one of the worst drafts I've seen since I started following drafts....but that's still no excuse for Dion Jordan or any other player.

 

[RobertHorry]

The issue is that Dion Jordan is an athlete, not a football player. He needs to be maximized as a stand-up LB who can go downfield or cover Tight Ends.

 

[Zounds]

Don't forget Keenan Allen who had a 1,000 yard season at WR for the Chargers.

Yes there are some good players in that draft, but I'm talking about the top 10 prospects that we normally see in drafts.

 

[datruth55]

The issue is that Dion Jordan is an athlete, not a football player. He needs to be maximized as a stand-up LB who can go downfield or cover Tight Ends.

If maximizing him is standing him up to cover tight ends then he was woefully over drafted. You don't take a player #3 overall just so he can drop back in coverage on tight ends....complete freakin waste.

 

[roy_miami]

If Jordan was in this past years draft I think there is a decent chance he makes it to our pick at 19.

 

[johngarryvo]

he's out-of-position imo.. he's a Jack/Joker not a DE.. he should play predominantly standing up, all over the midfield, and sometimes have his hand down

 

[datruth55]

There will no doubt be some prospects that develop into great players from the 2013 draft, but I'd still argue there were no elite prospects coming out of college. There was no Andre Luck, Jadevon Clowney, or big playmaker type of prospect that normally goes in the top 5. I mean, there were two OGs drafted in the top 10 that year, and three OTs....for a total of 5 OL drafted in the top 10 that year, and only 1 skill position player drafter top 10. It was just a bad year to be drafting top 10, and probably one of the worst drafts I've seen since I started following drafts....but that's still no excuse for Dion Jordan or any other player.

There were a lot of people who tried to compare Jordan with Clowney on this website. Wonder what they think now.

 

[dlockz]

There were a lot of people who tried to compare Jordan with Clowney on this website. Wonder what they think now.

Jordan is not in same class as Clowney not even close

 

[jim1]

If maximizing him is standing him up to cover tight ends then he was woefully over drafted. You don't take a player #3 overall just so he can drop back in coverage on tight ends....complete freakin waste.

I disagree, provided the same guy can get to the QB in a flash on a blitz- what price do you put on the coverage disguises that flexibility will allow? If an OLB can cover like a demon and get to the QB in a hurry and defend the run, he's very valuable. That's the other part of the equation- Jordan defending the run standing up at OLB is much better than him defending the run from DE with his hand in the dirt and a massive OL immediately in his face. And the teams' solution was to bulk him up, no the elite speed and coverage ability are diminished and he's still not a particularly good DE. At this point I actually feel sorry for JOrdan as to how he's been mismanaged and I resent the FO and coaching staff for doing it. What a freaking waste.

---------- Post added at 01:30 PM ---------- Previous post was at 01:29 PM ----------

There were a lot of people who tried to compare Jordan with Clowney on this website. Wonder what they think now.

Clowney is way more physical, no getting around that- he'd thrive at DE or 3/4 OLB.

 

[datruth55]

I disagree, provided the same guy can get to the QB in a flash on a blitz- what price do you put on the coverage disguises that flexibility will allow. If an OLB can cover like a demon and get to the QB in a hurry and defend the run, he's very valuable. That's the other part of the equation- Jordan defending the run standing up at OLB is much better than him defending the run from DE with his hand in the dirt and a massive OL immediately in his face. And the teams' solution was to bulk him up, no the elite speed and coverage ability are diminished and he's still not a particularly good DE. At this point I actually feel sorry for JOrdan as to how he's been mismanaged and I resent the FO and coaching staff for doing it. What a freaking waste.

---------- Post added at 01:30 PM ---------- Previous post was at 01:29 PM ----------



Clowney is way more physical, no getting around that- he's thrive at DE or 3/4 OLB.

I can tell you right now the Chris McCain can drop back in coverage and cover tight ends the same way Jordan could and he comes with a much smaller price tag. Go look up McCain 2012 Cal highlight tape and tell me Cal didn't have him doing everything Oregon had Jordan doing and more. Jordan's spot is DE, they've asked him to focus on one position and the only thing he focused on was gaining weight. He didn't get with Jason Taylor to discuss technique, he's obviously not worked on any pass rushing moves, his stamina looks shakey and in an effort to use PEDs for quick weight gain he's lost some explosion.

If his best position is OLB then trade him to the Eagles, keep Fede (who has shown more flash than Jordan did as a rookie) at DE as his replacement and use McCain as your nickel LB in games where we need someone in the slot to cover TEs...and save yourself the money...and get a draft pick back.

And Clowney is more physical, more explosive, strong at the point of attack, a better tackler...just a better player but some people looked at stats and said Clowney and Jordan were the same player. Funny.

 

[Zounds]

There were a lot of people who tried to compare Jordan with Clowney on this website. Wonder what they think now.

Well I was definitely not one of them. There was nobody worth trading up for in that draft imo.

 

[gregorygrant83]

Jordan has done a better job setting the edge against the run this year. He's played what would amount to a little less than one full game. He has a sack and forced fumble, I'm not saying he looks like an all-pro, but he hasn't played as poorly as a lot of people believe. Can someone show me a play where he was dominated at the point of attack, missed an assignment or blown a tackle?

 

[datruth55]

Jordan has done a better job setting the edge against the run this year. He's played what would amount to a little less than one full game. He has a sack and forced fumble, I'm not saying he looks like an all-pro, but he hasn't played as poorly as a lot of people believe. Can someone show me a play where he was dominated at the point of attack, missed an assignment or blown a tackle?

Pretty sure that sack came against the 3rd string OT for the Bucs.