Let’s talk about Trevor….

[Pachyderm_Wave]

The best QB prospect in the history of football according to the clueless media and several anti-Tua posters on this site.

They’ve all pumped this kid up ever since he played one good game against Alabama in the national championship game as a freshman - on a night when Alabama’s defense was atrocious.

Since that night, he did nothing in college football either over the next 2 seasons until he declared for the draft.

Since declaring for the draft, he’s accumulated a 3-15 record as a starter.

Threw 13 touchdowns and 18 interceptions, for 6.2 YPA, and a 73.4 QB rating.

Not a peep from the talking heads that hyped him up. Or the posters on this site. Not a word. Nothing.

From any of ‘em.

They’re all too busy keeping everyone distracted by attacking kids like Tua for winning games.

No young QB in recent history has gotten more of a pass for being complete trash than Trevor Lawrence.


Discuss….

 

[Birdmond]

Didn’t you have Trevor as the #1 overall offensive prospect?

2021 Composite Rankings (Offense)

-There's still a smattering of pro days to get through that could facilitate some slight movement- [Quarterback] 1st Round Grades 1. Trevor Lawrence* / Clemson / 6'6", 213 2. Justin Fields* / Ohio St. / 6'3", 228 3. Zach Wilson* / BYU / 6'2", 214 Day 2 Grades 4. Davis Mills* / Stanford...

finheaven.com

 

[Pachyderm_Wave]

Didn’t you have Trevor as the #1 overall offensive prospect?

2021 Composite Rankings (Offense)

-There's still a smattering of pro days to get through that could facilitate some slight movement- [Quarterback] 1st Round Grades 1. Trevor Lawrence* / Clemson / 6'6", 213 2. Justin Fields* / Ohio St. / 6'3", 228 3. Zach Wilson* / BYU / 6'2", 214 Day 2 Grades 4. Davis Mills* / Stanford...

finheaven.com

No. I had him as the top QB prospect in that particular class.

Go back a little further and find my “Tua vs. Trevor, The Truth: Analysis” thread.

I’ve warned about the dangers and flaws with Trevor from day 1. Never hyped him up the way the media and Tua bashers on this site did.

It’s getting close to time for assessment. They know who they are.

 

[Sirspud]

It's one game into the second season....and there's no words for what happened in Jax last year.

 

[Pachyderm_Wave]

It's one game into the second season....and there's no words for what happened in Jax last year.

That’s nonsense. This is the best quarterback prospect in history. This isn’t some 2nd round pick from Fresno St.

He’s been absolute trash.

It doesn’t matter what game of what season or what chaos transpires around Tua, he was never afforded any benefit of the doubt by his critics. Particularly in the media.

I want to know why everyone is always dead silent about the best QB prospect in the history of football. I’m going to force it if you participate in this thread.

I want to know why everyone wants to avoid an honest conversation. He’s been trash. Not average. Pathetic.

When a narrative gets destroyed, people go silent and throw out distractions.

We’re going to kick this dog just like we kicked it when Tua was at Alabama and Fabio was at Clemson. Nobody could kick it enough then.

Now everybody acts like they can’t lift their leg.

I can still lift mine.

 

[Sirspud]

That’s nonsense. This is the best quarterback prospect in history. This isn’t some 2nd round pick from Fresno St.

He’s been absolute trash.

It doesn’t matter what game of what season or what chaos transpires around Tua, he was never afforded any benefit of the doubt by his critics. Particularly in the media.

I want to know why everyone is always dead silent about the best QB prospect in the history of football. I’m going to force it if you participate in this thread.

I want to know why everyone wants to avoid an honest conversation. He’s been trash. Not average. Pathetic.

When a narrative gets destroyed, people go silent and throw out distractions.

We’re going to kick this dog just like we kicked it when Tua was at Alabama and Fabio was at Clemson. Nobody could kick it enough then.

Now everybody acts like they can’t lift their leg.

I can still lift mine.

I guess you're seeing this as some kind of crusade against the draft whiz's or something. Personally, I mean I put extremely low stock in draft expectations to begin with. I mean, every receiver drafted in the first round is suddenly solidifying their team's receiving corps, when a fair percentage of these guys are gonna end up looking at 20-40 catches years into their time in the league.

I don't see Lawrence as part of a crusade, but I can also separate a prospect's potential from what actually happened in their career. So many people think that the guys who make it did it because of innate talent and drive, while the guys who didn't make it just weren't good enough. And the truth is, while some would have ended up good or not regardless, for many their ultimate success or failure was the product of luck, coaching, health, and other circumstances, many of which were out of their control.

