O-gun... NOT important | FinHeaven - Miami Dolphins Forums

O-gun... NOT important

Fisticuff

Fisticuff

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sure this season he is...

if we can get a good D coord. who knows how to teach players how to blitz and prepares his D, then we have no need for Ogun. Taylor can be Taylor, and on the other side just bring blitzes.

If the dolphins could get some decent LB (Maybe Moore will come into his own) and some speed (sorry seau.. you should be some kind of coach, not a player) we could easily lose Ogun and be better. Sammy Knight also would make a good Blitzer. he is a Roy Williams type of player.

LE- whoever is decent and has a low payroll.
DT- Bowens (wouldn't mind getting rid of him though)
DT- Chester
RE- Taylor

OLB- Moore (good blitzer in college i heard)
MLB- Thomas (run stopper, and can be a good blitzer)
OLD- Julian Peterson would be LOVLEY... he can cover like a DB, hit like a LB (which he is) and a great athlete overall (compare him to a JT). but if we can get someone with be spped and cover skills we'd be good.

DB- Surtain
DB- Knight (play like Roy Williams and blitz, since his speed is low)
DB- FA/draft (imagine Sean Tatlor... now wake up from that dream)
DB- FA/draft (would love to have Keiwan Ratliff but he's a top 2nd rounder)

Is ogun solid? yes... can we afford to get rid of him? for a 1st and maybe a 3rd i'd have to say a big YES.
draft is gonna be exciting... not to mention the FA around.
 
Uh, first of all, why would we unnessicarily get rid of Ogunleye? He's not a product of Taylor. Taylor isnt getting the job done this season. I dont buy that a LDE has a easier time then a RDE, either. You dont take having two excellent pass rushers lightly.

I dont understand the obsession with getting rid of Tim Bowens. He IS our Defense. He is the corner stone of our run D, the strongest part of our D. Not Chester, not Zgonina, not Daryl Gardener..We're not going to replace him easily.


Why would we drop Greenwood as a linebacker? He's playing good. Better then you could reasonably hope from a reach-pick of a linebacker like Moore, coming off of injury and playing in his first year.
 
Originally posted by Disgustipate
Uh, first of all, why would we unnessicarily get rid of Ogunleye? He's not a product of Taylor. Taylor isnt getting the job done this season. I dont buy that a LDE has a easier time then a RDE, either. You dont take having two excellent pass rushers lightly.

I dont understand the obsession with getting rid of Tim Bowens. He IS our Defense. He is the corner stone of our run D, the strongest part of our D. Not Chester, not Zgonina, not Daryl Gardener..We're not going to replace him easily.


Why would we drop Greenwood as a linebacker? He's playing good. Better then you could reasonably hope from a reach-pick of a linebacker like Moore, coming off of injury and playing in his first year.
Click to expand...

unnessicarily get rid of ogun? the guy wants tons of money, and we can benifit more from his picks. besides he's not getting the double teams that Taylor gets. he better get to the QB with man to man blocking. when you lead the NFL with 18.5 sacks, you get noticed.

Tim bownes=quitter. "i'm done" until he was forced to play.. how do you replace bowens? get a fat guy and stick him in the DT spot... Chester has outplayed him in every way.

Greenwood has played good. but thats the problem with the team. GOOD. he isn't that strong, fast, and doesnt have great instincts.

can we be worse with Moore?
 
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Taylor is not getting NEAR the double teams he used to. He's getting single teamed quite regularly now, and not doing anything with it. Ogunleye also rushing from the QB's view, and the TE usually lines up on his side.

As for Tim Bowens? He played yesterday. How do you take that as "Done", exactly? Last time I checked, claiming your done means you're finished with something, which he's obviously not.

Yeah, and we sure as hell can be worse with Moore. He's a glorified strong safety, drafted way higher then we should have taken him. He should have been someone we picked up on the second day.
 
Bowens cannot just be replaced by any old fat guy off the street. Just watch this defense with and without him against the run. Mabey all he does is stand there but the other DT's get pushed off the ball.

