NFLPA to investigate Tua's return from concussion protocol

[Finsational]

This article is from 2015 there is a new policy now. See above.

Concussion Protocol & Return-to-Participation Protocol: Overview

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www.nfl.com

Thank you for that. I thought I had read something like that before but could not find it again. That eases my mind. McD doesn't seem like a person who would jeopardize and players health but that doesn't mean someone else in the organization feels the same way.

 

[Fin-Loco]

I always assumed the neuro doctor had the ultimate authority but it turns out that is left up to the team physician. That is total conflict of interest. This is definitely something that needs to be address. Going by my previous assumption I thought sine the doctor and physician agreed Tua definitely did not have a concussion. This makes me second guess everything. We all know 95 percent of the players want to go back in even if they will have long term damage and some coaches just want to win, health be damned. I hope none of this is the case but you know it has happened before throughout the league.

Sideline doctors: How the NFL's concussion-spotting system is — and isn't — working

An initiative to put independent concussion spotters on the sidelines of games has produced mixed results, according to doctors and outside experts.

www.statnews.com

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Sure. Or we can maintain a modicum of control and quit coddling the millionaire athletes. It's football. You might get injured and those injuries can hamper your later years. If you can't deal with it, go join the PGA. We've already neutered the game enough.

 

[Finsational]

Sure. Or we can maintain a modicum of control and quit coddling the millionaire athletes. It's football. You might get injured and those injuries can hamper your later years. If you can't deal with it, go join the PGA. We've already neutered the game enough.

That's a little harsh Loco. Yes, we all love the big hits and injuries are part of the game but jeopardizing someone's long term health for our entertainment is unethical. I don't care if you make 50k a year or 50 million.

To clarify, I'm just referring sending someone back out with a head injury.

 

[Fin-Loco]

That's a little harsh Loco. Yes, we all love the big hits and injuries are part of the game but jeopardizing someone's long term health for our entertainment is unethical. I don't care if you make 50k a year or 50 million.

I agree to disagree on this topic. I think there's a level of acceptable risk player safety wise that we've now gotten to. Sure, if there becomes new tech uniform wise, get them in it. But to take the decisions out of the team's hands is something I very much disagree with. We went from four a days to two a days to one a days and the coaches not being able to even talk to or instruct players for chunks of the year. If we keep ratcheting it up, it's going to become unwatchable. Even the players on veteran minimums make at the very least $705K which is probably ten times 95% of the NFL fan's income. Along with these ridiculous salaries come some risks.

 

[raving]

Yeah but c’mon the NFL does NOT care one iota about the players or ESPECIALLY their long term health…same as boxing - MMA - does Hollywood movie industry care about actresses who have to get raped to by Hollywood tycoons to be considered for a role?

It’s ALL optics - I would hasten to guess every game had players continuing in action w concussions - the o and d lineman especially…

I love watching the Dolphins but if I knew the reality more - I’d likely never watch again…dark stuff really!!!

It’s not say there aren’t good things - lots of good things for players and their families but the concussion thing is mostly optics…

 

[PhinFan1968]

I agree to disagree on this topic. I think there's a level of acceptable risk player safety wise that we've now gotten to. Sure, if there becomes new tech uniform wise, get them in it. But to take the decisions out of the team's hands is something I very much disagree with. We went from four a days to two a days to one a days and the coaches not being able to even talk to or instruct players for chunks of the year. If we keep ratcheting it up, it's going to become unwatchable. Even the players on veteran minimums make at the very least $705K which is probably ten times 95% of the NFL fan's income. Along with these ridiculous salaries come some risks.

Agree.

Let people make their own decisions for their life unless it impacts others' human rights. Nobody's forcing them to play, nobody's forcing us to watch.

We ALL know the risks football players face every game, so do they.

Side note...the investigation into Tua's situation should be complete within a week or two, and the NFL has already said they believe "everything was done right."

 

[ChambersWI]

Not going through all the pages but wanted to point out NFLPA has said all indications are that concussion protocol was followed but anytime it looks like a player took a hit to the head and returns they want to be sure.

 

[FinfanInBuffalo]

Agree.

Let people make their own decisions for their life unless it impacts others' human rights. Nobody's forcing them to play, nobody's forcing us to watch.

We ALL know the risks football players face every game, so do they.

Side note...the investigation into Tua's situation should be complete within a week or two, and the NFL has already said they believe "everything was done right."

You know if left up to the team, they'd pressure players to unnecessarily risk their health. Do we extend this to other industries? Eliminate OSHA? Hey, factory workers, oil rig workers, etc know the risks.... they can quit if they don't like it.

While there is inherent risk in football, there is nothing wrong with reasonable measures to mitigate the risks. IMO, the teams have demonstrated in the past that they cannot be trusted to do that.

