Let’s talk about Trevor…. | Page 2 | FinHeaven - Miami Dolphins Forums

Let’s talk about Trevor….

GhostArmOfMarino said:
They can both kind of suck. It's not an either or type thing.
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Well, you never fail to miss a point - no matter how many times you change your handle.

The only one that sucks is Trevor Lawrence. The only one nobody talks about how much he sucks, is Trevor Lawrence.

The only one that's gotten a pass from the media and everyone else for playing like complete trash, is Trevor Lawrence.

The only one that's pointed out how much Trevor Lawrence sucks, is me. While the rest of you avoid it like the plague because you're too busy micro-analyzing and pushing narratives about Tua. Just like you pushed them about Trevor Lawrence being the best QB prospect since the forward pass.









"It's like I'm sittin' here playin' cards with my brother's kids or something."
 
Nappy Roots said:
People get enamored by tools. You know that. They think they can coach guys up with tools. Hence every mock draft in the world having Anthony Richardson going top 10 when hes clearly not ready for the NFL at this point.
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He showed he wasn't even ready for college. That last game was a disaster.
 
Pachyderm_Wave said:
I want to know why everyone wants to avoid an honest conversation. He’s been trash. Not average. Pathetic.

When a narrative gets destroyed, people go silent and throw out distractions.

We’re going to kick this dog just like we kicked it when Tua was at Alabama and Fabio was at Clemson. Nobody could kick it enough then.

Now everybody acts like they can’t lift their leg.

I can still lift mine.
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First off, I agree with most everything you’ve said thus far.

That said, my first attempt to answer some of the questions posed was going to because Trevor Lawrence isn’t a Miami Dolphin. That’s why he’s not brought up more. At least on this site by Dolphins fans.

But then I remembered that Justin Herbert and Joe Burrow are brought up a ton.

So, to me, the difference is that Trevor Lawrence was never in-play for MIA to draft whereas Herbert and Burrow were (there was talk of giving up the farm to trade up for Burrow). And that’s why their success and failures are discussed ad nauseam whereas Lawrence’s aren’t.

But the above only explains this message board and Miami Dolphins fans in general. It does NOT explain the Nat’l media. Those folks have been relentless toward Tua since day 1 whereas Trevor Lawrence has seemingly gotten much more of a free pass to date.

IMO it’s very similar to John Elway, who had a poor rookie season and by the end of season 3 had thrown more INT’s than TD’s. Even through TEN seasons Elway had only thrown ONE more TD than INT. 158 TD’s, 157 INT’s.

Like Lawrence, there wasn’t a lot of criticism levied toward Elway. Even despite his childish antics forcing his way to Denver in the first place.

IMO the commonality between Lawrence and Elway is that they are traditional looking tall, strong armed QB’s. Therefore they seem to escape the criticism that non-traditional looking QB’s usually seem to get.

In Tua’s case, he’s 6-1 rather than 6-3 or taller. And while the talk of his arm strength is wrong — he doesn’t have the rocket arm someone like Elway or Marino had. He also is Samoan and left-handed. Those last two factors shouldn’t play a role, but they clearly do. And they are factors that former QB’s Steve Young and Drew Brees — whom were equally criticized for not being 6-3 or taller and rocket armed — didn’t have piled on top of the other nonsense.

Circling back to Trevor Lawrence, because he fits the same profile as John Elway he’s likely going to continue to receive a free pass for the time being.

I don’t agree with that reality, but that seems to be the reality as far as I can tell.
 
EJay said:
He also is Samoan and left-handed. Those last two factors shouldn’t play a role, but they clearly do. And they are factors that former QB’s Steve Young and Drew Brees — whom were equally criticized for not being 6-3 or taller and rocket armed — didn’t have piled on top of the other nonsense.
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Since I can no longer edit the original reply, I just wanted to clarify the bolded portion above. Those two QB's didn't have both factors of being Samoan and left-handed factoring in against them. However, Steve Young obviously was left-handed like Tua and was also unfairly judged by that supposed stigma, along with being considered under-sized.
 
EJay said:
First off, I agree with most everything you’ve said thus far.

That said, my first attempt to answer some of the questions posed was going to because Trevor Lawrence isn’t a Miami Dolphin. That’s why he’s not brought up more. At least on this site by Dolphins fans.

