Jonathan Martin - Decent Cornfed

[ATL_PHIN_FAN]

So here we are arguing if Martin sucks, or if he's just "below average", or even "decent". I havent seen anyone says he's played well. No matter which side of the fence you sit on, the LT is clearly a position that needs to be upgraded on the offense. If I had to target a few positions on this team as weak links, LT is one of them. In 2014 draft of free agency, I would bet money we address this position.

Wouldn't you care to have at least one season of Martin's development at the LT position BEFORE you make that bet? After all, OC Sherman says he will be a fine to great lineman in this league. Given Sherman's resume, I think the guy's got a real shot at becoming better than average at LT.

 

[Zounds]

Wouldn't you care to have at least one season of Martin's development at the LT position BEFORE you make that bet?

I did wait one season. He had a bad first year. If this guy doesn't make a big improvement this year then you would be a fool not attempt to upgrade the position.

 

[ATL_PHIN_FAN]

Starting as a second round rookie at RT and then LT is not a "bad" year for any lineman. Yes, you could say that reflects how poor our line was last year. But, I think there's more to it than that. Both Philbin and Sherman are watching the situation closely, I'm sure. As WVD says, there were many opportunities this off season to get further insurance at LT. If the situation were as critical as all that, I believe we would have taken one of those opportunities. My suggestion is that we all have a little faith in our staff to make the right call when the time comes. It doesn't appear they believe that time is at hand yet.

 

[dlockz]

Starting as a second round rookie at RT and then LT is not a "bad" year for any lineman. Yes, you could say that reflects how poor our line was last year. But, I think there's more to it than that. Both Philbin and Sherman are watching the situation closely, I'm sure. As WVD says, there were many opportunities this off season to get further insurance at LT. If the situation were as critical as all that, I believe we would have taken one of those opportunities. My suggestion is that we all have a little faith in our staff to make the right call when the time comes. It doesn't appear they believe that time is at hand yet.

outside of our attempted trade for albert not much u could
do to improve lt based on what was put there

 

[CMD]

Spot on as always WV. While the Rams are busy dumping all their money on LT(even though they made up for it with the Austin/Bailey draft) we were able to save that money and use it on signing Brent Grimes, who has been a bright spot in our secondary all of camp. And we re-signed Reshad Jones who has the potential to be one of the best safeties in the league.

If you ask me, I'd think signing a veteran CB who's been our best DB in camp and re-signing a Safety with a lot of potenital, is certainly better than signing an injury prone, declining LT who already set our franchise back since 2008.

 

[NCFINFAN13]

I think JM can be decent. Maybe better than decent at some point. But right now, he's underperforming in pass protection, and I'm sorry, but that's a problem --- at least for right now. An underperforming LC, causes all kinds of problems with your offense, not the least of which is the anxiousness it creates in a young, developing QB.

And that's where we're at. I trust that Philbin & co made the right decision with Wrong, in fact I supported it then and I support it now, but if we're going to be honest, then we have to take into account that Philbin & co were actively and overtly searching for a LC in the off season, and that indicates that while they're hopeful that JM will develop into the LC they think he can be, (I said it then and I say it now) ... they're not convinced.

Throw in not having anyone even close to decent behind him, and I don't think it's unreasonable for people to be concerned at this stage. Three or four weeks from now this might not be an issue, but for right now? Yes it is IMHO.

 

[CMD]

I think JM can be decent. Maybe better than decent at some point. But right now, he's underperforming in pass protection, and I'm sorry, but that's a problem --- at least for right now. An underperforming LC, causes all kinds of problems with your offense, not the least of which is the anxiousness it creates in a young, developing QB.

And that's where we're at. I trust that Philbin & co made the right decision with Wrong, in fact I supported it then and I support it now, but if we're going to be honest, then we have to take into account that Philbin & co were actively and overtly searching for a LC in the off season, and that indicates that while they're hopeful that JM will develop into the LC they think he can be, (I said it then and I say it now) ... they're not convinced.

Throw in not having anyone even close to decent behind him, and I don't think it's unreasonable for people to be concerned at this stage. Three or four weeks from now this might not be an issue, but for right now? Yes it is IMHO.

I don't remember them actively looking for a LC, I know they tried to re-sign Jake and offered a 3rd for Albert, but I don't remember them actively looking for one. Even if they would've signed a LC though, they would've still had Martin at RC, so that tells me they believe in him, but a little more experience wouldn't hurt before the switch to LC.

Once they realized they weren't getting Jake back, and the Chiefs wanted our first 2nd for a damn LC they were full steam ahead on moving Martin to LC, it's going to take time with him, but the sooner he starts at LC the better IMO.

 

[CANDolphan]

Oh my god.

Lol.

LEFT CORNFED. Jake WRONG. COMEDY GOLD! Hilarious.

 

[realdolphin]

I prefer a 1st round QB and a 2nd Round LT = Tannehill/Martin than a 2nd round QB and 1st round LT = Henne/Long . QB is a lot more important than LT !!!!!!

 

[X-Pacolypse]

A couple of things. First, Jake Long sucks. Second, fantastic write up WV! I think it may have been one of your best to date. Finally, need I remind you folks that the Steelers not so long ago won a Super Bowl with Max Starks as their LT, and I would hardly call him "decent." The days of needing an elite LT are long gone, you can get by with average play at the position now.

