Miami Trading 20th pick to Arizona for Leonard Davis? | Page 2 | FinHeaven - Miami Dolphins Forums

Miami Trading 20th pick to Arizona for Leonard Davis?

Larry, why take Jake Grove when we have a center? That's nonsensical. If you play him at RG, then you are playing him out of position, if you put Seth McKinney there, you are also playing him out of position at a spot he's never played. We have a back-up center who was an All American and has never been given the chance to play his natural spot in John St Clair - I don't see why Jake Grove even comes into the equation.
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Mainly because IMO Seth McKinney has had plenty of time and opportunity to win the starting job away from Tim Ruddy and has failed to do so. He has played in games and I haven't noticed a big difference. We weren't more successful at running the ball when he was in the game this year. Third round OL gambles don't ALWAYS pan out man, just cuz he was our first pick in that draft don't mean he's got to be a blue chipper.

Jake Grove is much more talented than McKinney IMO...especially in the longterm. Thats why I would consider him. McKinney would be a good backup at G and C. Right now we dont even know we've got Shawn Andrews, so St Clair could be stuck for us at RT. If we manage to get Andrews then Grove becomes a non-issue, because yeah St Clair becomes a good backup at all 5 OL positions. But if Andrews goes to Cleveland, Jacksonville, Pittsburgh, or Tampa...then we could consider Grove because St Clair will be mired in the tackle position.

If there's one mistake you keep making Boomer, its that you place too much faith in Damion McIntosh. I know you liked him coming out of the draft, and I know you liked the player he was in San Diego as a RT prospect, however right now he's got a serious ankle problem, and it is one that has been recurring. He's as injury prone at this point in his career as Mark Dixon...hence the $300k signing bonus (very very very little commitment to him). I think you probably consider McIntosh to have solved our RT situation hence your talking about St Clair as our backup C and G.
 
Originally posted by CarolinaFishFan
i would not do it, given he is in a contract year... unless a long term deal was worked out prior to the trade with him.
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Beat me to it!! I darned sure wouldn't give up the 20th pick without being guaranteed of having him for at least 4 more yrs.
 
I would love to see the Phins draft Andrews. I think he would start at RT and the Fins will make sure McIntosh is 100%. The question is then who plays RG. I am really baffled at this question. I wonder if Jamie Nails is back to 100%. He would ease my mind if he can come back in 2002 form. Or if McIntosh is healthy this is all moot as I would love to see Andrews moved to RG.
 
Im weary of the trade because hes in a contract year and could ask for a mountain of money. If we lose him after the season, then theres no reason to make the trade. If we can first agree to some kind of long term deal with him (without breaking the bank), then I think its a very attractive idea.
 
Contract year???

Davis, Leonard

Player Info.............Draft Info

OL (#75)................Year: 2001

Arizona Cardinals.......Round: 1

Wortham, TX.........Position: 2

Salary History
2001 209,000.
2002 892,000.
2003 6,617,667.
2004 4,815,000.
2005 4,839,000.
2006 7,169,000.
 
Cool. Dont know where that runor got started. Looks like his salary is awfully back loaded. Would need to be restrucutred if we would make a move for him.
 
Originally posted by Surferosa
Cool. Dont know where that runor got started. Looks like his salary is awfully back loaded. Would need to be restrucutred if we would make a move for him.
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Not that this has been floated anywhere, I'm just canvassing opinion.
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wait until our pick to see if andrews is available if he is draft him...if not..trade the pick
 
I would definitely consider trading for Davis. Merman posted his salary numbers, do those include a signing bonus? If Davis' has a big signing bonus with low base salaries (like many first round picks rookie contracts), then I think it would be a good deal.
 
Originally posted by Merman
Contract year???

Davis, Leonard

Player Info.............Draft Info

OL (#75)................Year: 2001

Arizona Cardinals.......Round: 1

Wortham, TX.........Position: 2

Salary History
2001 209,000.
2002 892,000.
2003 6,617,667.
2004 4,815,000.
2005 4,839,000.
2006 7,169,000.
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It's possible/likely that his final year will be voided. Most 1st round rookies sign 5-year deals.
 
