Rank Tannehill Among Young QB's? | Page 20 | FinHeaven - Miami Dolphins Forums

Rank Tannehill Among Young QB's?

Yessir said:
Tom Brady makes the the Dolphins offensive line better last year. Why? Because of his football IQ, and his ability to read defenses and digest information. It's a much higher level of quarterback play. Brady gets rid of the ball. And with Wallace, Hartline, and Clay, he would've had a much better set of pass catchers than he was working with last year.

You're flat out delusional if you think, all things equal, Brady doesn't squeeze out 11-5 out of the Dolphins last year. Tannehill and Brady aren't equals in any capacity.
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(All according to PFF grading)

Would it surprise you to know that Tannehill performed better than Brady last season when pressured?

Would it surprise you that Tannehill was better than Brady when blitzed last season?

Would it surprise you that Tannehill was better than Brady last season on 2nd and long and 3rd and long?


Regarding your "gets rid of the ball" comment, you might want to check your facts.

Here are the percentage of times the two QBs got rid of the ball quickly:

0-2 seconds? Brady 32.6% of the time. Tannehill 31.8% of the time.
2.1-2.5 seconds? Brady 28.5%. Tannehill 28%
2.6-3.0 seconds? Brady 17.6%, Tannehill 15.3%
 
roy_miami said:
Hey, all he's doing is assuming Tannehill is the best QB in the game today and if he couldn't do better than 8-8, well, then being better than 8-8 was just an impossibility. He's not the homer though, we are....
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All you are doing is grasping at straws.

Let me try again with the team and player names hidden....

Team A has the worst pass blocking OL in the league and is near the bottom of the league at running the ball. They were 15th in TD passes and 27th in rushing TDs. Their QB was 10th in passing yards. Their running game was 26th in rushing yards. They led the league in sacks despite running a largely quick passing offense.

Fan 1 contends that they are simply good QB play away from contention.

Fan 2 contends that the OL and running game were so bad that even an all time great QB wouldn't help.

Which fan is the homer again?
 
FinfanInBuffalo said:
(All according to PFF grading)

Would it surprise you to know that Tannehill performed better than Brady last season when pressured?

Would it surprise you that Tannehill was better than Brady when blitzed last season?

Would it surprise you that Tannehill was better than Brady last season on 2nd and long and 3rd and long?


Regarding your "gets rid of the ball" comment, you might want to check your facts.

Here are the percentage of times the two QBs got rid of the ball quickly:

0-2 seconds? Brady 32.6% of the time. Tannehill 31.8% of the time.
2.1-2.5 seconds? Brady 28.5%. Tannehill 28%
2.6-3.0 seconds? Brady 17.6%, Tannehill 15.3%
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what would surprise me is if anyone watched the 2 QBs played and thought Ryan was half the QB Brady was.
 
nyjunc said:
NE didn't have the weapons in 2001 that Ryan had last year.

If Ryan was the QB of NE they wouldn't have been .500. That's not a knock on Ryan, Brady is the best QB of his generation. It's asinine to compare them in any way.
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Its asinine to suggest he's superman and would have survived the poor pass protect Tannehill had as well.
 
Twitches Brew said:
Are you saying that if Tom Brady was our QB last year we still would've gone 8-8 and missed the playoffs?
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No...but even if Brady survived the poor pass protect which is highly questionable and certainly arguable.......he might possibly have gotten us in the playoffs...but we are eliminated in the wild card round.

This team had far to many weaknesses to suggest that Tannehill was responsible for all our failures.
 
BlueFin said:
Its asinine to suggest he's superman and would have survived the poor pass protect Tannehill had as well.
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I guarantee you he doesn't get sacked 58 times, I bet it's closer to 40 than 60.

BlueFin said:
No...but even if Brady survived the poor pass protect which is highly questionable and certainly arguable.......he might possibly have gotten us in the playoffs...but we are eliminated in the wild card round.

This team had far to many weaknesses to suggest that Tannehill was responsible for all our failures.
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Miami had much more talent to throw to and a better defense. any good QB would have won 10-11 games w/ that team.
 
FinfanInBuffalo said:
(All according to PFF grading)

Would it surprise you to know that Tannehill performed better than Brady last season when pressured?

Would it surprise you that Tannehill was better than Brady when blitzed last season?

Would it surprise you that Tannehill was better than Brady last season on 2nd and long and 3rd and long?


Regarding your "gets rid of the ball" comment, you might want to check your facts.
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Maybe PFF grading is dumb?

