Roster Notes vs strength of top of draft

[Generic Name]

The health and production of both our ILB's and OLB's could come into play in round 1 or 2 on draft day. I think they should give Misi another year to develop as college DE's often take 2-3 years to transition to a 3-4 outside backers but who knows maybe the Fins see a chance to get a bookend guy opposite Wake and pull the trigger. Pass rushers are at a premium for a reason.

Kevin Burnett's injury history could also make a guy like Boston College's Luke Kuechly interesting with the first pick.
Justin Blackmon would be a good selection as a real #2 and future #1 WR. I think Michael Floyd's off the field issues combined with the combustibility of Brandon Marshall make him a shaky pick for the Fins.

I just don't see Trent Richardson as a fit if Bush continues to play well.

The other spot that needs to be addressed, imo, is free safety but only a trade down would get us value in the case of the draft's best 2 FS prospects, TJ McDonald and Mark Barron


RG/RT is NOT a position that needs to be addressed in first three round of this draft. There is no value there

 

[jim1]

How did you come up with the conclusion that there isn't value to be had at RG or RT in the first three rounds of this draft? I don't know anyone who objectively has a desire for the Dolphins to draft OL in the first round, but sometimes you're at the mercy of what the draft has to offer at any given juncture. And if we're picking 8-12 I'm thinking that David DeCastro is that value play. And barring a major showing by John Jerry above and beyond the 1 or two games that he looked good in, we need a Guard.

As to rounds 2 and 3, my guess is that OL will offer some of the best values in those rounds, it's a deep year for OL.

 

[Generic Name]

Jim-taking a guard in top 15 would be stupid, flat out dumb and the kind of thing Sparano and Wannstedt would do

Get a guard or RT through free agency, the draft, especially the top of the draft is the best place to get play makers, something Miami hasn't done enough of

if its a deep year for OL get one in the fifth or sixth round

Long first over all
Pouncey-1st round
Carey-1st round
Incognito-free agent,nice money
Jerry-third round

there's enough there to work with, its time for this group and club to grow up, drafting Oline high all the time is the best way to be mediocre year after year

 

[jim1]

Jim-taking a guard in top 15 would be stupid, flat out dumb and the kind of thing Sparano and Wannstedt would do

Get a guard or RT through free agency, the draft, especially the top of the draft is the best place to get play makers, something Miami hasn't done enough of

if its a deep year for OL get one in the fifth or sixth round

Long first over all
Pouncey-1st round
Carey-1st round
Incognito-free agent,nice money
Jerry-third round

there's enough there to work with, its time for this group and club to grow up, drafting Oline high all the time is the best way to be mediocre year after year

What playmaker would you draft, say #8-12? Which playmaker- who will be available there- is worth the pick? I don't care if Jerry was taken in the 3rd round, 1st round or 57th round- he's been a bust so far. Carey is adequate, Colombo still sucks. The point is, what player at #s 8-12 offers a need/value proposition? I think to avoid that issue would be, as you say, "stupid, flat out dumb". And to me, the player likely to be available there who most offers a need/value proposition is David DeCastro.

Are you watching the game today? How many sacks do the Eagles have so far? ? How does Miami look on 3rd or 4th and short? Looks to me that we sure could use some OL, playmakers, take your pick. But if I have to choose between David DeCastro and Alshon Jeffery for example, I'm taking DeCastro. Michael Floyd would at least make me think twice aobut it. So again, if you're picking at say #8, who do you take? And you can forget about Blackmon or Claiborne, they'll be long gone.

My focus as to this draft has been and will continue to be Brandon Weeden. Weeden aside, I'm looking for value in the 1st round, with an eye on need. To do otherwise would be, in my opinion, "stupid, flat out dumb".

 

[Generic Name]

First off Sparano hand picked Columbo to come in and play RT and Nate Garner is no LT ever. those were the 2 guys giving up almost all the pressures and sacks today. The next coach and personnel guy have to do better in free agency about getting us a starting caliber RT and a better backup on the other side.

Second there is no value EVER in taking a RG at the top of the first round. EVER. its like taking a punter or PK there. Dumb.

I would take Richardson or Alshon Jeffrey over any RG at #8 or whereever we're picking which might be a little higher if Losman goes another start or two. i'd take the best safety prospect or TE prospect over a RG or RT. You're going to get a better player who can have a bigger impact for the team

Here's my main point- Miami has spent time and money on their o-line at the expense of drafting real playmakers. To me, Sparano's biggest failure is his inability to mold a great OL with all the high picks and fa money he's been given. its time to change the way Miami thinks and drafts.

