Just a thought

[inFINSible]

I'd like to say something....

One thing everyone has to remember, mods are human too. It's not easy, to "police" the forums, and remain nuetral or freindly with everyone.

That being said, yes, the mods do need to be held to a higher standard. We as admins are responsible for making sure that the moderators on this site don't overstep their bounds or get too emotionally involved in issues that may arise. We have ways of recording what each and every moderator does and we review many decisions daily. This is the quality control we have in place and we have had in place for many years now. I don't think, at this time, that we need to install a system that publicly draws our moderators into controversy and undermines their authority.

Anyone is free to contact any of the Admins of this site, at any time, if they have a concern with any moderators or their actions. Most often the problem can be solved with just a little communication. We WILL take all compaints into consideration and we WILL discuss with each other, and probably the rest of the staff in most cases, each and every problem.


This site has a very high approval rating with our members so, we feel we are doing something right and we will continue to do our humanly best to keep the standards or moderating that we have and at the same time we will always strive to make each member feel like they are treated with respect and are welcomed on this site. As long as they, treat the staff with the same respect.

Much like you the members wouldn't want your mistakes discussed in public, the moderators deserve the same privacy.

 

[Fin Fan in Cali]

I'd like to say something....

One thing everyone has to remember, mods are human too. It's not easy, to "police" the forums, and remain nuetral or freindly with everyone.

That being said, yes, the mods do need to be held to a higher standard. We as admins are responsible for making sure that the moderators on this site don't overstep their bounds or get too emotionally involved in issues that may arise. We have ways of recording what each and every moderator does and we review many decisions daily. This is the quality control we have in place and we have had in place for many years now. I don't think, at this time, that we need to install a system that publicly draws our moderators into controversy and undermines their authority.

Anyone is free to contact any of the Admins of this site, at any time, if they have a concern with any moderators or their actions. Most often the problem can be solved with just a little communication. We WILL take all compaints into consideration and we WILL discuss with each other, and probably the rest of the staff in most cases, each and every problem.


This site has a very high approval rating with our members so, we feel we are doing something right and we will continue to do our humanly best to keep the standards or moderating that we have and at the same time we will always strive to make each member feel like they are treated with respect and are welcomed on this site. As long as they, treat the staff with the same respect.

Much like you the members wouldn't want your mistakes discussed in public, the moderators deserve the same privacy.

Very well said!:wink:

 

[feelthepain]

I'd like to say something....

One thing everyone has to remember, mods are human too. It's not easy, to "police" the forums, and remain nuetral or freindly with everyone.

That being said, yes, the mods do need to be held to a higher standard. We as admins are responsible for making sure that the moderators on this site don't overstep their bounds or get too emotionally involved in issues that may arise. We have ways of recording what each and every moderator does and we review many decisions daily. This is the quality control we have in place and we have had in place for many years now. I don't think, at this time, that we need to install a system that publicly draws our moderators into controversy and undermines their authority.

Anyone is free to contact any of the Admins of this site, at any time, if they have a concern with any moderators or their actions. Most often the problem can be solved with just a little communication. We WILL take all compaints into consideration and we WILL discuss with each other, and probably the rest of the staff in most cases, each and every problem.


This site has a very high approval rating with our members so, we feel we are doing something right and we will continue to do our humanly best to keep the standards or moderating that we have and at the same time we will always strive to make each member feel like they are treated with respect and are welcomed on this site. As long as they, treat the staff with the same respect.

Much like you the members wouldn't want your mistakes discussed in public, the moderators deserve the same privacy.

Interesting thoughts, I see your point/s. The reason I started this thread was mainly because of the arrogance of some Mods. I understand why the site needs Mods and there are Few I have an issue with, for the most part. I think the high and mighty responses get on my nerves more then anything and If something could be done about that, to me that would go a long ways
with my concerns.

IMO being arrogant or rude is not enough to contact the Admin. over so there really is nothing that can be done about it. Now if the powers that be here think thats not really an issue to discuss then I ask, how would you feel if a member PM'ed you and talked down to you on several different occasions?? I'm certin it wouldn't be received well, just a guess. IMO by telling members to contact the Adminn everytime a Mod was rude they would be doubling there work because I have seen many times a Mod post a rude comment and I was just reading a response to another poster, so I'm sure it's not a rare thing it's just not reported like you are suggesting we do.