Taylor definately is not playin all that well for whatever reason. I cant quite figure out what it is exactly but several games he has been shut down by a LT goin 1 on 1. The different zone defenses played with him dropping back in coverage just dont seem to do much good. Ogun may not be as talented and may play against lesser linemen, but he just seems to want it more. As cynical as it sounds. money may be the driving factor there....one has it and the other wants it.

This defense definatly needs more speed at safty, and I assume Marion is gone after this season. But both corners will be in teal and orange for at least a few years more. Zach will anchor the defense as usuall and Greenwood can spend his next season on his reggae career because hes gonna need something to fall back on once hes cut.
 
I'm not too keen on giving up a 26-year old superstar. Wally has been getting it done all year on his own. I'd like to keep him. But I hope he'll continue to play this well after getting his money. Also, it is NOT a forgone conclusion that Wally would even get us a #1. Nowhere does it say that a team is obligated to snatch him up at our price.

Tim Bowens......he's a freaking rock. You can't just pull a fat guy off the street and plug him in. That's negligent. The problem with Bowens is that he plays a position that goes largely unnoticed and by nature doesn't rack up many statistics to speak of. But everything starts with he and Chester.

Greenwood has played very well. He's out there reacting now and it shows. I'm ready to re-sign him. He's a RFA and he won't command much money to begin with.
 
Bowens is NOT done. I don't know why you want to get rid of him.

As I've said before, the draft is a crapshoot. You don't know what you are going to get. If we can afford Ogunleye, we have to keep him. Getting a first rounder is nice, but Ogunleye has had two years in a row where he has gotten at least 9 sacks, and he has improved a lot this year. He isn't someone we want to get rid of.

I don't understand anyones obsession with getting rid of Madison. Has his play declined? Yes, it has. However, we will not find anyone in free agency who is as good as Madison. Hopefully he will restructure and stay.
 
O-Gun is the future my people...Taylor is at or almost over his prime...I like Taylor a lot but as I said before O-Gun is the future and will only get better!!!

Go Fins!!!
 
O-gun is gone.. he wants too much money.. and who is to say that if he does get his money, that he will stay play he way he does? im sure he will go to another team, and be disappointing..
miami still has their core of defense players that have stuck it out every year, thats who they need to concentrate on keeping. o-gun could just be a flash in the pan and this team needs to spend the little money it has on the offense this offseason.
 
Originally posted by Blueprint_21
sure this season he is...

if we can get a good D coord. who knows how to teach players how to blitz and prepares his D, then we have no need for Ogun. Taylor can be Taylor, and on the other side just bring blitzes.

If the dolphins could get some decent LB (Maybe Moore will come into his own) and some speed (sorry seau.. you should be some kind of coach, not a player) we could easily lose Ogun and be better. Sammy Knight also would make a good Blitzer. he is a Roy Williams type of player.

LE- whoever is decent and has a low payroll.
DT- Bowens (wouldn't mind getting rid of him though)
DT- Chester
RE- Taylor

OLB- Moore (good blitzer in college i heard)
MLB- Thomas (run stopper, and can be a good blitzer)
OLD- Julian Peterson would be LOVLEY... he can cover like a DB, hit like a LB (which he is) and a great athlete overall (compare him to a JT). but if we can get someone with be spped and cover skills we'd be good.

DB- Surtain
DB- Knight (play like Roy Williams and blitz, since his speed is low)
DB- FA/draft (imagine Sean Tatlor... now wake up from that dream)
DB- FA/draft (would love to have Keiwan Ratliff but he's a top 2nd rounder)

Is ogun solid? yes... can we afford to get rid of him? for a 1st and maybe a 3rd i'd have to say a big YES.
draft is gonna be exciting... not to mention the FA around.
Click to expand...

I agree with some of that. Who is Peterson? Is he gonna be a FA?
 
Sticking to "this Core" of players on Defense...that have stuck it out...has not done us any good my friend....I seriously think its time for changes in Miami...

On D the only untouchables are...IMO

1) Pat Surtain
2) O-Gun (he's a free agent so I don't know if he'll stay)
3) Taylor

Thomas and Taylor are good players but I don't know how much longer these two guys can take...I think that there will be a lot of changes in Miami in the offseason.
 
"Sammy Knight also would make a good Blitzer. he is a Roy Williams type of player."