 

[Zounds]

A couple of things. First, Jake Long sucks. Second, fantastic write up WV! I think it may have been one of your best to date. Finally, need I remind you folks that the Steelers not so long ago won a Super Bowl with Max Starks as their LT, and I would hardly call him "decent." The days of needing an elite LT are long gone, you can get by with average play at the position now.

Never really understood that argument. If the Ravens won a Super Bowl with Trent Dilfer, maybe we should get a QB like that? Just because a team wins a Super Bowl with a big deficiency in personnel doesn't mean we should model our team after them.

And about Max Starks, all you have to do is look up how many times Roethlisberger has been injured from taking a sack. Lets see....a concussion, a knee, a shoulder...and I'm pretty sure the Steeler's playoff hopes were crushed when Tamba Hali destroyed Roethlisberger's shoulder late in the season on MNF last year. They went on to finish 2-5 and miss the playoffs because of Roethlisberger was knocked out for a month....because Max Starks cant block. Its no coincidence either that the Steelers have spent several high draft picks on OTs in recent years.

Lets not fool ourselves into thinking LT doesn't matter.

 

[dlockz]

Never really understood that argument. If the Ravens won a Super Bowl with Trent Dilfer, maybe we should get a QB like that? Just because a team wins a Super Bowl with a big deficiency in personnel doesn't mean we should model our team after them.

And about Max Starks, all you have to do is look up how many times Roethlisberger has been injured from taking a sack. Lets see....a concussion, a knee, a shoulder...and I'm pretty sure the Steeler's playoff hopes were crushed when Tamba Hali destroyed Roethlisberger's shoulder late in the season on MNF last year. They went on to finish 2-5 and miss the playoffs because of Roethlisberger was knocked out for a month....because Max Starks cant block. Its no coincidence either that the Steelers have spent several high draft picks on OTs in recent years.

Lets not fool ourselves into thinking LT doesn't matter.

I think people mistake having misplaced priorities like LT over qb with it doesn't matter. Every position on field matters

 

[WVDolphan]

Never really understood that argument. If the Ravens won a Super Bowl with Trent Dilfer, maybe we should get a QB like that? Just because a team wins a Super Bowl with a big deficiency in personnel doesn't mean we should model our team after them.

And about Max Starks, all you have to do is look up how many times Roethlisberger has been injured from taking a sack. Lets see....a concussion, a knee, a shoulder...and I'm pretty sure the Steeler's playoff hopes were crushed when Tamba Hali destroyed Roethlisberger's shoulder late in the season on MNF last year. They went on to finish 2-5 and miss the playoffs because of Roethlisberger was knocked out for a month....because Max Starks cant block. Its no coincidence either that the Steelers have spent several high draft picks on OTs in recent years.

Lets not fool ourselves into thinking LT doesn't matter.

Roethlisberger is notorious for holding the ball way too long. He also dosent move that well for a QB. He likes to use his huge frame to shed defenders. People under estimate his ability to move around back there, but he isnt going to scramble on you. He extends plays really well because of the fact he is so tough to get on the ground and he moves OK for a big man.

A lot of the biggest plays he makes are when he holds the ball way longer than he should. On the other hand a lot of the big plays the defense makes, the big hits he takes, and the injuries that result are when he holds the ball way longer than he should.

 

[Zounds]

Roethlisberger is notorious for holding the ball way too long. He also dosent move that well for a QB. He likes to use his huge frame to shed defenders. People under estimate his ability to move around back there, but he isnt going to scramble on you. He extends plays really well because of the fact he is so tough to get on the ground and he moves OK for a big man.

A lot of the biggest plays he makes are when he holds the ball way longer than he should. On the other hand a lot of the big plays the defense makes, the big hits he takes, and the injuries that result are when he holds the ball way longer than he should.

I agree with all of that, but it doesn't excuse poor blocking from the LT. The shoulder injury to Roethlisberger that sidelined him for a month wasn't a result of your example however. Its was just piss poor blocking by both OTs, and Roethlisberger was sandwiched and was injured for a month. Steelers were 6-3 up to that point, but missed the playoffs because Roethlisberger was out with an injury imo. LT does matter. I wont excuse the 40 pressures Martin gave up last year because a few other teams were successful with scrubs at LT.

 

[ATL_PHIN_FAN]

I agree with all of that, but it doesn't excuse poor blocking from the LT. The shoulder injury to Roethlisberger that sidelined him for a month wasn't a result of your example however. Its was just piss poor blocking by both OTs, and Roethlisberger was sandwiched and was injured for a month. Steelers were 6-3 up to that point, but missed the playoffs because Roethlisberger was out with an injury imo. LT does matter. I wont excuse the 40 pressures Martin gave up last year because a few other teams were successful with scrubs at LT.

I agree that LT does matter, but one must set priorities. You can say that we addressed LT in 2012 when we drafted JM. Is it working out? Probably as well as it could to this point. Should we have drafted for the position AGAIN in 2013? Well, if we had then we'd have lost out on other positions that are arguably just as important to this team's success this year and into the future. As Sherman indicated in a recent press conference, there are very few Jake Longs or Richmond Webbs in this league who can fill the need at LT well in their rookie year. Unfortunately, JM will have to develop. I think the Fins are hoping that less than stellar play at the position from him will be good enough for us this year.