Originally posted by Boomer
Not that this has been floated anywhere, I'm just canvassing opinion. Fine young lineman who can play outside and in and someone who the Cards are a little unsure about as he's played so many positions since his rookie year. I think he's one of the best young OL in the game, but with Bidwell being so tight and him being in a contract year, I wondered whether any of you would take the deal considering he's almost exactly what we need on our OL.
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D---n, did you think of this all by yourself?:lol: Good point...not a bad idea at all..I might even start liking the OL some...:D
Okay we need Speilman to check the board..or do you have his number? I wouldn't mind floating this by him..
 
Originally posted by ckparrothead


Mainly because IMO Seth McKinney has had plenty of time and opportunity to win the starting job away from Tim Ruddy and has failed to do so. He has played in games and I haven't noticed a big difference. We weren't more successful at running the ball when he was in the game this year. Third round OL gambles don't ALWAYS pan out man, just cuz he was our first pick in that draft don't mean he's got to be a blue chipper.

Jake Grove is much more talented than McKinney IMO...especially in the longterm. Thats why I would consider him. McKinney would be a good backup at G and C. Right now we dont even know we've got Shawn Andrews, so St Clair could be stuck for us at RT. If we manage to get Andrews then Grove becomes a non-issue, because yeah St Clair becomes a good backup at all 5 OL positions. But if Andrews goes to Cleveland, Jacksonville, Pittsburgh, or Tampa...then we could consider Grove because St Clair will be mired in the tackle position.

If there's one mistake you keep making Boomer, its that you place too much faith in Damion McIntosh. I know you liked him coming out of the draft, and I know you liked the player he was in San Diego as a RT prospect, however right now he's got a serious ankle problem, and it is one that has been recurring. He's as injury prone at this point in his career as Mark Dixon...hence the $300k signing bonus (very very very little commitment to him). I think you probably consider McIntosh to have solved our RT situation hence your talking about St Clair as our backup C and G.
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CK that was music to my ears...or should I say eyes you see the same thing I see...hey we agree...I've been a Grove backer for a while now..I do think McKinney can play RG and succeed..unless we find someone better.
 
Actually Davis has performed exceptionally at guard, and he was expected to move there when he left college.

The reason he was moved there was because they had solid tackles and poor guards. He's also a devastating run blocker and can blow guys up.

He's now at LG this year because that's where Denny likes his best talent, blocking the RB's weak side DT and DE.
 
Originally posted by iceblizzard69
I would definitely consider trading for Davis. Merman posted his salary numbers, do those include a signing bonus? If Davis' has a big signing bonus with low base salaries (like many first round picks rookie contracts), then I think it would be a good deal.
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The salary numbers from the NFL Players Association, the player's union, are just base salary. No signing bonus, roster bonuses or incentives that may be in the contract are included.

Remember also that the team that paid the signing bonus gets any remaining amount charged to its cap whenever a player is traded. No after June 1st for trades.

The low base salaries in the beginning of a back-loaded contract are gone. Take a look at 2001 and 2002.

Sorry you were probably talking about a renegotiated contract agreed to before trading. :)
 
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When I said he was in his contract year, what I meant was that his contract will need to be re-done and Denny Green has talked abouttrading him or re-doing that original deal at seasons end.

CK - thanks for pointing out my faults ;) But if McIntosh had a SERIOUS ankle injury, he wouldn't have been signed, plain and simple. He has had a bad ankle for 2 years on and off and thus he's having the surgery to correct it and rehabbing properly so as not to reinjure it again - i.e - the team is being smart. Yes I liked him in the draft, but I also liked him a lot in San Diego. He's a tremendous run blocker. What was the stat? Something like 71% of Tomlinson's runs went off the left side.

If you are drafting Grove, essentially you are saying that McKinney was a wasted pick. And there is no evidence whatsoever to think that McKinney can play RG. We need a RG, not a center. Therefore, why are we not drafting a RG, instead of continually trying to put square pegs in round holes?

Hey, I like Jake Grove as much as the next man, but I'm more realistic about our needs. I like Reggie Williams but I know that we aren't going to draft him because he's too similar to what we have.
 
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