But then I remembered that Justin Herbert and Joe Burrow are brought up a ton.

So, to me, the difference is that Trevor Lawrence was never in-play for MIA to draft whereas Herbert and Burrow were (there was talk of giving up the farm to trade up for Burrow). And that’s why their success and failures are discussed ad nauseam whereas Lawrence’s aren’t.

But the above only explains this message board and Miami Dolphins fans in general. It does NOT explain the Nat’l media. Those folks have been relentless toward Tua since day 1 whereas Trevor Lawrence has seemingly gotten much more of a free pass to date.

IMO it’s very similar to John Elway, who had a poor rookie season and by the end of season 3 had thrown more INT’s than TD’s. Even through TEN seasons Elway had only thrown ONE more TD than INT. 158 TD’s, 157 INT’s.

Like Lawrence, there wasn’t a lot of criticism levied toward Elway. Even despite his childish antics forcing his way to Denver in the first place.

IMO the commonality between Lawrence and Elway is that they are traditional looking tall, strong armed QB’s. Therefore they seem to escape the criticism that non-traditional looking QB’s usually seem to get.

In Tua’s case, he’s 6-1 rather than 6-3 or taller. And while the talk of his arm strength is wrong — he doesn’t have the rocket arm someone like Elway or Marino had. He also is Samoan and left-handed. Those last two factors shouldn’t play a role, but they clearly do. And they are factors that former QB’s Steve Young and Drew Brees — whom were equally criticized for not being 6-3 or taller and rocket armed — didn’t have piled on top of the other nonsense.

Circling back to Trevor Lawrence, because he fits the same profile as John Elway he’s likely going to continue to receive a free pass for the time being.

I don’t agree with that reality, but that seems to be the reality as far as I can tell.
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This is one heck of a post. 👍
 
Pachyderm_Wave said:
Well I get that too. The thing about Herbert is he still has a losing record as a starter. And he'll continue to hover around .500 as long as they run the offense through him. He'll put up good numbers, but it all evens out in the wash. He needs a dominant running game in the NFL to be a winner. The more you run the offense through him and he's throwing it 35+ times per game, the more it's going to bite you in the ass in the win column. No different than Ryan Tannehill.

But the thing about Trevor is that literally just about everybody has been better than him. There's really not anybody that's been worse. And his team doesn't even put that much on him.

That's a far cry from what all I heard about him for the past 3 years. It makes me wonder if anybody really watched him play at Clemson outside of one game against Alabama - and if they did, it makes me wonder why they felt like throwing 50/50 balls downfield to Tee Higgins and Justyn Ross against The Citadel, Wofford and Furman was going to translate into success in the NFL.
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Comparing Herbert to Ryan Tannehill is just plain bad analysis. One is significantly more talented than the other.
 
LoneyROY7 said:
Comparing Herbert to Ryan Tannehill is just plain bad analysis. One is significantly more talented than the other.
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Not really. Tannehill ran a 4.6 at his pro day and Herbert ran a 4.68. Both big guys with tons of arm talent, you can debate Herbert has more but everyone knows Tannehill is no slouch. It’s actually a fair comparison.

But its funny how Alabama Man talks about a QB needing a good running game to succeed as a knock on a guy, welcome to the NFL. As if Tua doesn’t need one and almost every NFL QB who has ever played the game, that along with a great defense.

In college football it’s all about winning every single game, that’s why college football is stupid. In the NFL it’s all about what you do in the playoffs. Even all time great QBs like Aaron Rodgers and Peyton Manning struggled in the playoffs and were criticized for it, Aaron still is to this day. Hard to win in the NFL without a great defense and/or great running game. It’s been done but it’s very rare, Kurt Warners Rams were one of the few and even they had Marshall Faulk. Russell Wilson has built his entire HOF legacy off of a great defense and running game.

P.S Hey Alabama Man, ready for Daniel Jones to take the league by storm this year just like you predicted? 1 - 0 baby you know what’s coming…NFC EAST CHAMPS :ffic:

P.P.S In regards to Trevor Lawrence any NFL GM in their right mind would have taken him over Tua. You’re not a NFL GM even though you think you are and you aren’t in your right mind in regards to this either. I don’t even know anything about Trevor Lawrence, barely have watched him play and even I know that. But of course you know more than everyone because Alabama, naturally.
 