The Bottom line is nothing will change from my undestanding, I'm just going to have to be treated rudly and accept it because I would rather save my complaints for things that are more important. Not that being rude isn't important, it's just not as important to the Admin. because of the other things that need to be dealt with. This is not a shot at anybody, it's just the reality of the site and it's prioritys.

Having Mods monitor Mods is like having a thief gaurd the bank...so to speak. The reason you have Mods patrol the boards is to protect ourselves from ourselves. But at the same time they will protect each other and not be as open minded or critical of each others performance. It's not an insult, it's human nature.It's just the way it is, any intelligent human being knows this.
But this is a moot point because my suggestion was already dismissed because the Admin. is fine with the operation in place.

In the end if we don't speak up then things stay the same, by bringing up this suggestion it puts a thought out there and even though things may not change directly it is an obvious issue and will be in the back of the minds of the Admin. and if this continues things will change. It's the law of avgs. I think this is an issue for more members then just myself, some Mods take it to heart and that in no way shape or form was my intention. I give respect first and foremost and I expect it in return, and really thats all the suggestion in this thread was about.

 

[inFINSible]

We take very seriously our relationship with the members of this site. If you assume that I'm lying and we won't discuss this, then you are mistaken.

If there is such a problem that we would receive an avalanche of complaints, that in and of in itself would signal to us that there is a problem that needs to be solved. If there are a few complaints here and there, I'm sure they can be handled capably by the Admins, as that is part of the job description and daily responsibilites of being in the position.

 

[feelthepain]

inFINSible wrote:

We take very seriously our relationship with the members of this site. If you assume that I'm lying and we won't discuss this, then you are mistaken.

I'll assure you I don't, however being critical of yourselves is not so easy to do.

If there is such a problem that we would receive an avalanche of complaints, that in and of in itself would signal to us that there is a problem that needs to be solved. If there are a few complaints here and there, I'm sure they can be handled capably by the Admins, as that is part of the job description and daily responsibilites of being in the position.

Look you can take this two ways, you can think this is an attack on the site and people who run it or you can think there are members who care and want whats best for everyone,not just the Admin and Mods and not just the members. It's up to the individual. I have already made it clear several times in this thread I mean no disrespect to anyone working hard to produce a top product. If you feel offended by what I'm suggesting maybe you should ask yourself why.

The Members have concerns and are just as important as the Admin and Mods and we should express our thoughts and concerns for what we think is best for the site. If you're a Mod or Admin, you're opinions aren't any more valid or important then the members and there not always whats best for the site simply because the Admin says so, thats common sense.

This is not Members versus Mods and Admin. Mods and Admin have a tough job to do without question, and it's not easy. I think thats a given. This is simply a suggestion. I don't need you to justify the Mods and Admin. I respect them it's the return respect thats the problem and you can't tell me it doesn't exist or hasn't been brought up in the past. IMO, some people just don't make good Mods, it's not the end of the world. It's just not for everyone. And those are the ones that think they are better then the members or above the rules, would you agree? Thats all I'm sayin. You can't always tell how a Mod will be till they are in the job, then it becomes clear if they are good for the job or not.

 

[Wildbill3]

inFINSible wrote:



I'll assure you I don't, however being critical of yourselves is not so easy to do.



Look you can take this two ways, you can think this is an attack on the site and people who run it or you can think there are members who care and want whats best for everyone,not just the Admin and Mods and not just the members. It's up to the individual. I have already made it clear several times in this thread I mean no disrespect to anyone working hard to produce a top product. If you feel offended by what I'm suggesting maybe you should ask yourself why.

The Members have concerns and are just as important as the Admin and Mods and we should express our thoughts and concerns for what we think is best for the site. If you're a Mod or Admin, you're opinions aren't any more valid or important then the members and there not always whats best for the site simply because the Admin says so, thats common sense.

This is not Members versus Mods and Admin. Mods and Admin have a tough job to do without question, and it's not easy. I think thats a given. This is simply a suggestion. I don't need you to justify the Mods and Admin. I respect them it's the return respect thats the problem and you can't tell me it doesn't exist or hasn't been brought up in the past. IMO, some people just don't make good Mods, it's not the end of the world. It's just not for everyone. And those are the ones that think they are better then the members or above the rules, would you agree? Thats all I'm sayin. You can't always tell how a Mod will be till they are in the job, then it becomes clear if they are good for the job or not.