My biggest proof for you is that NE, the Saints and the really good teams wouldn't take 4 OL as high as we have and they're certainly not taking a RG or RT in the top 10 of any draft.

 

[ChambersWI]

depending on who declares. There will be a huge run on OTs (Kalil, Marten, and Reiff). And also LBs (Burfect, Teo, Kuechley). Now what will be interesting is if Barkley and RG3 don't declare.

 

[jim1]

First off Sparano hand picked Columbo to come in and play RT and Nate Garner is no LT ever. those were the 2 guys giving up almost all the pressures and sacks today. The next coach and personnel guy have to do better in free agency about getting us a starting caliber RT and a better backup on the other side.

Second there is no value EVER in taking a RG at the top of the first round. EVER. its like taking a punter or PK there. Dumb.



I would take Richardson or Alshon Jeffrey over any RG at #8 or whereever we're picking which might be a little higher if Losman goes another start or two. i'd take the best safety prospect or TE prospect over a RG or RT. You're going to get a better player who can have a bigger impact for the team

Here's my main point- Miami has spent time and money on their o-line at the expense of drafting real playmakers. To me, Sparano's biggest failure is his inability to mold a great OL with all the high picks and fa money he's been given. its time to change the way Miami thinks and drafts.

My biggest proof for you is that NE, the Saints and the really good teams wouldn't take 4 OL as high as we have and they're certainly not taking a RG or RT in the top 10 of any draft.

It's amusing to read your posts while noting that you refer to my opinions as "dumb". I would define "dumb", or perhaps truly stupid, as hypothetically drafting any TE available in this draft over David DeCastro. Regardless of what Ireland/Sparano intended, the OL needs help, big time- the right side is a mess. If you want to grab any playmaker you can find at #s 8-12 as opposed to taking far closer to a sure thing at a need position on offense, have at it. If we end up at #6 as I guess we are standing now after the loss, I'm looking hard at Blackmon and Claiborne, I don't see passing either up although both will probably be gone at that point. If they're gone when we pick, in my opinion value is going to be hard to find, especially at an offensive playmaker position.

I have my doubts that Weeden will be available by our pick in the 2nd round- that's problematic. But in this hypothetical situation, if we end up picking say #8-12, I'm looking really hard at David DeCastro or better yet trading down and picking up Weeden later in the 1st. To force a pick on a playmaker high in the 1st when that player doesn't really justify the premium selection- that, in my opinion, transcends dumb and enters into the land of stupid, and is what the lesser teams and personnel departments would do. And taking any TE in this draft over DeCastro- that selection should come with a complimentary dunce cap, or at least one of those beanies with the propeller on top.

 

[Generic Name]

Jim-

I'm calling the Dolphins stupid for their O-line first, second and last mentality that has cost us playmakers like Jimmy Graham and Matt Ryan for years.
It is truly stone age and moronic in its simplicity and its refusal to look at how good teams build their rosters vs what we've done. so yeah, taking DeCastro would be stupid at #8. flat out stupid. stone cold stupid.

Unfortunately I read the same thing over and over here every offseason. "we need to fix the o-line." Its a mantra that sounds like it should be coming from mental patients No right guard is ever picked top 10 except in here where it is deemed a great idea.

The right side of our line is not the biggest problem on the roster. fixing it wouldn't have the biggest impact. Go with Jerry and a FA.

F DeCastro, to take him in any situation in round 1 would be stupid, the highest rated TE would be a better pick

 

[jim1]

Jim-

I'm calling the Dolphins stupid for their O-line first, second and last mentality that has cost us playmakers like Jimmy Graham and Matt Ryan for years.
It is truly stone age and moronic in its simplicity and its refusal to look at how good teams build their rosters vs what we've done. so yeah, taking DeCastro would be stupid at #8. flat out stupid. stone cold stupid.

Unfortunately I read the same thing over and over here every offseason. "we need to fix the o-line." Its a mantra that sounds like it should be coming from mental patients No right guard is ever picked top 10 except in here where it is deemed a great idea.

The right side of our line is not the biggest problem on the roster. fixing it wouldn't have the biggest impact. Go with Jerry and a FA.