It almost sounds like you're making Sammy Knight out to be the 2 year player. I wouldn't confuse the two, Sammy Knight has been known as a solid SS and a playmaker on defense for quite a while.

"OLD- Julian Peterson would be LOVLEY... he can cover like a DB, hit like a LB (which he is) and a great athlete overall (compare him to a JT). but if we can get someone with be spped and cover skills we'd be good."

This is a good idea, and you're right, but do we really continue to invest more and more cash into our defense? I'm sure Julian will be asking for a nice payday.

"is ogun solid? yes... can we afford to get rid of him? for a 1st and maybe a 3rd i'd have to say a big YES.
draft is gonna be exciting... not to mention the FA around. "

I couldn't agree with you more. He's looking for JT money, and I'm sure the new coaching staff would love to have some extra early round draft picks.
 
Originally posted by Blueprint_21
sure this season he is...

if we can get a good D coord. who knows how to teach players how to blitz and prepares his D, then we have no need for Ogun. Taylor can be Taylor, and on the other side just bring blitzes.

If the dolphins could get some decent LB (Maybe Moore will come into his own) and some speed (sorry seau.. you should be some kind of coach, not a player) we could easily lose Ogun and be better. Sammy Knight also would make a good Blitzer. he is a Roy Williams type of player.

LE- whoever is decent and has a low payroll.
DT- Bowens (wouldn't mind getting rid of him though)
DT- Chester
RE- Taylor

OLB- Moore (good blitzer in college i heard)
MLB- Thomas (run stopper, and can be a good blitzer)
OLD- Julian Peterson would be LOVLEY... he can cover like a DB, hit like a LB (which he is) and a great athlete overall (compare him to a JT). but if we can get someone with be spped and cover skills we'd be good.

DB- Surtain
DB- Knight (play like Roy Williams and blitz, since his speed is low)
DB- FA/draft (imagine Sean Tatlor... now wake up from that dream)
DB- FA/draft (would love to have Keiwan Ratliff but he's a top 2nd rounder)

Is ogun solid? yes... can we afford to get rid of him? for a 1st and maybe a 3rd i'd have to say a big YES.
draft is gonna be exciting... not to mention the FA around.
Click to expand...

I agree on this one.
There is no guarantee that he isn't a "one hit wonder".
Sure he could continue to be great but he could also tank after this year.
Of course we don't unnecessarily get rid of him Disgustipate but if someone is willing to snatch him up.... we should take the picks and feel lucky that we can finally restock via the draft. We have some good prospects at DE that have shown they can play. Chances are that we can replace him.

Buy low.... Sell high!
 
Does Greenwood have Tackle this year, I have never really seen him on the field or heard his name called by an announcer, so he's not making mistakes either, so if he's not making plays or mistakes, my question is "Is Greenwood even on the field?"
 
Originally posted by Sal Lisitano
Sticking to "this Core" of players on Defense...that have stuck it out...has not done us any good my friend....I seriously think its time for changes in Miami...

On D the only untouchables are...IMO

1) Pat Surtain
2) O-Gun (he's a free agent so I don't know if he'll stay)
3) Taylor

Thomas and Taylor are good players but I don't know how much longer these two guys can take...I think that there will be a lot of changes in Miami in the offseason.
Click to expand...

have not done us any good?? what team have you been watching the past two years? these 'core' defensive players are the only reason that the dolphins didnt go 3-13 the past couple seasons.. you want to give up zach thomas.. look what happened in the tennessee game when he was out.. he was replaced with tommy hendricks, who looked like he wasnt even in the same area code as the rest of the defense. and jason taylor is one of the best DL in the league. sure, maybe they havent had as good a season as they have had in the past. but that doesnt mean they deserve to go. O-gun has one good season and hes ranting about how much money he deserves. you never hear about thomas, taylor, and the rest of the D bitching about how much money they should get. they didnt really get paid until they were here for about 3 or 4 years.
fieldler and the rest of the offense have been riding on the defense's success for the past 4 years.. 'fiedler's win/loss record" all on the account of the defense. mondays game was the only bad one they have had all year. the defense is tired of carrying the weight for the offense, thats why they played bad. they had a letdown.. put an offense on the field that can score points and a coach thats knows his azz from his elbow.
 
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