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LoneyROY7 said:
Comparing Herbert to Ryan Tannehill is just plain bad analysis. One is significantly more talented than the other.
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I listened to morons on the internet try to tell me for the past 4 years that demonstrating why a 50/50 ball thrower in Trevor Lawrence wasn’t going to be as good as Tua was bad analysis.


None of you ever have the slightest idea what the hell you’re talking about.
 
TannDaMan17 said:
Not really. Tannehill ran a 4.6 at his pro day and Herbert ran a 4.68. Both big guys with tons of arm talent, you can debate Herbert has more but everyone knows Tannehill is no slouch. It’s actually a fair comparison.

But its funny how Alabama Man talks about a QB needing a good running game to succeed as a knock on a guy, welcome to the NFL. As if Tua doesn’t need one and almost every NFL QB who has ever played the game, that along with a great defense.

In college football it’s all about winning every single game, that’s why college football is stupid. In the NFL it’s all about what you do in the playoffs. Even all time great QBs like Aaron Rodgers and Peyton Manning struggled in the playoffs and were criticized for it, Aaron still is to this day. Hard to win in the NFL without a great defense and/or great running game. It’s been done but it’s very rare, Kurt Warners Rams were one of the few and even they had Marshall Faulk. Russell Wilson has built his entire HOF legacy off of a great defense and running game.

P.S Hey Alabama Man, ready for Daniel Jones to take the league by storm this year just like you predicted? 1 - 0 baby you know what’s coming…NFC EAST CHAMPS :ffic:

P.P.S In regards to Trevor Lawrence any NFL GM in their right mind would have taken him over Tua. You’re not a NFL GM even though you think you are and you aren’t in your right mind in regards to this either. I don’t even know anything about Trevor Lawrence, barely have watched him play and even I know that. But of course you know more than everyone because Alabama, naturally.
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And nobody stays stuck on stupid like you do.

The only thing stopping that from being great analysis is that it’s a fact.
 
The reason you dont hear it is cause Trevor doesnt lead to clicks. For all the hype he received in college, I honestly dont think anyone really gives 2 shits about him anymore. There's no Trevornon. I dont watch wrestling anymore but Tua is almostly like the babyface that the people have a LOUD love/hate view on. I'm really surprised Dolphin Stadium has never had the alternating "Lets go Tua! Tua Sucks!" chant on repeat when they announce his name. Trevor has almost dropped to a midcarder that his fans will pull for, but honestly noone else gives a ****.

Truth is...i think cause he wound up in J-ville, noone just gives a **** about him or thinks about him anymore. "Trevor Lawrence shoot up the board as an alltime potential 1st pick bust" nobody is going to click on that cause nobody cares. Hell by week 8 TL could retire without saying a word, disappear, and 95% of the fans in the nfl wouldnt even realize it til in the offseason when Jax was signing a QB
 
Finding a quarterback with a "higher ceiling" than Tua is easy to do. They're everywhere.

The league is full of backups with physically higher ceilings than Tua that have had numerous opportunities to be starters and they just can't do it. Along with bottom rung starters that will never pull themselves off the bottom rungs because they can't win football games. But they have physically higher ceilings.

That's not what it's about. Jay Cutler can still throw a football through a piece of 1/4" plywood.

Watson was skipping balls on the ground in preseason. Miami could quickly go back to the days of chasing Jay Cutlers and Brock Osweilers.

If Miami could do better than Tua, they already would have. They've had the past quarter century to do it.

People behind microphones, in front of TV cameras, and posters on the internet talk as if they can throw a football better than Tua. It's so ridiculous that it passes for analysis. Because that's what people want - they want ridiculous.

Instead of asking bozos like Chris Grier if they think Tua can be elite, ask Tua if he thinks Chris Grier can be elite at his job. Miami's record without Tua is almost as bad as Jacksonville's record with the best quarterback prospect since football was invented.

All Grier does is hire coaches with no experience because that's all that will touch him. Then has the built in excuse of "just getting players the coach wanted" until that coach gets fired. Rinse. Repeat. Never wins or competes for anything, while his groupies pretend like the NFL hands out trophies for having wads of excess cash or "swindling" other teams in trades.

A lot of accountants could meet the requirements of that job.
 
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