F DeCastro, to take him in any situation in round 1 would be stupid, the highest rated TE would be a better pick

Whatever dude. That last sentence, again, lets me know what I'm dealing with in responding to you. Jerry and a FA- good luck with that. FA allows a team more of a luxury in terms of picking and choosing, playmakers included. If DeCastro wasn't by all accounts one of the best Guards to come out in years, if there's a playmaker worthy of our selection that wouldn't be a reach- I'd be on board, who wouldn't? If Christian Ponder were available next draft at our selection I'd be all over it. But he's not, and our slot is probably gong to be a difficult one. So if your preference would be to reach on a playmaker and risk the chance that he's a bust or underachiever, with dual opportunity costs of both money being tied into him and not choosing a higher rated player at a need position, well then have at it. And if you want to enter the land of the galactically stupid, go ahead and draft a TE over David DeCastro- there's not a TE available who would be even remotely worth that selection.

 

[Generic Name]

you like to pick and choose what you respond to but which team is galactically stupid enough to draft a RG with a top 10 pick??

Is he John Hannah and have the rules of the game changed back to the pre-1980's rules?

how have the Saints, Pats, Steelers and Pack built their rosters? with 4 first round OL??? Please have the guts to answer that one or tell me it isn't relevant because I have a feeling I'm dealing with a guy who can't really change his warped idea of what best player available means because he's so caught up in the idea that "it all starts up front"

The rating process has just begun, oh draft genius, there might be a TE or FS or pass rusher close to DeCastro's rating before next April. I pray the Fins aren't as prehistoric in their thinking as you are.

 

[jim1]

you like to pick and choose what you respond to but which team is galactically stupid enough to draft a RG with a top 10 pick??

Is he John Hannah and have the rules of the game changed back to the pre-1980's rules?

how have the Saints, Pats, Steelers and Pack built their rosters? with 4 first round OL??? Please have the guts to answer that one or tell me it isn't relevant because I have a feeling I'm dealing with a guy who can't really change his warped idea of what best player available means because he's so caught up in the idea that "it all starts up front"

The rating process has just begun, oh draft genius, there might be a TE or FS or pass rusher close to DeCastro's rating before next April. I pray the Fins aren't as prehistoric in their thinking as you are.

Well, the Saints, Packers, Steelers and Patriots haven't had many top 10 picks of late that I can recall, and the last Guard that I can recall taken top 10 was Leonard Davis. THe question isn't if you'd rather take a playmaker with a premium 1st round pick, the question is what do you do in a weak year for playmakers, as this year seems to be. Of course the Dolphins would prefer a stud playmaker in the 1st rd with this high of a pick, given their needs. The question is, in this draft, what do you do when the truly quality playmakers will be gone by your pick, because there's a good chance that's what the Fins will be looking at in the 1st round. DeCastro is by all accounts one of the best Guards to come out in years. If he wasn't iI'd never bring him up in this context in the first place. Again, if you'd rather force a selection on a playmaker, have at it. Good luck on that high first round pick this year on a TE. Brilliant stuff.

 

[nate52]

Well, the Saints, Packers, Steelers and Patriots haven't had many top 10 picks of late that I can recall, and the last Guard that I can recall taken top 10 was Leonard Davis. THe question isn't if you'd rather take a playmaker with a premium 1st round pick, the question is what do you do in a weak year for playmakers, as this year seems to be. Of course the Dolphins would prefer a stud playmaker in the 1st rd with this high of a pick, given their needs. The question is, in this draft, what do you do when the truly quality playmakers will be gone by your pick, because there's a good chance that's what the Fins will be looking at in the 1st round. DeCastro is by all accounts one of the best Guards to come out in years. If he wasn't iI'd never bring him up in this context in the first place. Again, if you'd rather force a selection on a playmaker, have at it. Good luck on that high first round pick this year on a TE. Brilliant stuff.

I believe Davis was drafted as a tackle and shifted to guard later in his career with Dallas.

 

[PSU Cane]

you like to pick and choose what you respond to but which team is galactically stupid enough to draft a RG with a top 10 pick??

Is he John Hannah and have the rules of the game changed back to the pre-1980's rules?

how have the Saints, Pats, Steelers and Pack built their rosters? with 4 first round OL??? Please have the guts to answer that one or tell me it isn't relevant because I have a feeling I'm dealing with a guy who can't really change his warped idea of what best player available means because he's so caught up in the idea that "it all starts up front"

The rating process has just begun, oh draft genius, there might be a TE or FS or pass rusher close to DeCastro's rating before next April. I pray the Fins aren't as prehistoric in their thinking as you are.

Actually, the Pats have 2 x 1st round lineman (Solder and Mankins) starting along with 1 x 2nd round pick (Light).

The Packers have 2 x 1st round lineman (Sherrod and Buluaga) and 1 x 2nd round pick (Clifton).

The Steeler's have 1 x 1st (Pouncey), 1 x 2nd (Gilbert) and 1 x 3rd (Starks) starting on the oline.