Maybe you aren't wrong in that there is no such thing as a perfect prospect, one that is infallible, and maybe they overstated Lawrence. But I wouldn't see Lawrence failing so far as an indication that Lawrence wouldn't have been successful elsewhere.

People also said Andrew Luck was a perfect prospect, one that was worth tanking for (suck for Luck). And they think they hit it on the head when he didn't bust. I myself look at it all in hindsight and wonder what it was all about. Yeah Luck was good, and what did you get out of it? He took over a perennial playoff team that tanked after its HOF QB ended up unexpectedly out for the season, he had some good seasons and some playoff berths, had some injuries, and retired unexpectedly early. This was what everyone should sell out for? 53 career wins and no championships?

I don't get too excited about anyone in the draft. Even the best prospects haven't even started to have their story written.

 

[Pachyderm_Wave]

I guess you're seeing this as some kind of crusade against the draft whiz's or something. Personally, I mean I put extremely low stock in draft expectations to begin with. I mean, every receiver drafted in the first round is suddenly solidifying their team's receiving corps, when a fair percentage of these guys are gonna end up looking at 20-40 catches years into their time in the league.

I don't see Lawrence as part of a crusade, but I can also separate a prospect's potential from what actually happened in their career. So many people think that the guys who make it did it because of innate talent and drive, while the guys who didn't make it just weren't good enough. And the truth is, while some would have ended up good or not regardless, for many their ultimate success or failure was the product of luck, coaching, health, and other circumstances, many of which were out of their control.

Maybe you aren't wrong in that there is no such thing as a perfect prospect, one that is infallible, and maybe they overstated Lawrence. But I wouldn't see Lawrence failing so far as an indication that Lawrence wouldn't have been successful elsewhere.

People also said Andrew Luck was a perfect prospect, one that was worth tanking for (suck for Luck). And they think they hit it on the head when he didn't bust. I myself look at it all in hindsight and wonder what it was all about. Yeah Luck was good, and what did you get out of it? He took over a perennial playoff team that tanked after its HOF QB ended up unexpectedly out for the season, he had some good seasons and some playoff berths, had some injuries, and retired unexpectedly early. This was what everyone should sell out for? 53 career wins and no championships?

I don't get too excited about anyone in the draft. Even the best prospects haven't even started to have their story written.

No, more about sports media and their obsession with trying to force a narrative, even in the face of proof to the contrary.

Make no mistake, they have an agenda. Just like all media.

They are wannabe bullies when it comes to a player like Tua. But ignore their own drivel they spewed for years about Trevor Lawrence out there stinking it up.

They fell for him because of their own bias against people like Nick Saban and the Alabama program.

I probably have an axe to grind with sports media because I’ve had to deal with ‘em for 40 years when it comes to athletics. I know what they are.

Bear Bryant summed it up one time when he was asked if he could donate $10 to help cover the cost of a local sportswriter’s funeral that had just passed away.

He pulled out his wallet, handed them a $20 bill and said, “Here, bury two of ‘em”.

 

[Sirspud]

No, more about sports media and their obsession with trying to force a narrative, even in the face of proof to the contrary.

Make no mistake, they have an agenda. Just like all media.

They are wannabe bullies when it comes to a player like Tua. But ignore their own drivel they spewed for years about Trevor Lawrence out there stinking it up.

They fell for him because of their own bias against people like Nick Saban and the Alabama program.

I probably have an axe to grind with sports media because I’ve had to deal with ‘em for 40 years when it comes to athletics. I know what they are.

Bear Bryant summed it up one time when he was asked if he could donate $10 to help cover the cost of a local sportswriter’s funeral that had just passed away.

He pulled out his wallet, handed them a $20 bill and said, “Here, bury two of ‘em”.

Seems like you have a bit of a vendetta. Might be clouding your judgement a little bit. I think the Tua criticism is unfair...might not you be doing the same to Lawrence because of your personal feelings?

 

[Pachyderm_Wave]

Seems like you have a bit of a vendetta. Might be clouding your judgement a little bit. I think the Tua criticism is unfair...might not you be doing the same to Lawrence because of your personal feelings?

No because I’m pointing out an observation that is accurate in regards to Trevor. He hasn’t even been average. He’s stunk.

But I had a feeling this was the case long ago. I watched him play every week at Clemson.

Tua wasn’t touted as the best QB prospect in the history of football. Every single Tua thread on this forum from the time Miami drafted Tua up until Trevor Lawrence was drafted, had folks trashing Tua and clamoring for a shot at Trevor Lawrence - even if it meant trading Tua.

Don’t get me wrong, I wish it would’ve happened - for Tua’s sake. But the data shows Trevor can’t even win the games he’s supposed to win in the NFL, because he throws the ball to the other team more than he does his own.

