Paul | Page 23 | FinHeaven - Miami Dolphins Forums

Paul

No clue... but as a general rule, if you want an elite Edge, that's where you have to go.

...and all three of these guys have top 10 Edge in their grasp. For all the sulky crap that was dished out on Chubb last year... he had 11 sacks and 6!!! forced fumbles... that's elite production.

The same fanboys who'd wet themselves for a 6 INT Safety... pooh pooh Chubb. It blows my mind.

Honestly, the worst of the three might be Phillips... but only because of his fragility.

If I was GM... I would ALWAYS be looking for my next pass rusher.

Definitely an interesting take.

I agree that Phillips and Chubb have top 10 potential. Chubb had a better season then some may want to admit.

Again, if Chop is elite and the GM thinks so, I get the thought of drafting him.

Me personally, when we have an O line in need of replacement (T/G) I feel taking a guy like Morgan or Barton who would contribute on every snap would be more beneficial then drafting a 3rd Edge rusher.

If Miami is not planning on extending Phillips, or expect to get rid of Chubb next season I would understand more prioritizing Edge on the same level as O line.

Next draft, if a top Edge player falls to Miami, would you draft Edge again? Or would 3 be the reasonable number? There is a limit correct?
 
Definitely an interesting take.

I agree that Phillips and Chubb have top 10 potential. Chubb had a better season then some may want to admit.

Again, if Chop is elite and the GM thinks so, I get the thought of drafting him.

Me personally, when we have an O line in need of replacement (T/G) I feel taking a guy like Morgan or Barton who would contribute on every snap would be more beneficial then drafting a 3rd Edge rusher.

If Miami is not planning on extending Phillips, or expect to get rid of Chubb next season I would understand more prioritizing Edge on the same level as O line.

Next draft, if a top Edge player falls to Miami, would you draft Edge again? Or would 3 be the reasonable number? There is a limit correct?
Well... Barton was on my no-draft list. I absolutely hated the idea of drafting an inside lineman who was actually a project. C'mon, he's played the last 3 years as a LT.

Morgan, I liked... talked him up as a trade-down candidate before the draft. If we had traded down and then selected Guyton or Morgan, I would have been satisfied.

Would I draft another Edge? Maybe. It depends on Phillips. If he comes back at 100%, then no, not in the first round.

I'm keeping Chubb and his 20m/year salary. Hell yes.
 
One nice bonus about having a player on the Dolphins named Paul is it reminds me of one of my two favorite Willie songs.
He'll receive his education in the NFL cities of the nation.
 
I disagree with you about tackle being the second most important position on the offense. It's the Center.

The Center is the position the entire OL should be built around. Think of the Center as the QB of the OL!
Why do suppose virtually every team disagrees with that philosophy, as evidenced by both draft value, as well as pay scale?
 
If Miami is not planning on extending Phillips, or expect to get rid of Chubb next season I would understand more prioritizing Edge on the same level as O line.

I think both of those scenarios are up in the air at this point.

For one thing, we have no idea if either will quickly return to form, it really if at all.

Even if they do, they will be expensive. Not that cost would, necessarily, be prohibitive, but if Chop turns out to be a high quality edge, it does provide viable options and cap implications in the future.
 
Why do suppose virtually every team disagrees with that philosophy, as evidenced by both draft value, as well as pay scale?

They don't disagree, it just looks that way. - LOL

It just looks that way because those teams probably already have good centers! I know it is difficult to determine how smart a Center is from a fan's perspective, but the coaches know. It's a combination of smarts and physical ability that make the position of the Center so important.

I suspect that is why so many fans focus on the "non-center" positions, not to mention the FACT that those other OL positions outnumber the Center by a 4:1 ratio on every team, not to mention their backups. This gives room for much more discussion about those positions and most fan's just "jump on the bandwagon", making some fans (not me of course) think those other positions are more important.

Ray is Right - again. - LOL
 
They don't disagree, it just looks that way. - LOL

It just looks that way because those teams probably already have good centers! I know it is difficult to determine how smart a Center is from a fan's perspective, but the coaches know. It's a combination of smarts and physical ability that make the position of the Center so important.

I suspect that is why so many fans focus on the "non-center" positions, not to mention the FACT that those other OL positions outnumber the Center by a 4:1 ratio on every team, not to mention their backups. This gives room for much more discussion about those positions and most fan's just "jump on the bandwagon", making some fans (not me of course) think those other positions are more important.

Ray is Right - again. - LOL
Ray, I love ya, but a Center is not more important than a Tackle.

How many centers have been selected #1 in the draft?

How many Centers have 20+ million annual salaries?
 
They don't disagree, it just looks that way. - LOL

It just looks that way because those teams probably already have good centers! I know it is difficult to determine how smart a Center is from a fan's perspective, but the coaches know. It's a combination of smarts and physical ability that make the position of the Center so important.

I suspect that is why so many fans focus on the "non-center" positions, not to mention the FACT that those other OL positions outnumber the Center by a 4:1 ratio on every team, not to mention their backups. This gives room for much more discussion about those positions and most fan's just "jump on the bandwagon", making some fans (not me of course) think those other positions are more important.

Ray is Right - again. - LOL
I'm sure Ray is right in his own fantasy mind. The powers that pass out NFL contracts disagree, and your argument does not even address the reality that Centers are not valued that highly.