Vs pressure
Average passer rating - 60.7
Tannehill- 46.3
Brady - 65.8

vs blitz
avg - 85.7
Tannehill - 83.8
Brady - 95.4

2nd and long
avg - 85.6
Tannehill - 81.8
Brady - 80.8

3rd and long (6-10 yards)
avg - 82.0
Tannehill - 91.6
Brady - 90.2

3rd and 10+
avg - 75.4
Tannehill - 36.2
Brady - 68.7

11-20 yards
avg - 91
Tannehill - 80
Brady - 102

4th quarter
avg - 80
Tannehill - 65
Brady - 84

Until you can show me PFF rankings are anything but complete randomness I'm going to continue to stick with the passer rating stat.
 
roy_miami said:
Maybe PFF grading is dumb?

Vs pressure
Average passer rating - 60.7
Tannehill- 46.3
Brady - 65.8

vs blitz
avg - 85.7
Tannehill - 83.8
Brady - 95.4

2nd and long
avg - 85.6
Tannehill - 81.8
Brady - 80.8

3rd and long (6-10 yards)
avg - 82.0
Tannehill - 91.6
Brady - 90.2

3rd and 10+
avg - 75.4
Tannehill - 36.2
Brady - 68.7

11-20 yards
avg - 91
Tannehill - 80
Brady - 102

4th quarter
avg - 80
Tannehill - 65
Brady - 84

Until you can show me PFF rankings are anything but complete randomness I'm going to continue to stick with the passer rating stat.
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You can keep using the team stats and be sure to adjust your team stats to account for the huge disparity in pass protection and running game.
 
nyjunc said:
I guarantee you he doesn't get sacked 58 times, I bet it's closer to 40 than 60.



Miami had much more talent to throw to and a better defense. any good QB would have won 10-11 games w/ that team.
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Again....if you are suggesting Tannehill was primarily responsible for our problems....you are either a hater or just don't know what your talking about.

Poor pass protect....couldn't run and couldn't stop the run....that's not the signs of a contender...is that really so confusing for you?
 
BlueFin said:
Again....if you are suggesting Tannehill was primarily responsible for our problems....you are either a hater or just don't know what your talking about.

Poor pass protect....couldn't run and couldn't stop the run....that's not the signs of a contender...is that really so confusing for you?
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pass protection problems were vastly overrated

they COULD run, they chose not to and chose to trust a young QB not ready to be trusted

Ryan was not awful, he was mediocre, if he was good they make the playoffs easily. There were bad games in pass pro but he had many games the pass pro was more than good enough and he still failed.

I get it, I know why you guys make excuses for him, you expect and want him to be the QB for many years to come and he may turn into that guy but he wasn't that guy last year.
 
nyjunc said:
pass protection problems were vastly overrated

they COULD run, they chose not to and chose to trust a young QB not ready to be trusted

Ryan was not awful, he was mediocre, if he was good they make the playoffs easily. There were bad games in pass pro but he had many games the pass pro was more than good enough and he still failed.

I get it, I know why you guys make excuses for him, you expect and want him to be the QB for many years to come and he may turn into that guy but he wasn't that guy last year.
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Good points there, IMHO. I was wondering, do you have his stats for converting 3rd and long? I find he tends to complete enough passes, but we end up short of the line to gain.
I don't think they actually were "trusting" him as much as training him. I think the philosophy has been not so much to protect him from growing pains as much as force him to go through those growing pains in order to see what we have.
As far as making excuses, I try not to. But I know what you mean, I did it with Henne because I wanted him to be that guy. I admit it and I blush! :lol:
 
Dolphin North said:
Good points there, IMHO. I was wondering, do you have his stats for converting 3rd and long? I find he tends to complete enough passes, but we end up short of the line to gain.
I don't think they actually were "trusting" him as much as training him. I think the philosophy has been not so much to protect him from growing pains as much as force him to go through those growing pains in order to see what we have.
As far as making excuses, I try not to. But I know what you mean, I did it with Henne because I wanted him to be that guy. I admit it and I blush! :lol:
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I agree that they were more worried about training and finding out about Tannehill rather than maximizing our win potential, thats not to say they were sacrificing wins necessarily but I think they were willing to accept much more short term variance with maybe a slightly less average win total with the goal of bettering Tannehill and our chances at winning a championship in the future.

What I'm trying to say probably isn't very clear but as an example if Tannehill really was hurt week 17 Matt Moore might have given us a better chance to win that game, say Moore wins 50% of the time and an injured Tannehill wins 45% of the time, it might be wise to sacrifice the 5% for several reasons:
- learning experience for Tannehill and a chance to be the hero
- avoid any kind of QB controversy
- If Tannehill wins the game the momentum could carry us further into the playoffs
- experience a playoff type game

So we sacrifice a 5% chance to win now but its more like an investment that will hopefully pay off in the future.

And fill your boots on QB stats:
https://www.profootballfocus.com/blog/2014/06/03/qbs-in-focus/
https://www.profootballfocus.com/blog/2014/06/02/qbs-in-focus-by-down-and-distance/
 
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