I get your point b/c you can find good lineman in free agency, late in drafts, or even undrafted....but the key is drafting lineman that YOU have rated highy and at a position of need, especially if they are the BPA at that time. Playmakers at WR, RB, TE, DE, OLB and CB seem to be harder to find so you don't want to pass them up if a highly rated guy is there for you....but those guys bust too. And quite honestly, many games are won/lost upfront with the OLine/DLine....unless you have a freakish QB like Rodgers/Brady/Manning. I'm never against drafting a lineman if i think he is a stud. I think DeCastro is a STUD and i'd gladly take him in the late teens and 20's this year, but not in the top 12 where Miami will be picking....but i might look at a guy like Martin or Reiff if they are the BPA (they could start at RT and offer insurance if Long gets hurt at LT). I completely disagree with not picking a lineman until round 3 or 4....it's obvious we need help at that position and might not get a Day 1 starter that low in the draft.

 

[Generic Name]

Actually, the Pats have 2 x 1st round lineman (Solder and Mankins) starting along with 1 x 2nd round pick (Light).

The Packers have 2 x 1st round lineman (Sherrod and Buluaga) and 1 x 2nd round pick (Clifton).

The Steeler's have 1 x 1st (Pouncey), 1 x 2nd (Gilbert) and 1 x 3rd (Starks) starting on the oline.

I get your point b/c you can find good lineman in free agency, late in drafts, or even undrafted....but the key is drafting lineman that YOU have rated highy and at a position of need, especially if they are the BPA at that time. Playmakers at WR, RB, TE, DE, OLB and CB seem to be harder to find so you don't want to pass them up if a highly rated guy is there for you....but those guys bust too. And quite honestly, many games are won/lost upfront with the OLine/DLine....unless you have a freakish QB like Rodgers/Brady/Manning. I'm never against drafting a lineman if i think he is a stud. I think DeCastro is a STUD and i'd gladly take him in the late teens and 20's this year, but not in the top 12 where Miami will be picking....but i might look at a guy like Martin or Reiff if they are the BPA (they could start at RT and offer insurance if Long gets hurt at LT). I completely disagree with not picking a lineman until round 3 or 4....it's obvious we need help at that position and might not get a Day 1 starter that low in the draft.

The Pats and Pack have picked OL at the bottom of round 1 because they could afford to. we can not. They have maybe 2 guys taken in round 1 on their OL, if we were to go DeCastro or Martin or Reiff in round 1 that would be 4 guys on one unit with first round pedigree.

that's way too much on a team with few playmakers



what really galls me about the Parcells/Sparano mentality is that they'll tell you they liked Jimmy Graham but not ahead of a right guard named John Jerry, You almost get the feeling they'd make the same pick all over again because it fits their philosophy.

it's a outdated philosophy that might have worked in the 80's but doesn't work now. We've had a series of administrations from Wannstedt to the current dopes who've passed on Drew Brees (twice) Jimmy Graham, Connor Barwin, and a whole host of better players because they weren't offensive linemen or didn't fit their outdated draft criteria.

when do we get a TE who can threaten defenses like the Pats, Pack and Saints have? Or a QB who can make plays when things break down?

The O-line first philosophy has hurt this team and its time to get a HC and unit coach who can do better w.o three or four first round picks up front

 

[Generic Name]

Well, the Saints, Packers, Steelers and Patriots haven't had many top 10 picks of late that I can recall, and the last Guard that I can recall taken top 10 was Leonard Davis. THe question isn't if you'd rather take a playmaker with a premium 1st round pick, the question is what do you do in a weak year for playmakers, as this year seems to be. Of course the Dolphins would prefer a stud playmaker in the 1st rd with this high of a pick, given their needs. The question is, in this draft, what do you do when the truly quality playmakers will be gone by your pick, because there's a good chance that's what the Fins will be looking at in the 1st round. DeCastro is by all accounts one of the best Guards to come out in years. If he wasn't iI'd never bring him up in this context in the first place. Again, if you'd rather force a selection on a playmaker, have at it. Good luck on that high first round pick this year on a TE. Brilliant stuff.

You know what's brilliant, Jimmy? Doing the same thing over and over again and expecting a different result. So go ahead and draft DeCastro at #8 and see what it gets you.

Also brilliant is telling us in December that all the playmakers will likely be gone when we pick. Genius stuff.

You're a really smart guy, Jimmy. No wonder you advocate taking guards with the #8 overall selection. That's brilliant. DeCastro will catch tons of TD's and get lots of sacks, And to think, we all thought he was a right guard.