You did hit on one thing that is true, but also really points to them not being valued highly in terms of draft or compensation. They usually aren't required to be overwhelming physical specimens. In fact, too big/tall is a detriment to the position. Imy not going down the path of intelligence because that implies a lack thereof in other positions, which is silly because a smart player is an asset universally.

I would suggest the reason they are relatively low valued is because they are easier to find.

I'll just leave this here if you are interested. It breaks it down a few different ways.

 
Ray, I love ya, but a Center is not more important than a Tackle.

How many centers have been selected #1 in the draft?

How many Centers have 20+ million annual salaries?

If you try to use draft position to determine the importance of a position you are just plain RONG!

Next to the QB, the Center is the most important position on the offense. This is because he is:
1) The first player to handle the ball for the offence.
2) The Center is the player who initiates every play.
a) It is the movement of the ball in the Centers hand that initiates a play according to the NFL. an example of this is that this is the action that dictates if a defense is "offsides" or not.
b) A QB may, or may not, call for the ball to be put into action, but it is the Center who starts the play by moving the ball which is what puts the ball into play!
3) The Center is responsible for making sure the OL is properly set for the play being called.

Now player salary is dependent on variables, such as:
1) Availability
a) The fewer well qualified players available for a position, the more they are likely to be paid more money by the team. Think in terms of rarity.
b) The more desperate a team is for a good player at a given position, the more they are likely to be willing to pay more to get a good player. Think in terms of poor player selections in the past.

Notice that 1a) does not take into account the importance of a position. It only takes account of the number of good players available for that position. Even then it is a "crap shoot". Look at the number of high draft picks that don't "pan out" in the NFL.

Notice that 1b) reflects individual team's desperation for a weak position on their team, not the importance of that position compared to other positions, because they are already "somewhat" satisfied with the players they already have in those positions.

Another example of an important position that gets later draft picks but is more important than many other positions is the Kicker.

These guys often score between 3 to 10 points every game. In close games and low scoring games they are often the ones who produce the final score that wins the game. Look at the number of RB's and Receivers a team has. Then look at the points any of the multiple players a team has in those positions score in each and every game.

Compare their total points scored per player per game to the Kickers scored points per game. OK, now which of those players scores more points for the team each game? Do that for every NFL team.

If you think a Kicker is less important than a receiver or running back, you probably need establish a method of determining a positions importance on something other than your emotions.

That's the Facts, Jack! - LOL
 
If you try to use draft position to determine the importance of a position you are just plain RONG!

Next to the QB, the Center is the most important position on the offense. This is because he is:
1) The first player to handle the ball for the offence.
2) The Center is the player who initiates every play.
a) It is the movement of the ball in the Centers hand that initiates a play according to the NFL. an example of this is that this is the action that dictates if a defense is "offsides" or not.
b) A QB may, or may not, call for the ball to be put into action, but it is the Center who starts the play by moving the ball which is what puts the ball into play!
3) The Center is responsible for making sure the OL is properly set for the play being called.

Now player salary is dependent on variables, such as:
1) Availability
a) The fewer well qualified players available for a position, the more they are likely to be paid more money by the team. Think in terms of rarity.
b) The more desperate a team is for a good player at a given position, the more they are likely to be willing to pay more to get a good player. Think in terms of poor player selections in the past.

Notice that 1a) does not take into account the importance of a position. It only takes account of the number of good players available for that position. Even then it is a "crap shoot". Look at the number of high draft picks that don't "pan out" in the NFL.

Notice that 1b) reflects individual team's desperation for a weak position on their team, not the importance of that position compared to other positions, because they are already "somewhat" satisfied with the players they already have in those positions.

Another example of an important position that gets later draft picks but is more important than many other positions is the Kicker.

These guys often score between 3 to 10 points every game. In close games and low scoring games they are often the ones who produce the final score that wins the game. Look at the number of RB's and Receivers a team has. Then look at the points any of the multiple players a team has in those positions score in each and every game.

Compare their total points scored per player per game to the Kickers scored points per game. OK, now which of those players scores more points for the team each game? Do that for every NFL team.

If you think a Kicker is less important than a receiver or running back, you probably need establish a method of determining a positions importance on something other than your emotions.

That's the Facts, Jack! - LOL

I am so thankful you aren't our GM.
 
Ray, I love ya, but a Center is not more important than a Tackle.

How many centers have been selected #1 in the draft?

How many Centers have 20+ million annual salaries?
Apparently, you did not pay attention to the fact that the most critical member of the Dolphins' OL was Connor Williams. He was the linchpin. The straw that stirred the drink. When he was in the lineup, regardless of who the other 4 were, they averaged over 6 yards per carry. When he was not in the lineup, they averaged 3.5 yards a carry. **** who's been picked #1. **** who gets paid 20m.
Since Brewer is being depended upon to replace Connor, how he performs is most important when it comes to the OL.
 
Apparently, you did not pay attention to the fact that the most critical member of the Dolphins' OL was Connor Williams. He was the linchpin. The straw that stirred the drink. When he was in the lineup, regardless of who the other 4 were, they averaged over 6 yards per carry. When he was not in the lineup, they averaged 3.5 yards a carry. **** who's been picked #1. **** who gets paid 20m.
Since Brewer is being depended upon to replace Connor, how he performs is most important when it comes to the OL.
So Brewer is more important than Tyreek Hill @Ray R ?
 
Back
Top Bottom