I agree with many of your points, but when it comes to the staff and what they bring to the table, you as a member don't get to see the whole package, you'll catch a few glimpses of who a mod is, and the job they do, but for the most part a mods strengths and weaknesses cannot be fully observed by members.

I'm not sure of where you are going with part about mods who think they are above the rules? There may be some judgement calls now and again that turn out to be wrong, but none of the mods I work with think they are above the rules. Maybe this is something you should definately bring up to Admin via PM.

 

[feelthepain]

I'm not sure of where you are going with part about mods who think they are above the rules? There may be some judgement calls now and again that turn out to be wrong, but none of the mods I work with think they are above the rules. Maybe this is something you should definately bring up to Admin via PM.

Thank for the suggestion, and I have in the past when it got to be more then I could take. But as I mentioned it's at times ticky tac and just because it's ticky tac doesn't diminish the fact. I just feel like a two year old whining if I am always writting to the Admin, so I let things slide. That's the reason I came here and started this thread. I don't understand why we keep coming across the same thing "PM the Admin" if there is a suggestion forum. It almost seems like it's taboo to discuss.

What exactly is this suggestion forum for if we aren't allowed to make suggestions?? I'm not tying to be sarcastic, I'm just pretty sure this is the correct route to solving a problem and it opens it up to get opinions from both members and Admin/Mods to voice an opinion. If you've noticed All Admi/Mods that have responded feel there really is no problem and quite a few members do, I thinks thats very telling and also tells you something doesn't make sense. If you're watching each other how can you say there isn't really a problem when we all know people have complained?? People don't like to be judged and rather then be open minded they take offense. Once again no disrepect, just an obsevation.

 

[Wildbill3]

Thank for the suggestion, and I have in the past when it got to be more then I could take. But as I mentioned it's at times ticky tac and just because it's ticky tac doesn't diminish the fact. I just feel like a two year old whining if I am always writting to the Admin, so I let things slide. That's the reason I came here and started this thread. I don't understand why we keep coming across the same thing "PM the Admin" if there is a suggestion forum. It almost seems like it's taboo to discuss.

What exactly is this suggestion forum for if we aren't allowed to make suggestions?? I'm not tying to be sarcastic, I'm just pretty sure this is the correct route to solving a problem and it opens it up to get opinions from both members and Admin/Mods to voice an opinion. If you've noticed All Admi/Mods that have responded feel there really is no problem and quite a few members do, I thinks thats very telling and also tells you something doesn't make sense. If you're watching each other how can you say there isn't really a problem when we all know people have complained?? People don't like to be judged and rather then be open minded they take offense. Once again no disrepect, just an obsevation.

It's not taboo to discuss issues you may have with the site or staff, but it is a matter of tact to discuss the individual behind closed doors. I assume you have one or two mods in mind when you make mention that they may not be good mods, if this is the case, it is more respectful to discuss these individuals via PM, not in the open.

 

[Fin Fan in Cali]

Thank for the suggestion, and I have in the past when it got to be more then I could take. But as I mentioned it's at times ticky tac and just because it's ticky tac doesn't diminish the fact. I just feel like a two year old whining if I am always writting to the Admin, so I let things slide. That's the reason I came here and started this thread. I don't understand why we keep coming across the same thing "PM the Admin" if there is a suggestion forum. It almost seems like it's taboo to discuss.

What exactly is this suggestion forum for if we aren't allowed to make suggestions?? I'm not tying to be sarcastic, I'm just pretty sure this is the correct route to solving a problem and it opens it up to get opinions from both members and Admin/Mods to voice an opinion. If you've noticed All Admi/Mods that have responded feel there really is no problem and quite a few members do, I thinks thats very telling and also tells you something doesn't make sense. If you're watching each other how can you say there isn't really a problem when we all know people have complained?? People don't like to be judged and rather then be open minded they take offense. Once again no disrepect, just an obsevation.

Brother I think why they and I are saying to PM a mod, is to take care of the situation correctly. Two wrongs don't make a right, so why embarrass or try to bring someone down when it's not the proper forum? from personal experience if I have scene something that I didn't agree with I contacted a Mod that I am very comfortable with and brought it up, and that was enough for me.

I have also been in the wrong getting upset with a Mod when he was new and didn't understand, and I didn't handle it the best way, making his life quite miserable when I should of handled it in a pm. I have since learned.