 

[andyahs]

Not going through all the pages but wanted to point out NFLPA has said all indications are that concussion protocol was followed but anytime it looks like a player took a hit to the head and returns they want to be sure.

Don't have a problem with them protecting players because that's what they should do but too bad it had to take away from the win by the media pundits.

 

[bostondolphin]

I find some of the responses in this thread pretty disheartening tbh.

It's not in teams or players' interest to retire from the field with a concussion. I'd have thought that was pretty obvious. For every player who puts his brain health absolutely paramount, there are a number of guys who want to get back in the game, who worry about how the team would view them if they pull out, who don't want concussions to damage their contract value.

So, just like the ref in a boxing match has to tell a fighter he can't continue even when he wants to, somebody external has to tell a NFL player he can't go back on the field.

Unfortunately in the NFL, the guy who makes that call is the Designated Team Physician, not the independent Neuro counsel, who performs the tests with various team personnel present.

You can see the opportunity for bias.

I'm sure the protocol was followed. But the protocol itself is a pretty wishy-washy business, partly as it's designed that way and partly because concussion is v hard to detect medically. It can be easily cheated/manipulated by the player and - fundamentally - at the end the team doctor decides.

If people still believe Tua had a bad back which miraculously cleared up to let him back in unhindered, then fine. If people want to support their team and QB to the point that they just want him on the field regardless and they believe whatever argument supports that happening, then fine.

But please don't question the bona fides of those of us who are concerned about brain injury in contact sports like Am Football and pro rugby. If it's not handled properly, then lawsuits and protective parents will ensure these sports just die out.

“Protective” parents or over protective parents? I’d submit 99.9% of parents are “protective”. The ones whining about masking in schools or the dangers of football, soccer or recess are another breed we don’t need to give voice to.

I get the conflict of interest you bring up, but such is life. There’s conflict of interest all around us isn’t there?

If people are concerned about athletes health, that’s nice. But so what. Everything in life has risks. We have protocols and systems in place to take reasonable measures to keep them safe. They aren’t foolproof, but they ought to be enough to ensure perfect strangers can go on with their lives and let the athletes do the same.

 

[Fin Thirteen]

The thing is you can follow the protocol and still have the player passed and take the field with concussion.

Players can deliberately score low on their baseline tests, so that a score while concussed doesn't show up as a huge variance. The concussion tests themselves include a list of more or less predetermined questions, not random ones that ask players to really use their cognitive skills .

It's not an exact science at the best of times, but even less so where there's margin for cheating. It's a half-ass bit of window dressing that may help a small amount but is easily circumvented.

 

[Finsational]

Agree.

Let people make their own decisions for their life unless it impacts others' human rights. Nobody's forcing them to play, nobody's forcing us to watch.

We ALL know the risks football players face every game, so do they.

Side note...the investigation into Tua's situation should be complete within a week or two, and the NFL has already said they believe "everything was done right."

I look at it from this perspective. If I get a concussion and go to the hospital and they give me the OK to go because they didn't look close enough and I get in a head on collision on the way home, I am affecting someone else's life ? That is an extreme example but putting someone back on the field and not in protocol allows them to go about their daily business. I'd imagine if your are in protocol your are chauffeured everywhere.

 

[Fin Thirteen]

“Protective” parents or over protective parents? I’d submit 99.9% of parents are “protective”. The ones whining about masking in schools or the dangers of football, soccer or recess are another breed we don’t need to give voice to.

I get the conflict of interest you bring up, but such is life. There’s conflict of interest all around us.

If people are concerned about athletes health, that’s nice. But so what. Everything in life has risks. We have protocols and systems in place to take reasonable measures to keep them safe. They aren’t foolproof, but they ought to be enough to ensure perfect strangers can go on with their lives and let the athletes do the same.

My specific point is that they're not enough. Not if Tua can retake the field after collapsing twice from "back spasms" that miraculously cleared up.

Not if guys at 50 are destroyed by brain-injury derived psychological problems.

 

[PhinFan1968]

My specific point is that they're not enough. Not if Tua can retake the field after collapsing twice from "back spasms" that miraculously cleared up.

Not if guys at 50 are destroyed by brain-injury derived psychological problems.

Life choices...we all have 'em.

 

[PhinFan1968]

You know if left up to the team, they'd pressure players to unnecessarily risk their health. Do we extend this to other industries? Eliminate OSHA? Hey, factory workers, oil rig workers, etc know the risks.... they can quit if they don't like it.

While there is inherent risk in football, there is nothing wrong with reasonable measures to mitigate the risks. IMO, the teams have demonstrated in the past that they cannot be trusted to do that.

Right. The NFL should do all it can to ensure safety and health...and if the NFLPA thinks they're not, it's their job to work that into the deal with the NFL and the players. You can mitigate it all you want, but the bottom line is this is a very violent sport and people WILL get hurt. Nobody's leading the charge to cancel it.

TONS of people work injured every day...it's life.