The best QB prospect since the Sphinx was built has been a massive disappointment. But nobody mentions it. Too busy trashing Tua.

Andrew Luck took a team with no GM, no head coach, and no offensive line and went 11-5, 11-5, 11-5.

Luck was just smart enough to see the writing on the wall when he started getting beat up. He didn’t feel like he had anything left to prove on a football field, and even if he did it wasn’t worth it.

Trevor Lawrence is no Andrew Luck.

He’s not even Tua.

And that’s why this thread exists.

Probably should’ve just resurrected one or two old ones. At least then you might know what you’re even trying to argue.

 

[Birdmond]

I do believe QB’s with prototypical size and athleticism are always going to get more rope than QB’s who are built like professional bowlers.

 

[Pachyderm_Wave]

I do believe QB’s with prototypical size and athleticism are always going to get more rope than QB’s who are built like professional bowlers.

I'm not a fanboy. I can clearly see Tua's limitations. But I can also see the results, and everyone else's limitations too.

And I do mean everyone.

There are plenty of QB's out there with out of control fire hoses attached to their shoulder that you can go out there and lose with. And I believe the media and certain fanbases act like they've forgotten that.

 

[Nappy Roots]

I'm not a fanboy. I can clearly see Tua's limitations. But I can also see the results, and everyone else's limitations too.

And I do mean everyone.

There are plenty of QB's out there with out of control fire hoses attached to their shoulder that you can go out there and lose with. And I believe the media and certain fanbases act like they've forgotten that.

While its true, Lawrence has been bad and hasn't gotten the media or fan hate Tua has gotten. You could say that about most all young QBs. Tua mainly gets the hate because his size and less than flashy arm strength. But a big reason he gets hate is because the pick directly after him has been clearly, head and shoulders, better than Tua immediately. So it is clouding peoples vision. This tends to happen with QB prospects because of comparisons.

 

[Pachyderm_Wave]

While its true, Lawrence has been bad and hasn't gotten the media or fan hate Tua has gotten. You could say that about most all young QBs. Tua mainly gets the hate because his size and less than flashy arm strength. But a big reason he gets hate is because the pick directly after him has been clearly, head and shoulders, better than Tua immediately. So it is clouding peoples vision. This tends to happen with QB prospects because of comparisons.

Well I get that too. The thing about Herbert is he still has a losing record as a starter. And he'll continue to hover around .500 as long as they run the offense through him. He'll put up good numbers, but it all evens out in the wash. He needs a dominant running game in the NFL to be a winner. The more you run the offense through him and he's throwing it 35+ times per game, the more it's going to bite you in the ass in the win column. No different than Ryan Tannehill.

But the thing about Trevor is that literally just about everybody has been better than him. There's really not anybody that's been worse. And his team doesn't even put that much on him.

That's a far cry from what all I heard about him for the past 3 years. It makes me wonder if anybody really watched him play at Clemson outside of one game against Alabama - and if they did, it makes me wonder why they felt like throwing 50/50 balls downfield to Tee Higgins and Justyn Ross against The Citadel, Wofford and Furman was going to translate into success in the NFL.

 

[Pachyderm_Wave]

All he does is throw up 50/50 balls. He was able to get away with that at Clemson because Higgins and Ross could Moss those FCS DB's every week. I warned everyone about that very thing in my Tua vs Trevor thread years ago after he did the same thing all game to Savion Smith against Alabama.

All he does is throw up 50/50 balls every week in the NFL. He hits on about one a game that results in a big play. The rest end up in the hands of the defense. Just like the end of the game yesterday against Washington.

 

[Nappy Roots]

Well I get that too. The thing about Herbert is he still has a losing record as a starter. And he'll continue to hover around .500 as long as they run the offense through him. He'll put up good numbers, but it all evens out in the wash. He needs a dominant running game in the NFL to be a winner. The more you run the offense through him and he's throwing it 35+ times per game, the more it's going to bite you in the ass in the win column. No different than Ryan Tannehill.

But the thing about Trevor is that literally just about everybody has been better than him. There's really not anybody that's been worse. And his team doesn't even put that much on him.

That's a far cry from what all I heard about him for the past 3 years. It makes me wonder if anybody really watched him play at Clemson outside of one game against Alabama - and if they did, it makes me wonder why they felt like throwing 50/50 balls downfield to Tee Higgins and Justyn Ross against The Citadel, Wofford and Furman was going to translate into success in the NFL.

People get enamored by tools. You know that. They think they can coach guys up with tools. Hence every mock draft in the world having Anthony Richardson going top 10 when hes clearly not ready for the NFL at this point.