I don't know which Mod or Mods you are referring too, but in my dealings with the Mods even the one I through under the bus, we have patched it up, and have gone on to do some great things for members of the family that don't have the financial backing that some of us do in our life. I work closely with two Mod's Inparticular, and they are very great to the site, and more then you know reach out to take care of the members of the family, with even there own funds. I suggest that this thread be put to rest, and bro contact admin, and air out your complaints in private. Then we can move on, and make the needed changes and continue to be the best darn fan based website there is.

Thanks,
John:wink:

 

[feelthepain]

It's not taboo to discuss issues you may have with the site or staff, but it is a matter of tact to discuss the individual behind closed doors. I assume you have one or two mods in mind when you make mention that they may not be good mods, if this is the case, it is more respectful to discuss these individuals via PM, not in the open.

I agree, and thats why I'm not naming names.This way I don't isolate and embarrass anyone. I'm bringing to light the issue not the offender's.

 

[feelthepain]

Brother I think why they and I are saying to PM a mod, is to take care of the situation correctly. Two wrongs don't make a right, :wink:

I don't think what I'm doing is wrong John, I think what I'm doing is not only right, but justified and for the good of more then just myself. It may sound corny,but I don't take this issue lightly. I also am not looking for attention, just making a suggestion that IMO is worth discussing, and letting it go accomplishes nothing.

I would like to add I am not trying to prolong this thread, just responding to other posts. Do you see how we can have a good discussion about an important topic without insults or hate?? This is a good topic and it doesn't have to offend to be effective or worthy of discussion.

 

[Fin Fan in Cali]

I don't think what I'm doing is wrong John, I think what I'm doing is not only right, but justified and for the good of more then just myself. It may sound corny,but I don't take this issue lightly. I also am not looking for attention, just making a suggestion that IMO is worth discussing, and letting it go accomplishes nothing.

I would like to add I am not trying to prolong this thread, just responding to other posts. Do you see how we can have a good discussion about an important topic without insults or hate?? This is a good topic and it doesn't have to offend to be effective or worthy of discussion.

It's good to discuss, however if you don't let the right people work with a sitaution, how can we as a family learn and improve? I think the current system for me is fine, but if there is a certain situation that you feel needs attention, bring it up to admin staff in a pm. They are good to correct situations here on the board. I myself bro, like to try to head off family members getting into a heated dispute, or getting ugly towards each other because we don't need that, and we are a family. It is okay to agree, and disagree. If you have ideas or suggestions to make things better within the current system bring in up to them in a pm. Who knows brother the shoe maybe on the other foot someday, and you maybe a Mod addressing an issue just like this.

All I ask is we work together to continue what the staff and AJ have brought this far, and to make it even better.:wink:
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[feelthepain]

It's good to discuss, however if you don't let the right people work with a sitaution, how can we as a family learn and improve?
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You learn and improve through trial and error and from suggestions and imput from everyone. It's called democracy, the mere presence of the suggetion forum tells you this is a democracy and the powers that be are interested in what everyone thinks. Think about this, if what the Admin/Mods want is to truly be a great site then they will welcome this type of thread. Like I said there is no promise whats suggested will be used, but it's out there and it wouldn't be if someone didn't feel the need to put it there.

 

[Wildbill3]

You learn and improve through trial and error and from suggestions and imput from everyone. It's called democracy, the mere presence of the suggetion forum tells you this is a democracy and the powers that be are interested in what everyone thinks. Think about this, if what the Admin/Mods want is to truly be a great site then they will welcome this type of thread. Like I said there is no promise whats suggested will be used, but it's out there and it wouldn't be if someone didn't feel the need to put it there.

All well and good, so, shall we adjurn this meeting then? throughout this thread we have discussed the possibility of checks and balances, and the nature of the current checks and balances. We have also rejected the idea of a open system for disciplining Mods and Admin, and subsequently denied a motion for a change in the current system.

Still on the table is the open issue of mods who may or may not be ready for modship, which may be more of an issue of trail and error, and a learning process for Moderators and Admin. Rest assured that the process for staff trainining and discipline is an ongoing process.

Further as this thread shows, debate can be open, and respectful.

Any other issues before we wrap it up?

 

[feelthepain]

Rest assured that the process for staff trainining and discipline is an ongoing process.

And is why imput and suggestions are important to the process!!

Any other issues before we wrap it up

It should reamin live and open for others to add input and/or suggestions. Since it is in the correct forum there is no need to "wrap it up".